Gardener Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 [quote user="Judith"][quote user="Gardener"] Expired visa = he deserved to be shot? [/quote]As Q said, you weren't there - in such a heightened state of awareness, yes, I would have happily shot him if he'd tried to do something nasty. The fact that I would never have had the guts to do so is quite another thing ..... normally someone who would travel the tube without many qualms, during that period, I, and as far as I could see, almost everyone else, was regarding anyone they didn't know, and especially if they wore "funny" clothes (and by that I mean anything our of the norm worn by the majority in London) very carefully and closely.It was a very uncomfortable time to be living there ... so I for one am not surprised at the reaction of the police to an unknown, who as far as I remember, ran away from "officialdom" when he saw it coming towards him. What else, given the recent events, were they supposed to do - let him possibly blow up a few more people?[/quote] What Quillan said wasn't what you said. You said HE GO WHAT HE DESERVED. Ergo he was in the country illegally and got shot for being in the wrong place at the wrong time, but he got what he deserved! If you didn't intend it to sound as callous as it did, then perhaps you should have phrased it better. There are plenty of Brits who are in France illegally, in that they do not comply with the rules that allow them to live here legally, so if these illegal people get run over by a drink driver then according to your logic, they will be getting what they deserve! Just for the record, He was not wearing funny clothes , neither did he jump over the barrier. These were proved to be false http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2005/aug/17/july7.menezes. Get your facts right, it isn't hard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boiling a frog Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 It is also worth remembering that the police were dealing with a new phenomenon, the suicide bomber. How do you stop such a person, who is intent on killing himself along with the maximum number of others. You cannot ask him very nicely to kindly stop while his details are checked.Well ,you could but boom? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gardener Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 Except he wasn't. Nor was anyone else on that day. It was a total c*ck up from start to finish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Judith Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 Gardener,If you must continue to quote me, do not take it out of context - I had been describing the feelings of most people when it happened - and you could actually "feel" fear as you walked around London - I was describing what was happening as it happened, not what is now known to have been the truth some years later. I highlight " my thought as the story broke was that, if he was in the country without permission, he got what he deserved.I did not say I would shoot all illegal immigrants, I was describing the state of heightened tension which existed at that point at all levels and ranks of society, which made the actions taken at that time acceptable in the eyes of a people who were living through the terror activated by suicide bombers on the tube.Anyone who was not in London at that time can have no idea of what it was like, so do not judge those who did live through it when their observations about it run contrary to your opinions.RH and Q, thank you for supporting me.I can now see why quite a lot of posters give up on this forum, if they are never allowed to express an opinion or fact which runs contrary to another person's viewpoint. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quillan Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 [quote user="Gardener"]Except he wasn't. Nor was anyone else on that day. It was a total c*ck up from start to finish.[/quote]Yes but the point is at the time nobody knew that did they and we now know that others planned a second attack. Oh to have a crystal ball eh [;-)] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Judith Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 "Just for the record, He was not wearing funny clothes , neither did he jump over the barrier. "Agreed - but I did not say he jumped over the barrier - someone else said that, but that is what was reported at the time, and, strangely enough, most of us not having an inside line to the Met, we could only go on what were told. It was months later before we knew any different, by which time there had been more attempts (fortunately foiled by the self same Met force who you so criticise), and actions they took then were judged to be OK.You do seem to delight in mis-quoting me - which game I am not playing, so carry on all and sundry, with your arguments back and forth - I'm taking my bat home and going to have a nice apero. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
audio Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 Judith, I’m on your side.If he did have a bomb and killed innocent people, there would always be ‘do-gooders’ to complain about slow acting police. Put yourselves at the scene, I have been very close to one of these exploding bombs and seen the devastating results , arms, legs and bits everywhere-you’re one of the lucky ones, you hopefully have escaped without injury, perhaps a little deafness and certainly very frightened - my guess is you have not experienced anything like it! Why are you ranting about the police? They are trying to do their job but their hands are tied by too much red tape. Some of them ‘jump the gun’ but it’s a thankless task at the end of the day: some people are never satisfied, they want security, but at the right price. That’s not life, its fantasy. The family of this fugitive running away from the police (wrong place, wrong time) did not accept the compensation offered, not enough? Well, the tax payer can afford it.I am just wondering how much the Mau Mau are going to demand after their stay in a British ‘camp’ in Kenya? Move to Syria and see what you can complain about there! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boiling a frog Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 It must be wonderful to have 20/20 hindsight.It must also be wonderful to not have to take life threatening decisions.However you appear to have appointed yourself a one man judge and jury despite other judges and juries having found the person in question non culpable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
audio Posted July 22, 2011 Share Posted July 22, 2011 [quote user="Boiling a frog"]It must be wonderful to have 20/20 hindsight. It must also be wonderful to not have to take life threatening decisions. However you appear to have appointed yourself a one man judge and jury despite other judges and juries having found the person in question non culpable.[/quote]To whom and what are you referring to exactly?[8-)] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boiling a frog Posted July 22, 2011 Share Posted July 22, 2011 It is not you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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