Pizza

[idun]

Where I used to live, I could get pizza as good as any I have had in Italy, so not quite french food, but deliciously made in France. I have had trouble finding a good pizzeria in England, just one to be honest, Adriano's in Gosforth and as I don't live that close, go rarely.

A couple of months ago, I tried the frying pan/grill method of making pizza, but only had the courage to do one, and it seemed quite good, so yesterday, I made up my dough and decided that I would not light the oven at all, but try the Pizza Pilgrims method, as seen on youtube.

I reckon that my dough was made up with a about two mugs of flour and from this I knew I would get four pizzas. I made the dough up, kneaded well and left it to rise. Then I knocked it back and made up four balls of dough. As indicated I put a non stick frying pan on a hot heat and let it get hot and put the grill on to get hot too.

The frying pans base is about 23 cms and my pizzas came up the side slightly.

And then I did more or less as they said. Made the dough into a thin round placed it on the hot pan and added the tomato sauce and all the other stuff I fancied. I used far more filling than they said to, but I love a good covering on a pizza, I didn't think it would matter and it didn't.

I lifted the pizza slightly to see if it were well browned and when it was put it under the grill for several minutes, I got the next dough ready and as that didn't take but a few seconds kept my eye on the grilling pizza until it looked ready.

The very best pizzas I have ever made at home. I have never had a pizza oven, and for all my good oven used to bake them well, they were not as good as these. I shall never do other than this method in the future, unless, I get a pizza oven[Www]

Must add, these are thin crust pizzas, no idea if thicker ones can be baked in this way.

[suein56]

[quote user="idun"]Where I used to live, I could get pizza as good as any I have had in Italy, so not quite french food, but deliciously made in France. [/quote]

My OH plays golf (bear with me this info is relevant) and occasionally he plays well enough to win a prize. A couple of years ago he won a prize of a voucher for 2 pizzas to be eaten in the pizzeria to be found on a camp-site a few kms from us or as a take-away.

We decided to eat in as it seemed a fun place. The huge, very thin pizzas arrived and they were delicious but no way could I do justice to mine and my OH couldn't help out as he had managed to eat all his.[;-)]

When he saw what I had left on my plate the waiter said I should ask the chef for a doggy bag and instructions about how to reheat the pizza at home.

So I was told to get both a dry non-stick pan and a grill v hot and heat up the pizza using the method you describe. It was a revelation as the pizza tasted just as it had in the resto.

Since then - not being the cook you are Idun - I 'cook' bought-in part-baked pizzas (with added toppings) by this method and they are always very tasty.

Sue

[idun]

Good, I'm glad that it didn't just work for me, I really could not believe just how good they are.

And yes, doggy bags for pizza.

The wonderful pizziolo that we know well, came up to me and put him arm round me and asked if there was something wrong with the pizza he had made, as I had only eaten half, but it was simply too much, took the rest home in a pizza box and I had the rest the next day.

[Patf]

Gosforth! I didn't realise you lived so far North. I used to have 2 Aunties living there, dead and gone now.

When our children were at home I used to make one big oblong pizza, in a large baking tin, in the oven. With yeast dough and lots of topping.

But your frying pan method sounds interesting, I might try it.

[idun]

 As I said, Adrianos is a bit far to go to on any sort of regular basis.

This frying pan method, well, look at youtube, pizza pilgrims and do as they do. They explain all. Worth a try.

[woolybanana]

As in Italy, the quality of pizza varies hugely in France, where it is the national dish, closely followed by burghers and chips

[Théière]

[quote user="idun"] As I said, Adrianos is a bit far to go to on any sort of regular basis.

This frying pan method, well, look at youtube, pizza pilgrims and do as they do. They explain all. Worth a try.

[/quote]

I did that but it was information on a London based pizza oven no frying pan I could see, have you a link?

[vivienz]

I use one of those ridged griddle pans to cook flat bread in - much better than in my standard electric fan oven.  The griddle pan gets much hotter and you get those lovely little charred bits around the edges.  Very nice.  We're fortunate to have a couple of good places for pizza near us, but I usually make my own on Saturday nights.  I cook the pizza in the oven, but mainly because I'd never get it into a pan once it has all the topping on it; a wood fired oven would be tremendous but I'd never have the space for it and it would be a huge extravagance for this once a week treat.

[Théière]

I have heard including my Brother that the pizza stones are very good and improve the flavour, any input?

[vivienz]

A good friend of mine bakes her own bread on a pizza stone in her oven and gets great results. Unfortunately, my oven doesn't get hot enough to make it worthwhile - I was suspicious that the actual temperature was different to what the dial said and I was right. Pre-heated to its maximum temperature, my oven should get to around 250C, but in fact only reaches 230C at most.

[mint]

Vivienz, welcome to the Duff Oven Club.  Idun and I are founder members[+o(]

[vivienz]

I'm philosophical about my old oven, mint. It's given me 15 years of good, reliable service and has always cooked consistently. The fact that it doesn't get to the temperature it says it does, in truth, doesn't trouble me that much as I can cook pretty much anything I want in it with good results, whereas I've known plenty of people whose ovens got to a higher temperature, were newer, etc. only to have them break down for one thing or another in far less time.

People have baked things for a couple of millennia without knowing the exact temperature in their oven according to some scale or other, but by knowing how to use that particular bit of equipment. Besides, my friend managed to put on nearly a stone in 12 months due to scoffing all that lovely sourdough bread she was making, so I'm rather glad my oven isn't as good as hers for bread. She's lost all the weight again, but the enforced abstinence wasn't fun and I've yet to find a reliable method of resisting a gorgeous warm loaf of freshly baked, crusty bread other than running away at speed and staying away until someone else has eaten most of it!

[idun]

[quote user="Théière"][quote user="idun"] As I said, Adrianos is a bit far to go to on any sort of regular basis.

This frying pan method, well, look at youtube, pizza pilgrims and do as they do. They explain all. Worth a try.

[/quote]

I did that but it was information on a London based pizza oven no frying pan I could see, have you a link?

[/quote]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UTzBFOTlns8

There you go, you'll have to copy and paste.

Re getting it into the pan with the topping on...............[:D] you don't, you put the topping on until it is in the hot pan. I thought that would be a bind, but I put all my toppings in bowls all ready next to my hob and it was so quick popping them on as the base cooked.

For all I cook a lot, I am a disorganised cook and for once took those few extra  minutes to get organised before starting to cook, and will so next time too.

I have a pizza stone, and some special semoule stuff to put on it too, but as mint said, with a duff oven, little point, and my pizzas last week now couldn't have been better. I shall be making them again sooner, rather than later.

[Théière]

Thanks idun, I had the right guys wrong vid but I can post this to help. