Headless birds

[chris pp]

This morning on my way to work I saw a dead creature by the side of the road which on inspection turned out to be a red legged partridge with it's head taken cleanly of and missing, but otherwise undamaged. This is in the middle of the countryside.

This isn't the first time that I've found larger birds in this condition and I think it may be the work of a weasel. Has anyone else come across this or have any ideas?

I know that it's not a fox because a fox wouldn't leave it there uneaten.

Chris

 

[Dick Smith]

We had a cat that used to do that, but not to anything the size of a partridge. Could a weasel take a partridge?

[chris pp]

They are incredibly ferocious and I understand that many chicken deaths are attributed to them when people can put foxes out of their mind ( not a dig )!  It also seems from things that I have read that they will chase their prey and wear it down until caught and even ride the backs of hares until they can bite through the back of their neck. So a partridge is easily possible. What I can't find is information on the headless bit.

Chris

[Dick Smith]

Do you think it might have been scavenged roadkill? Then the size of the bird wouldn't matter, is my thinking.

[Patf]

Chris - are you sure that a fox wouldn't leave the body behind? Watched

Jimmy's Farm last night and he lost about 100 birds to foxes. Some had

their heads taken off. Also a friend here found headless lambs. Could a

weasel do this? Pat.

[Viv]

Do they use wire snares in France?

A friend in the UK who owned a field had a spate of someone setting wire snares, the sort that form a noose, however all that was left in the snare was a head. She realised that a fox was pulling the rabbit corpses and the head was being left behind, Yuk!

But it did stop the person who was setting the snares!

[chris pp]

Well, first of all, it was there last night where I left it but it was gone this morning, that in my experience was a fox that found it and took it home to eat, that's typical fox behaviour if it has something larger then a rodent it takes it back home to eat in safety, I've often tested this with larger road kills that I find by bringing them home and placing them in my garden and watching the results.

As I wrote at the beginning of this thread Dick the bird was completely undamaged apart from missing it's head, if it was a road kill it's unusual injuries and I have seen this same "headless" condition in the past, it's weird.

I'm sorry but I don't know what Jimmy's Farm is Pat and I don't know what evidence was being presented or the time scales involved between killings or where the programme was made, but a fox kill (actual kill) is a very messy affair, not swift and clean because it is canine and does not bite cleanly, it's not really adapted to kill larger creatures even though it is not a small animal itself ( watch dogs fight ). Foxes as a rule scavenge or eat small rodents, insects and worms.

Wire snares are used in France for sure Viva, but I have never seen evidence of them in this locality, in fact the bird was in fairly open country, nearest copse about 350 metres, otherwise open cereal fields. Interesting thought.

By way of info, the other killing carnivores in the area are stone martens, pine martens, genets and polecats.

Chris

[sharkhunter]

Hi, its been known to be a favourite snack for birds of prey, quite often hawks more than falcons will eat the head first, maybe this was a hawk kill and it was spooked away before it could devour it?? Also, when a fox kills it crushes the rib cage and as such there would be extensive damage to the body as well as the obvious saliva traces visible.

Weasels and stoats are fascinating animals and are known to put their intended victims into a hypnotic trance like state and the victim is literally frozen to the spot, the kill is often preceded by the rabbit screaming in fear. Even if the rabbit manages to bolt it is known for the stoat to trail its victim to the bitter end and quite often ends up in  getting  the kill

[chris pp]

That's interesting Hugh, what about a goshawk?   Your reply jolted my mal-functioning memory! Someone near here told me that they had "lost" a collared dove in their hamlet, possibly to a peregrine, but we don't have peregrines where I live ( but they are about 30 kilometres away and breeding ). We do however have goshawks,  hmmm.

Chris

 

[Patf]

Jimmy's farm is a documentary about a young man who bought a piece of

farm land in Sussex and tries to make a living from selling pork

products and eggs. He has made all the mistakes that we learners make

and how he keeps going financially I don't know. He got professional

hunters in and they shot 4 foxes. So interesting about all these

different predators which I never knew about. The only 1st hand

experience we've had of a fox was one afternoon we saw what we thought

was a brown dog in the field holding a duck by the neck. We chased it

and it dropped the duck which has a crooked neck to this day. Pat.

[sharkhunter]

Its been known for birds to be decapitated by the impact of a stooping peregrine, just think along the lines of whiplash, however in most of these cases the prey bird is usually collected up and taken back to feed either babies or enticing the female to copulate. As for the goshawk, a ferocious predator well capable of ripping the head off doves or partridge, but would most likely take in flight and fly on into the nearest cover, being large enough to do so with ease. The humble sparrowhawk, also known as the little assassin, has a better fingerprint for this type of kill, again capable of killing the above mentioned but would eat where it lands, though again mostly in cover. However, being an opportunist hunter and working bankings and hedgerows it's well capable of surprising the odd partridge, so may well be the 'culprit' here. Did you notice if there was any feathers around from impact or plucking?

Hugh.

