Micro Bic

[Jazz]

I am looking to set up a Micro Bic.  I have searched the forum and read most of the posts relating to this.  I do have a couple of questions though.

1) The figure for 27000 Euros that is mentioned, is that turnover or profit (since there is a 38% fixed deduction made under this regime, so could turnover be as high as 37260?)

2) How are social contributions calculated under this regime?  I take it that the figure they use for the calculation is the profit and not the turnover.  e.g. Turnover 37260 profit after fixed deduction 27000

[Nick Trollope]

If you are providing services only (ie. no supplies), then the turnover is limited to 27.000€ and contributions are based on a notional profit (decided by statute) for the 1st 2 years. The 38% is deducted for expenses from your 27K€, although it makes no difference in year 1. If you are supplying something as well, then your t/o is limited to 78.000€ (I think) and the deductions are set at 72% (I think!).

Contributions are calculated on the notional profit figure and amount to about 3.500€ in the first year, although the rules are changing and you can avoid/defer some cotistations.

Ask an accountant!

 

[Iceni]

The % fixed deduction varies according to the trade/profession being carried out.

John

not

[Will]

Even if you think a micro regime will save you money, I would still advise you to contact an accountant. The normal accounting regime could well prove the best, as it could enable you to offset true costs and expenses rather than a notional percentage, and you may be able to reclaim TVA. Our experience is that accountants fees are more than offset by the savings they can make. Unless you have the simplest of affairs, I would not advise anybody to tackle French tax and cotisations (which are potentailly far more complicated) themselves.

[clarksinfrance]

As a micro, the headline figure is €27,000. This is turnover not profit!! Most micros get the person employing them to buy the materials, and then just charge the labour. This means your turnover of €27,000 is effectively your profit.

Different jobs mean different levels of cotisations, I have heard the least is 28% and the most 52% of turnover paid out in cotisations. As of next year, I believe the turnover figure is to rise to €35,000 and that Mr Sarkozy is to limit the maximum payable in cotisations is to be 50%.

Good luck.

[Quillan]

At what point (amount) is it necessary to register for TVA ?

[Nick Trollope]

It depends, but at the top of the micro turnover. Although, you can register for TVA under any regime, at any turnover.

 

[Jo Taylor]

"As a micro, the headline figure is €27,000"

That's for services / professions liberales etc.

If you're a commercant, buying and selling (also includes letting properties) the ceiling is €76,300.

TVA ceilings are €30,500 for services, €84,000 for commercants - you can choose to register (there are several situations where this can be advantageous).

[Nick Trollope]

[quote user="Jo Taylor"]

but you cannot then use the MicroBIC tax regime even if your gross turnover is less than the qualifying ceilings.

[/quote]

Yes you can.

[Frank]

Hi

Just a quick question re the micro bic ceilings, I have visited to Chamber of Commerce to get advice to register the gites and return next week to complete relevant paperwork, but now I am getting confused over the commercants/ventes and service ceilings.  The chap at the Chamber of Commerce said that gites and B&B were classed as services and therefore the ceiling was 27000e, but some conflicting info on forums etc suggest that gites are commercants/ventes with the ceiling of 76000e. So now I am getting confused as to which it is, I have also had conflicting advice about the REEL option which has a minimum turnover of 26000e, whereby you cannot join this option if you are an enterprise individuelle or have less than the minimum, can anyone shed any light on all this please!! Many thanks

Jetlag

[Jo Taylor]

[quote user="Nick Trollope"][quote user="Jo Taylor"] but you cannot then use the MicroBIC tax regime even if your gross turnover is less than the qualifying ceilings.[/quote]Yes you can.[/quote]

I have edited my post above, as I can't find the source of the info - but http://vosdroits.service-public.fr/pme/F1110.xhtml does say "L'option pour le paiement de la TVA emporte exclusion du régime micro pour l'imposition des bénéfices."

[quote user="jetlag"]The chap at the Chamber of Commerce said that gites and B&B were classed as services and therefore the ceiling was 27000e, but some conflicting info on forums etc suggest that gites are commercants/ventes with the ceiling of 76000e.[/quote]

Gite letting and other forms of furnished letting (location meublée) most definitely fall under the commercant heading with the higher ceiling of €76,300. (Income from unfurnished letting is classed as revenu foncier and subject to a far lower ceiling along with many other pitfalls!) See http://vosdroits.service-public.fr/particuliers/F1995.xhtml

[quote user="jetlag"] So now I am getting confused as to which it is, I have also had conflicting advice about the REEL option which has a minimum turnover of 26000e, whereby you cannot join this option if you are an enterprise individuelle or have less than the minimum, can anyone shed any light on all this please!! .[/quote]

That does sound a bit peculiar, I don't know of a minimum turnover, nor of any requirement to be anything other than an entreprise individuelle. (If you have an SCI you cannot use the MicroBIC regime.) If your gross letting income is below €76,300, you can choose to register under the Réel system rather than Micro-BIC (see above), but it would be to your advantage only if the costs incurred on your property exceeded 68 per cent of your rental income.

[Bobbykins]

[:D]Hi Jetlag, just a question for you as your in the Charente Maritime, we are starting a B&B next year in the C M and need to go to the Chambre de Commerce in a few weeks time, do we need to go to the main one in La Rochelle. Many thanks, Bob.

[timc17]

Bobbykins,

We used the CDC in Saintes to set-up our business. They were very helpful (spoke english) and for a fee (40 euros) will complete all the forms on-line for you.

Tim