The French authorities' attitude to death

[val douest]

In several postings recently the point has been made that when a person dies in France, the cause of death is not stated on the death certificate and that the main concern of the powers-that-be is that there is no suspicion of suicide. In the UK there seems to be more interest in whether a death is suspicious, in other words if the deceased died at someone else's hand rather than their own.

This made me think - what happens in France if there is any suspicion of suicide?  Is there an inquest, or an autosy or both?  If suicide is established as the cause of death can there be a normal church burial service and commital (remembering that in former days - maybe still - the Catholic church refused to allow suicides  to be buried in hallowed ground).

Some years ago an elderly chap in our village was found drowned in a lake.  He was known to be suffering from mild dementia and opinion was divided as to whether he had taken his own life or just become confused.  I don't know what the outcome was, who would have decided it and what the consequences would have been.  Just curious as to how the system works…

Val

[Clair]

There are several causes of death to be considered by the doctor who completes the death certificate:

a natural death: anticipated, medically explained

a violent death: accidental, third-party involvement, suicide, crime

a suspicious death

The first causes no delay or obstacle.

The other two will entail a forensic delay: the Procureur is notified and decides whether or not an autopsy is required. After looking over all the elements, the Procureur delivers the burial permit.

As far as the catholic church is concerned, things have moved on and with the growing knowledge of depressive illness, it accepts there are many elements which can diminish the responsibility of the person who chooses to take his/her own life.

The church allows its priests to decide what the best in each case, after consultation with the relatives of the

deceased. Usually, suicide per se is not be mentioned.

[NormanH]

I have never been able to explain to French friends what a Coroner is.

I don't think it is  a Médicin légiste who I take to be a forensic pathologist.

There doesn't seem to be a specific legal function which corresponds.

If Clair or one of the other natives could enlighten me I would be grateful.

[Clair]

A médecin légiste deals with causes of death, but also assesses the after-effects of traumatic accidents, assault, rape, sexual abuse...

A coroner has no direct equivalent in France.

In a case of suicide, a procureur is the nearest equivalent , though his/her role extends well beyond that of a coroner.

[YCCMB]

I wonder if the circumstances of a suicide also play a role in the extent to which further investigation is considered necessary?

The elderly lady who lived in a house just behind ours lost her husband about 2 years ago and, within 6 months, had committed suicide. The circumstances were that, sadly, she got up one morning, dressed, arranged all her paperwork on the table and then lay down on the bed and took a massive overdose of her prescription medication.

Her funeral took place well within the week, and, when I expressed some surprise that this should have happened so fast, my neighbour said "Well, what was there to wait for? It was obviously suicide". The speed with which things progressed seems to suggest that the authorities took pretty much the same view, I would think.

[Val_2]

I had to get the doctor who was in charge of my late husband to sign an attestation to say whether his death was natural causes or not to satisfy the banks and other bodies. NO cause is ever given on paper.

[Clair]

Whilst it's true that the cause of death is not given on the death certificate issued to the mairie and funeral home, it is mentioned in the section sent to the DDASS and INSERM.

The info is anonymous and used for statistics and prevention, and is shared with the OMS/WHO (Organisation Mondiale de la Santé / World Health Organization).

[Clarkkent]

[quote user="NormanH"]I have never been able to explain to French friends what a Coroner is.


[/quote]

A coroner is a judge who is specifically charged with the task of investigating any death whose circumstances may be suspicious. Perhaps a coroner could be seen as a particular kind of examining magistrate. A coroner may be either a lawyer or a clinician.

Coroners' courts are the only English courts which follow the French inquisitorial principles - as opposed to the English accusatorial procedures. The decision of a Coroner is also provisional and an inquest can be re-opened at any time (as may well be the case in the Hillsborough deaths).

 

Edit

Coroners are also responsible for investigating treasure trove.