[chris pp]

Thanks Pat, I understand now, I'm one of those sad people that doesn't have a TV, I'm waiting for it to be on demand on broad band, so that I can choose what to watch and when to watch it, hope I live long enough! Still, sounds like an interesting programme but there's a lot "out there" with sharp teeth or big beaks that attack other creatures.

I stopped this evening near the spot and watched for a while to see what was around, using my van as a hide, it's only a few minutes from where I live and I have never seen a sparrow-hawk around here, but that doesn't mean much. All I saw was about 50 or 60 pied wagtails, some wood pigeon and all the usual, blackbirds and the like. In addition there were two hen harriers patrolling the field.

To answer your question Hugh, no feathers, just a headless bird as if it had been bitten clean of.

When I get a moment I shall spend a bit time keeping a closer watch.

Chris

[chris pp]

I saw a sparrow hawk today about 500 metres away from where I found the headless bird, so it's a possible.

Chris

[chris pp]

So, this week on a track in the same locality, a headless cat!   In fact a headless and one front legless cat providing a snack for a buzzard. I wouldn't have thought that the buzzard would have started with the head and it certainly didn't do the killing!! 

I have to say that I'm intrigued as to what is killing these creatures, I've never heard of a weasel killing a cat but in this case a feral cat which may not have been in the best of condition could have been seen as an easy target.

Chris.

 

[Dick Smith]

Did you spot that the swan with avian flu found in Scotland was headless? That was why the authorities had to do DNA tests to be certain of the species (and therefore if it was a migrant).

[sharkhunter]

Chris, this is certainly a job for Hercule Poirot!!! Perhaps somewhere in deepest Dordogne there is a group of Pygmy warriors who are secretly decapitating animals/birds and shrinking their heads in practice for their first human victim. I think you should be extra vigilant when out and about wear a ' pygmy's r us' style t shirt.

In reality, there is no way that a weasel would be able to kill a feral cat far less bite/chew it's heads off ? Did you examine this cat or was decomposition such that your wife wouldn't let you back in for a while. Perhaps there really is someone keeping/collecting skulls from various animals, there are strange people who do do such things, just a thought,tho not a nice one, hugh.

[chris pp]

Yep, had a good look, as you would expect - clean of, one front leg as well. Left it there, and as I, and no doubt you would expect, the next day nothing left but intestines.

I may not be the sharpest knife in the drawer, but I've been around the wildlife world a bit, just come in now from night walks, but this ones got me well and truly thinking. What I can't figure out is what takes the head and eats it (or carries it away) and leaves the rest for the others to clear up!

There is the possibility that there is a "stray" something that shouldn't be in this region I suppose, but what?

Chris

[Missy]

>>>Foxes as a rule scavenge or eat small rodents, insects and worms.<<<

Sorry!...

Foxes as a rule kill their prey. Have you ever seen, at dawn when foxes have been at their nocturnal hunting spree, a field of new born lambs heads missing...

Well, I have and it is not a pleasant sight (nevermind the financial consequences to the farm) and I won't be made to believe that the fox is so innocent that it eats worms and insects only!...

I will accept that it scavenges, especially in towns and cities where folks willy-nilly discard half-eaten take-aways and where dustbins are not secured for either the bag is ripped open or the bin is toppled over and the content is dispersed....

[chris pp]

There have been a large number of serious scientific studies made by analysis of fox crottes which show that more than 80% of a rural foxes diet is earth worms, insects and fruits. The remainder is generally small rodents, birds eggs and scavenged birds and mammals that were already dead. Foxes tend to mass kill if they become confined in a chicken run with a load of chickens flapping around. The scientific documents also state "sheep cadavers" already deceased, this is even stated in MacDonald / Barrett, which is rated as one of the best field guides for everyday use. What has been proved is that a lot of kills that previously had been put down to foxes, were in fact dog kills, which I myself have witnessed on several occasions both in the UK and in France. I didn't actually start this thread to defend foxes but to find out what is taking these heads of and as far as I am concerned it isn't a fox because it would have immediately have taken the corpse back to its set to eat, not left it lying around!

What is also interesting is that most carnivorous mammals start to eat a corpse by eating into the underside and rib cage being the best way in and in many cases it is the head that is left unconsumed.

Chris

[sharkhunter]

Hi Chris, as you say, the sheep deaths are not necessarily connected with foxes.I used to shoot  for farmers when requested and can categorically state that i have never heard of seen of a fox kill a lamb, more so they do tend to be cleaners. They will readily scavenge on dead bodies and it is when this act takes place that they are deemed to be killers. The problem farmers have with fox are, the fox tends to hang about at lambing time. By their presence alone they make sheep panic and this in turn can cause sheep to abort their young due to stress, then the scavenging process comes into play, the rest i'm sure is obvious.

As far as the eating of animals from the underside, this is done to facilitate the ease of access to the vital organs, heart,lungs etc which are full of blood and very soft tissue, quickly and easily consumed.

I am no further to the truth about the headless corpses than you are but shall keep an open mind, Hugh.

PS in an earlier posting, i think about jimmy's farm?? re the amount of dead pheasants in a pen, the humble tawny owl and its family are serious predators and will kill this amount easily in a frenzy killing spree, hard to believe but true.