Sirloin Steak

[chessfou]

It must mean something when the UK's favourite dish is Chicken Tikka Massala.

This is not an Indian dish. Legend has it that a Bangladeshi chef made it up when a British customer demanded gravy with his chicken tikka.

A very large percentage of the 'Indian' restaurants in the UK in the 1970s and 1980s were opened and run by Bangladeshi peasants with no expertise in cooking.

cf The Guardian

http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/2001/apr/19/netnotes.sarahleft

I remember only too well how poor most English/British cuisine was in the 1960s, 1970s and 1980s (aside glorious examples such as Le Gavroche). Since then it improved steadily - thanks to Indian, Chinese, Thai, Italian, Spanish, French ... influences.

On the other hand, the legend that French cuisine was only born after the arrival of Florentine cooks with Catherine de Medici in the mid 16C is knocked on the head by a quick glance back to Guillaume Tirel (a.k.a. Taillevent, hence the name of the famous restaurant in Paris) in the mid 14C.

[Scooby]

[quote user="Catalpa"]

And I think that's why I'm finding French cooking a bit dull and predictable.

[/quote]

I have to say Catalpa I agree completely.  We rarely eat out in France now because we find the food repetitive and very overpriced when compared to the UK.  I also agree with the point about french beef....we've now bought a slow cooker so we don't have to eat the boot leather steaks!

[Bob T]

Getting back to the original topic..... When I lived in the UK I used to soak my steak in natural yoghurt for 20 minutes before cooking. Wipe down with a paper towel and slap it in the pan. Fantastic result, even for the cheaper cuts of beef.

Now that I have been here for 5 years, I would not bother with a beef steak when I can have a nice bit of duck magret. Duck is much more satisfying for me.

[Catalpa]

[quote user="Frenchie"]

Oh no,[:P] it is most of the time not adding an exotic touch to a pre existing British dish, but rather ADOPTING a foreign recipe ( I think of most Indian food, etc...[/quote]

Did you hear a shrill whistling noise as my point passed over your head. [kiss] I'm beginning to conclude that you are one of the French people with whom I've unsuccessfully tried to discuss food, Frenchie. [6] Full of stereotypical ideas... [quote user="Frenchie"]Not hot enough to ruin all the taste?? [/quote][Www]

Taking ideas from other cuisines and using them in the UK isn't adding an exotic touch to a pre existing British dish but is often intended to create something new, or at least a taking an established dish a step on from what it was. To make something well known fresh again. It is taking something good and interesting from elsewhere and seeing how it can be used in a different situation. It isn't ADOPTING a foreign recipe (although, I think you may have meant ADAPTING) it is being a bit innovative, hopefully a bit surprising.

I admit if I was eating at Pierre Gagnaire's a couple of times a month I might have a different opinion about French food. But that is not the level of cooking we're discussing here - even if his ideas do filter down... possibly more readily elsewhere than in rural France. [:P]

[Frenchie]

I live in town...

I know my English may be broken, but I really meant adopting, because, whatever you say, most of the time, what can be found in the UK  is foreign food , not a slight touch of exoticism added to British food, .. I'm sorry if I touch your patriotic soul , but I mean it, and even other British people agree on that.

To me, UK food is excellent traditional food you can still find in country pubs.

For instance, I had the best steak pie ever up north, close to  the lake district .

I adore trifles, a lovely sunday roast, scones, suasages, etc.. THAT IS British food to me.

But I'm sorry, the millions of restaurants that serve Chicken Korma, chinese fried noodles and sushi or samosa... You can't say this is UK food with a touch of exoticism.

I adore exotic food. By the way, I am well known among my friends for being a good cook, ( family tradition)

I love the UK, I ve lived there, and have a real interest in the country, its culturre,its history...

If you have humour, yes, it passed over my head, or ... not? 

 

[Catalpa]

[quote user="Frenchie"]For instance, I had the best steak pie ever up north, close to  the lake district .

I adore trifles, a lovely sunday roast, scones, suasages, etc.. THAT IS British food to me. [/quote]

That is stereotypically traditional British food but that isn't what I'm talking about and indeed, though when done well it is good, a diet of roasts, sausages, trifles, scones is dull and predictable too. Not to say a tad on the unhealthy side.

