Support new Male Cancer Charity

[MrCanary]

Bit of a long shot this, because I don't suppose there is anyone on this forum within a hundred miles of Norwich, but here goes...

This is what I am currently working on...

TICKETS NOW ON SALE... BIG CHARITY CONCERT AT UEA STARRING 'HOLLOW EARTH' & 'THE HARVS'. FRIDAY 16 APRIL 2010, 7.30pm at the LCR, UEA, NORWICH...

Tickets only £10 each and all takings go to a new male cancer charity. For more info & tickets:

www.ueaticketbookings.co.uk/

or: [email protected]

(UEA = University of East Anglia)

[Swissie]

Sounds great - but for me a long way away. Hope it is a great success.

I hope that your charity is also working at looking at male attitudes and fears. So many men present too late for treatment, because they won't go to the doctor's, won't get checked - and just pretend things are not happening. How to persuade them to change this is, IMOHO, almost more important than finding new cures. What do you think?

[MrCanary]

Swissie - thanks for your good wishes...

You have hit the nail on the head and that is exactly what the charity will be for - to raise the profile of male cancers.

I had a major, but successful, operation for prostate cancer which had been detected very much at the eleventh hour. It was a miracle that I went for a check-up when I did.

In the UK, 30,000+ men are diagnosed with prostate cancer every year and 10,000 of them die. Early detection can save lots and lots of those lives.

[Quillan]

Fortunately the French health system takes it reasonably seriously. Once you pass 50 you get a free test every so often but then of course its not just men over 50 that get it.

[Swissie]

Mel so glad they got to it in time- and I am glad you agree that we need to address WHY men do not go for checks, even if they feel something is wrong - how to better communicate with them and change attitudes.

Quillan, sadly a huge proportion of men do NOT take up the tests offered, even if they are sent letters, reminders, appointments, etc. There is no point spending a fortune on medical research without spending time and energy studying the pshychological and cultural reasons which prevent men seeking advice. I know people who have been sent the bowel cancer tests, but will NOT do the test. Like I know men who want make a will. Superstition, fear? Essential to find out.

[Quillan]

In France they use a blood test for Prostate cancer, I think in the UK its called PSA blood test. They also check for Pancreatic cancer as well at the same time. Only if they find high levels of something (I don't know what it is) in the blood do they carry out a rectal examination. It does explain its a blood test on the form you get. Not being in the UK I don't know if you are asked to go and have the test(s) as a matter of course and what is involved.

I think your comments about men in particular rather sexist. The same comments could very easily be attributed to women with regards to breast and cervical cancer screening. There are lots of 'old wives tales' about cancer screening for both male and female specific cancers. Just as there are some men who don't fancy people prodding around in their rectum there are equally as many women who don't fancy people prodding around in their vagina or having their breast squashed between two plates to get an x ray (especially if you are very well endowed), it can be quite painful I am told. What I will agree with you about is ignorance amongst both sex's and I think that your comment about there being little point in spending all this money on research if you can't get people to get screened quite valid. I would suggest that they approach (in the case of this particular charity) the NHS and perhaps go half on TV adverts telling men to get screened and that its only a blood test. Likewise other charities specialising in specific cancers could do the same thing. What saddens me the most is that there really should be no need for these charities, all this research should be carried out under the NHS and funded by the government but its not. They seem too busy being reactive instead of being proactive.

I wish the OP the best of luck in their fundraising and hope they have a super evening and raise loads of money.

[Chancer]

It might be an idea to at least know the name of this new charity?

[Swissie]

Sorry Quillan, there was absolutely nothing sexist about my comment. It is a very well known fact that early pick up of serious disease is very low in men- much more so than in women. It is a very serious issue, that many are trying to understand better and address.

I don't know of any woman who relishes the thought of a mammogram or smear- but the majority DOES go. Venus and Mars- and all that - and men do die in large numbers because they won't go and won't test. To say that this should be addressed cannot be seen as sexist, surely.

