picking up the language

[Meo]

I do not have children but am intrigued about the way parents describe their progress in picking up french once they start school.

I have learnt french solidly from the age of 8 and only at the age of 20 did i begin to achieve any degree of fluency, so it was a long hard slog!

how long did it take for your kids to pick french up? when did you first notice their progress? do they have anglicised accents? does their knowledge of french interfere with their English?

 

 

[opas]

When we arrived in France to live, Mr O and myself had been studying French and thought we were pretty good. We have 2 children then aged 5 and 10, who had the very basics, counting, colours, greetings and everyday objects(cars,house ,flowers)

I would say that within 2 months of living here and them attending local school,with no other English communication than ourselves(only french tv) they could hold a pretty reasonable conversation. certainly by the four month mark(Christmas) we were so proud of them with their acheivments  , we decided to buy satellite so they could see something familiar.

They both have a brilliant accent and laugh at my Mancunian French even now(15 months down the line)

To prove how they have settled into French life so much we are now working very hard with the youngest(now 7) to help her read and write English...she had done reception year in UK and was classed as a bright child.

[Teamedup]

Funny old thing this. Fluency is not always quite as it seems.

 As it happens I have english friends with youngish children, both kids born here. The parents speak good french and have been here for years, but only speak english with their kids and now they find that they are getting comments about their childrens lack of vocabulary at school. And yet, these kids speak french well and sans accent and to all the world are fluent, only school doesn't quite see it like that. Boy does this bring back memories of certain comments we had to endure too.

 

[Ormx]

A very good question I think, although I suppose all depends on the age and the child's personality etc.

We've been here for 4 months and our 4 year old has been in maternelle for 2 months. Her dad is French and has spoken to her all her life in French but she always replied in English as we lived in Dublin and everyone around her spoke English. Now she's struggling in school and, although she understands 90% of what goes on, she's afraid to speak and only replies yes or no when asked a direct question. In the last few weeks I think she has spoken a little more and I expect after a few more months she may have the courage to speak. (A few weeks ago I first heard her hold a full conversation in French with her teddy so I know she can!)

I believe fluency will come esp. with a French parent and hope with my influence her English remains fluent. What I do worry about is that her personality has changed due to the move and that she has assumed the role of the quiet foreigner who observes and doesn't participate - she may become that quiet girl, even moreso than before. Ah well, I don't think I can do anything about that except encourage her.

Our 2 year old has no qualms about saying things in French and tells me she didn't do painting in school but "peinture". She'll be fluent even quicker. And as for the 6 week old baby... he'll be scratching his head trying to understand the English-speaking relatives no doubt!

[opas]

I know our girls are not fluent, that takes years of learning , I wouldn`t say I was fluent in English even though I was brought up with the lingo, I still occasionally look up a word that I am not sure of the meaning of.

What I have found with our youngest is that she will describe something in french that she has done that day,and can`t find the word in English to translate it !

All I can say is that I wish I had been given the chance to learn a second language so young, first year of senior school is far too late in my opinion.

[Teamedup]

Opas, lots of other countries only start teaching foreign languages at that age too. When one considers how good some countries are at teaching english to older kids, it makes me wonder how they do it so well.

[The Riff-Raff Element]

[quote]Opas, lots of other countries only start teaching foreign languages at that age too. When one considers how good some countries are at teaching english to older kids, it makes me wonder how they do it...[/quote]

Bluntly, the achieve good results in teaching English by taking language teaching very seriously, at least this has been my experience. I was taught French at school very half heartedly; the subject simply wasn't considered important. At most I received two hours tuition per week and this was concerned solely with passing exams and not actually with being able to speak the language in a non-artificial environment outside the classroom. I can only comment on the teaching of English in one town in the Netherlands and in Moscow, but the amount of time spent on English was between two and three times more than I received in French (a staggering proportion of the total time spent in class). Plus the students hear English in the world around them - pop music, subtitled English films commonly shown on TV, etc - how many French language films are subtitled and shown on British TV?

[le val charente]

Had to reply when I saw the post by Ormx, as it all sounds so familiar!  My daughter (just turned 5) was a real chatterbox and considered very bright in England but found it really difficult when we arrived 7 months ago.  I had to collect her at midday each day from Easter to the end of term, then she had 2 months to forget anything she had learned!  Her personality really changed and she became "shy" though we knew the truth!

This term has been a lot better as she is starting to come out of her shell, and she and her younger brother play together using French words and her teacher commented recently that she now understands a lot; her brother (aged 3.5) chatters in class using Franglais.

[Ormx]

Le Val Charente, it's awful to watch them isn't it? Good to hear that you're little one is getting on better this term. Funny thing too about being so quiet in school, is that mine comes home each evening and can't stop talking (in English mostly, but a few phrases in French she's heard thrown in) - just letting it all out of her system I suppose

[LesLauriers]

Val & Ormx,

When we moved over our then four year old daughter didn't say much at all really for the first year. It was very sad to see her wandering around the playground, mostly alone, as she had been so 'popular' with loads of friends back in the UK at nursery and the one term in reception class. But it's a very different story, now in our third year. She has loads of friends from all year groups at her school (up to 11) and she is once again very popular and is always charging around with a group pals. She also spends the entire day at some local stables with some school friends, her newly found passion for les chevaux. Her language really came out at the beginning of the second year and now there's no stopping her. Last week I had to ask her to speak in English more at home because she will speak about 80% french & I am beginning to worry about her losing her ability to speak english - she already is making mistakes.

Our son was 8 when we moved and he very quickly picked up the language. We are told that he has no engish accent speaking french, he speaks with a local accent. His school reports for the past couple of years has seen his 'notes' (grades) about 3 points ahead of his french classmates in french!!

They have both settled in so well, especially with the language, we couldn't have wished for better. I hope that gives you both some piece of mind that they should pick up the language, even if it is like my daughter, one year on from arriving here.

 

[le val charente]

Also I forgot to add, a lady who teaches English to older kids here assured me in April, that she would be "fluent by Xmas, I promise".... and yes she really does let off steam after school as well, when they are both always starving hungry too!!!

[Mistral]

My kids were all born here, so French has never been a problem (their English is not so good).

They went to a maternelle next to a asylum seekers' centre so there are children from various countries, most speaking no French. There are no extra French lessons in the maternelle. The teachers tell me that if children start in September: by christmas, they are understanding; by Easter, they are communicating; by the summer, they can't be told apart from the French speakers.  It's a wierd sight, 4 year olds translating to their parents for their teachers "dis à maman que....."

The children who start in the primary section of the same school(where there are extra French lessons) seem to take a little longer and the older they are, the more likely they are to keep their accent. At the moment, I've got 2 chechens in class who have only been here a year (11 year olds) they understand most spoken French, but have trouble with written, one is still hesitantwhen he has to speak French. There's also an Albanian, who has been here 4 years (also 11, but in another class) he speaks just as good French as the others in the class, but still has an accent.

[Ormx]

Sometimes I wonder if I worry for nothing - today 4 year old comes home from school in floods of tears and I imagine the worst - bullied, left out, unable to communicate, etc. etc. Turns out she wanted to stay for the gouter after school... so we've promised to let her stay later at least once a week... Maybe she's better settled than I thought!