[quote user="Frenchie"]But I'm sorry, the millions of restaurants that serve Chicken Korma, chinese fried noodles and sushi or samosa... You can't say this is UK food with a touch of exoticism.[/quote]

<sound of forehead hitting keyboard in despair> No, I would not and have not. Though touches of those cuisines may influence more traditional ideas. And that open-ness to influence and innovation is what I'm talking about.

But as you continue to miss the point, I think I'll leave you to your trifle and scones and wish you bon appétit!... not to mention... on egin! guten appetit! buon appetito! buen appetito! bon apetis! bom apetite! [:P]

 

[Frenchie]

N'importe quoi.........

Creative cuisine, OK, to a certain extent, whether in France or the UK, but same thing, this is not what you get in people's homes or even in average restos..

ANd NO, I didn't miss yur point.

If you want the last word, yeahhhhh have it, [:)] and I'll go cook my tian de légumes d été  .

[Catalpa]

[quote user="Frenchie"]...this is not what you get in people's homes or even in average restos..[/quote]

Now that is my point... because from my experience over the past (say) 10 years that is what I'm getting from (non-French) restaurants and in people's homes...

It's not a question of being patriotic - though it may be for you -

it's a question of compare, contrast and analysis. I don't desperately

want British food to be better - I live in France, I'm staying in

France, I'd be delighted if French food was running rings around the

rest of the world... but I don't think it is any more.

And now I'm handing the thread back to Bob T et al... while pondering a nice (pink in the middle) magret for supper...[8-|]

[Chancer]

Catalpa

I am struggling to recognise this English cuisine with borrowed influences adding a different dimension to often well known British dishes.

If the traditional dishes which in my view we should be proud of are boring and stereotypically traditional what does exactly does English cuisine  have to be proud of? Bangladeshi imigrants reinventing themselves as Indian restauranters and creating chicken tikka masala for the deadened taste buds of the after pub trade?

How many English people actually know of any of their regional specialities let alone be proud of them, carry on the tradition etc? The shopping trolleys at any supermarket will tell you hardly any, if I hadnt done a traditional british cookery course when I was young then I would not know of the existence of Sussex pond pudding to name but one. Whenever I have cooked this or other regional dishes for friends in Sussex no-one has ever heard of it.

Contrast that to the number one question that I am asked by French people, "what is your regional speciality", or  "what are the regional specialities in England) I am always ashamed of my ignorance to answer the second one.

My French friends are proud of their own regional specialities and love nothing better to debate at length the taste of all the other regional fare, en bref they are proud of their countries cuisine, with reason I say,  in a way that I have never experienced in any other country especially England.

[Clair]

[quote user="Nell"][quote user="Clair"]How to Turn Cheap “Choice” Steak into Gucci “Prime” Steak[/quote]Have you tried this Clair ???

[/quote]

We grilled a massive (1" thick and over 1lb!) faux-filet steak on the BBQ today.

It was superb meat, marbled, juicy and meltingly tender!

I did not try the salt-coating method (it did cost of lot of €€), but I did salt it before grilling... Miam miam

[Frenchie]

Oh right !! So that was that delicious smell we could smell from here !! [;-)]

[Clair]

We just had to test the new Weber BBQ! (as seen at the back of this picture)!

Just to make sure I've got it right, I'll have to try again tomorrow with the other big faux-filet! [:D][:D]

[Scooby]

J.R's gone native said: "I am struggling to recognise this English cuisine with borrowed influences adding a different dimension to often well known British dishes".

I think I know what Catalpa is talking about.  Traditionally (i.e. when I was a child) we would have had a lamb / beef casserole, roast or similar.  Now we have things like slow cooked venison with bitter chocolate, lamb shank braised in red currant sauce, chicken braised with pumpkin, wild mushrooms and cream.  (And, yes, we eat these at home.) These are not 'traditional british dishes' nor are they obviously french, italian whatever.  The UK simply has a much better range of produce available now which has been influenced, to a large extent, by the cultural mix of its population. The media has also elevated food (both cooking and eating) to a serious pass time / hobby rather than the functional mundane topic it was in our parents and grandparents era. 

[Frenchie]

Now you give me ideas , [:D]

Tomorrow, entrecote grillée... avec ratatouille maison ..

[Www]

[Clair]

[quote user="Frenchie"]Tomorrow, entrecote grillée... avec ratatouille maison ..[Www][/quote]

We had it salade de haricots verts, made with lots of échalotes in the vinaigrette and pommes de terre sautées!