[Quillan]

[quote user="Chancer"]It might be an idea to at least know the name of this new charity?[/quote]

You know I never noticed till you mentioned it, I found the event, link below.

http://www.ueaticketbookings.co.uk/events/blue-ribbon-foundation-launch-party-with-hollow-earth.aspx

I can't find the name of the charity either, surely this must be an accidental oversight by somebody and perhaps it should be sorted quickly. I mean the more sceptical males might think it a fiddle of some sort which I am sure it isn't.

[Quillan]

[quote user="Swissie"]Sorry Quillan, there was absolutely nothing sexist about my comment. It is a very well known fact that early pick up of serious disease is very low in men- much more so than in women. It is a very serious issue, that many are trying to understand better and address.

I don't know of any woman who relishes the thought of a mammogram or smear- but the majority DOES go. Venus and Mars- and all that - and men do die in large numbers because they won't go and won't test. To say that this should be addressed cannot be seen as sexist, surely.
[/quote]

Unfortunately the statistics are rather misleading in the UK primarily because there is no screening program (unlike for women for breast and cervical cancer). If men are not screened how do one know they don't turn up? It has been discussed and was supposed to be agreed and implemented by the end of last year but nothing happened which is a bit alarming since its the second biggest killer of men (lung cancer being the first).

All men over 50 could be screened for prostate cancer

[Jazzer]

I am in the process at the moment. PSA double the level it should be. Examination yesterday and ultrasound/biopsy arranged for 2 weeks time.Urologist suggested that as the information sheet was in French I should research on the internet.Read a couple of articles last night and the wording regarding impotency and incontinence were more strongly worded than in the article mentioned in Quillans posting. Also there is also mention of possible septocaemia as a result of the biopsy. Spent a very sleepless night and this morning read of someone who had actually gone through the procedure. Whilst I am still worried I think I will go through with the biopsy. For many years I have felt that men should have a test by right as do women for their cancer tests. However having read a multitude of articles on the subject I am not as convinced as I was, in that it is not as conclusive or as safe.

[Swissie]

Q. there is a screening programme for colonic cancer for all over 50, especially those with family history. Men over 50 can also request test for prostate cancer. In the UK they will re-do the test 3 times normally before doing a biopsy. I have just asked a doctor with 40+ years experience about men versus women take up of tests, but also visiting doctor when worried about changes, etc. He absolutely confirms that there is a serious problem with men ignoring symptoms and only going to consult at a late stage.

Jazzer, my thoughts are with you. Hope all works out well. Swissie xx

[brianagain]

[quote user="Jazzer"]I am in the process at the moment. PSA double the level it should be. Examination yesterday and ultrasound/biopsy arranged for 2 weeks time.Urologist suggested that as the information sheet was in French I should research on the internet.Read a couple of articles last night and the wording regarding impotency and incontinence were more strongly worded than in the article mentioned in Quillans posting. Also there is also mention of possible septocaemia as a result of the biopsy. Spent a very sleepless night and this morning read of someone who had actually gone through the procedure. Whilst I am still worried I think I will go through with the biopsy. For many years I have felt that men should have a test by right as do women for their cancer tests. However having read a multitude of articles on the subject I am not as convinced as I was, in that it is not as conclusive or as safe.[/quote]

Hopefully you will go through with the ultrasound/biopsy. The risk of infection should be alleviated by taking antibiotics just before and afterwards plus there should be a local anaesthetic (gel?) for the procedure (20/30 minutes) . I had raised PSA levels and this was followed by a couple of biopsies which confirmed cancer but at least it was caught early and, subsequently, early last year I had a brachytherapy implant which has hopefully cured the cancer. Forget about any embarassment so as to be able to put your mind to rest or at least if you do have any problems it can be treated as soon as possible. The worst thing to do is ignore the symptoms (ie raised PSA). One of my main gripes is the effect it has on the cost of travel insurance!

Bonne chance

Brian (again)

[Quillan]

[quote user="Swissie"]Q. there is a screening programme for colonic cancer for all over 50, especially those with family history. Men over 50 can also request test for prostate cancer. In the UK they will re-do the test 3 times normally before doing a biopsy. I have just asked a doctor with 40+ years experience about men versus women take up of tests, but also visiting doctor when worried about changes, etc. He absolutely confirms that there is a serious problem with men ignoring symptoms and only going to consult at a late stage.

Jazzer, my thoughts are with you. Hope all works out well. Swissie xx
[/quote]

There is a screening program for those that have a history or for those that ask, there is no general screening program in the same way as there is for women for breast and cervical cancer of a certain age which is why more men go longer before its diagnosed. (Likewise there is a family screening program for the spouse of parents that die of particular heart disease but very few, including doctors, are aware of this.) Also men can suffer from similar symptoms which are often misdiagnosed before a PSA blood test is carried out. Prostate cancer is slower than other types of cancer and quite often a man can have it without any symptoms (there is information about this on the NHS website). There have been many cases when a man has died of something else, an autopsy is carried out and during the autopsy it it is discovered he also had prostate cancer (again information on the NHS website). If you do a bit of research instead of listening to just one doctor who has one opinion you may well understand the situation better. There really is far too many variables to make the cut and dry conclusion that you have and to imply that men have a serious psychological problem with prostrate cancer testing is utterly ridiculous. Mind you if you want to believe that then it only goes to show, contrary to 'folk law', that men don't run off to the doctor at the slightest ache or pain, only women appear to do so.[;-)]

[Hoddy]

When my other half was diagnosed with prostate cancer in 2004 we both read everything that we could lay our hands on about it. I was astonished at how widespread it is and how many men leave it until it is too late to be treated. I asked the consultant why on earth there wasn't more publicity and screening and he said that he thought the answer must be a political one.

Jazzer take heart, six years later my other half's PSA is still undetectable.

Hoddy

[Swissie]

Men do die and suffer from all sorts of cancer through lack of consultation and testing take-up, not just prostate. This is a very well known fact, all over the world - and taught in all Medical schools - not just the 'hobby horse' of my doctor friend.  This is irrespective of availability of screening. I have no idea why you seem to have a problem with accepting this information. If you French google the issue, you will see that testing take up is significantly lower in men and women in France. But that does not take into account the fact that men do tend to consult much later, often too late.

Because I care about my men friends, men family members and men as human beings, that does upset me- as it is so avoidable- such a waste - I fail to see why do not wish to consider this. Perhaps you might consider discussing this with your own Doctor next time you go and see what s/he says.

PS  our posts crossed Hoddy. So happy to hear your OH is fine. PPS there is a LOT of money in pharmaceutical testing - but none in the psychology of not consulting for men- which is why I suggested Cancer Research and other c. charities should take up this challenge. Same I'd say for the psychology of not wanting to be an organ donor, for instance.

[Gardengirl]

Really good news Hoddy and Brian have posted - it's helpful to have up to date info - from friends, as it were. Jazzer, good luck as you proceed with this; be sure you're in people's thoughts. [:)]

[NormanH]

Having had both prostate and colo-rectal cancers, both treated and in the case of one apparently successfully, I can't stress enough the importance  of check-ups and early detection.

My prostate cancer was caught by my annual blood test, and treated quickly.

The colo-rectal cancer should have been detected two years earlier in a coloscopy , but the Doctor didn't check the biopsy results or forward them to my GP, so by the time I had a second coloscopy it had grown, and subsequent surgery was more difficult and may only have been partially effective.

Do not hesitate to have a check up and biopsy, but make sure the lab results are looked at.