[Danny]

for lunch today, we had haricots blanches à la sauce tomate type ECO+ from that well known épicier M Leclerc with pain lotois to accompany.

Class...

Danny [:P]

[Frenchie]

[quote user="Clair"][quote user="Frenchie"]Tomorrow, entrecote grillée... avec ratatouille maison ..[Www][/quote]
We had it salade de haricots verts, made with lots of échalotes in the vinaigrette and pommes de terre sautées!
[/quote]

Oh I love salade de haricots verts with échalottes, perfect with PDT sautées !!

Miam Miam [;-)]

 

[Frenchie]

[quote user="Jane and Danny"]

for lunch today, we had haricots blanches à la sauce tomate type ECO+ from that well known épicier M Leclerc with pain lotois to accompany.

Class...

Danny [:P]

[/quote]

Mayeb not class but good I bet.. If you enjoyed it, good !!

[chessfou]

I think that changes in cuisine in the UK reflect changes in education, but about a generation behind.

In my day, only about 2.5% of the population went to University and maybe 0.1% of the UK population had any idea of good food.

Today roughly 50% of the UK population (age group) goes to University and perhaps 2-3% of the population has some idea of what good food is like.

I wonder what % of the population of Glasgow or of Birmingham have ever tasted something like chicken braised with pumpkin. I am absolutely certain that it is infinitesimal in comparison with the % of Aveyron peasants who have had some decent foie gras or who could discourse on the relative merits of the varios producers of Roquefort.

In France I am convinced that (at least outside the big cities) an absolute minimum of 50% (probably more like 90%) have a good idea of what good food is like (even if they can't always afford to put it on their table).

[Scooby]

Agreed chessfou - but the fact is that the UK has progressed whereas France has stayed still (or given the recent McD surveys - gone backwards)

[Frenchie]

Naaaa ..

Ou va t'on ? La cuisine francaise ne manque pas de créativité, il y a bcp de petis chefs trés inventifs mais peut être moins médiatiques.

And French cuisine evolves , but is not ready to abandon its secular tradition of superb food...

Personally I'm not too keen on " nouvelle cuisine" , to my stubborn French mentality it is too often a snobbish mixture of things that do not go  together well .. 

But that"'s only me . [:$]

[Scooby]

Chocolate was cooked with meat by the mayans and incas...hardly nouvelle cuisine.  I agree frenchie, there are some wonderful innovative french chefs but, equally, there are a lot of french restos that produce very predictable, boring food.  Confit, sauteed potatoes and green beans are ok the first time - but they are the mainstay of every menu near us.  Sorry frenchie but a lot of french food is over-rated and over priced.

[Frenchie]

I agree with Chessfou when he writes

"  In France I am convinced that (at least outside the big cities) an absolute minimum of 50% (probably more like 90%) have a good idea of what good food is like (even if they can't always afford to put it on their table).
"

It is not being patriotc, t is really what I 'm sure of.

As for chocolate with meat, yes, I am franchouillarde, stubborn, I 'm wearing blinkers, I'm dumb, etc;;  [:)] but it is a BIG NO - NO from me. [+o(]

Leave me the confit and I'll leave you the leg of lamb au chocolat... [:P][:D][:P] 

 

[buelligan]

Would it be provocative of me to assert that most of the best home cooked food I have eaten in France was cooked by a Dutch person?  Oddly enough, I was invited to eat there last night and we were all discussing the idea that French food is superior to that of other nations.  The people around the table came from a good selection of european countries (including France of course).  All of us could remember truly delicious meals cooked in France, but all of us agreed that, in general, French food is not superior to that of other countries.  Actually, I think I find the idea that any country's food, design, music, art etc is somehow "better" than that of another slightly offensive....hope I didn't offend anyone there....[:D]

[Frenchie]

One of the best meals I ve ever had, ( apart from my gran and mum's tables ..) ; was in the Marais Poitevin. A small restaurant owned by a couple of young people , the man is the chef. His cuisine is absolutely superb  , based on tradition, but  a tad creative. ( just a bit, the way I like..)

We took Norwegian friends there, they said it was awesome.

I ve had excellent meals in the UK, as I said before, in Italy, In Tunsia, etc.. I never said one could only eat well in France !!

What I think is untrue is that  French food is bland and predictable, tasteless.

Even  simple food made with good ingredients and a " tour de main" can be awesome.[;-)]