[Jazzer]

It has been so good to read such positive comments. Far better than reading websites that may or may not be accurate. This forum is a lifeline for many of us,and itt was through this forum some 3 years ago that I decided to have the yearly PSA test,

[Quillan]

What you can do if you have annual blood tests is to have it 'added', most French doctors are very happy to do this. Likewise there is a general cancer blood test, it does not say if you have a particular cancer just that you have it somewhere. Its not difficult to do because I watched them do it for my dog at the vets. Not quite the same as a human I know but the test is the same or similar. I have an annual blood test for my heart condition and diabetes so I simply both added. I can't remember the price but its quite cheap (for humans that is[;-)]) so I am quite amazed the NHS does not do screening for all, it could save a fortune, not to mention lives, in the long term.

[Hoddy]

Jazzer it can even have its funny moments. The year after my other half was diagnosed and treated our neighbour in France found he had it too. As soon as we arrived that spring he cornered us and bombarded us with questions. My French is better than my partner's, but still not good. We were standing in the middle of a field and I was doing my best to translate when I suddenly had a vision of my very prim and proper old French 'Miss'. It ended in gales of laughter all round because my French wasn't really up to the job although I know our neighbour was reassured. He had to travel all the way to Periguex for treatment every day for 32 days and now, he too is fine.

Hoddy

[Quillan]

Taking up Swissies 'challenge' I have spent 20 minutes poking around on the internet. I seems you have more chance of surviving in France than any other country bar one, Japan. France has the second lowest mortality rate in the world, has invested a shed load of money in to the cause, treatment and research. I would recommend, should you want to know more, that you google "Prostrate cancer in France" or on the French google website "cancer prosterné". I am sure there are better search criteria for the French version but my French googling is not so good.

[Swissie]

Official French statistics

Only 42% of the population have done cancer tests offered. Take up for women is 47%, whereas it is 40% for men. Those who have tested the least are men aged 50 to 54, with only 32%. It seems the stats for the second wave show even less take up for men- but as the campaign is not over yet, these are not official.

Not a huge variation, I agree- but significant still. The main problem is, as most doctors in France or UK know so well, is that men find it extremely difficult to go to their GP and ignore symptoms for far too long. It's essential to study and understand this process so issues can be addressed, including how to put together campaigns that will encourage and reassure men into taking part. We do not want to lose our beloved men and see them suffer.

[Quillan]

Yes but France has only run the 'testing for all' program for men since the end of 2008, the UK is still talking about it and I gues the biggest problem there is cost. I don't know when it started for women in France but I know my wife had a letter within weeks of us joining the French health system for both a mammogram and cervical smear test in 2000/2001 and has received them regularily since we have been here. When I have mentioned to our friends she is off getting her tests many of the women have said they don't bother but of course that does not represent a national trend. This year (2010) there is a very big campaign organized by the French government to make men aware of these types of cancer (I notice testicle cancer is not included). The problem I have is that it is far to early to come out with any statistics especially since this major campaign has only been going for just over 2 months.

The biggest problem they face is ignorance amongst men and in particular the thought that it involves a physical examination when in fact it is nothing more than a simple blood test. I assume part of the campaign is to explain this as well as some of the early symptoms. You also need to keep in mind that many men can't even spell Prostate let alone know what it means. [;-)] So, I don't think its a simple case of men not bothering when they feel ill because as we can see from the replies here they obviously do, thankfully. It also seems to me from their accounts that the treatment is relatively successful.

Don't forget that many women didn't bother with cervical screening in the UK until Jane Goody made it high profile and the number of women requesting the test increased dramatically, almost to the point where the NHS could not cope. Whatever I guess you think about her something good did come out of it. Sadly it did not result in the age for 'sceening for all' being dropped from 25 to 20 but it did result in females as young as 13 being offered a vacination from 2008 onwards (I have no idea what the takup on this is).

[NormanH]

PSA Tests are so easy that it is a good idea to have one relatively young, at 35-40, to give a benchmark for later possible rises.

It is not so much the actual level which rings an alarm (though some Doctors will say it is from about 4.0 mine prefers 3.0) but the rate of change over time.

That is to say a reading that is rising at a sharp rate is a warning that there is something going on that needs to be checked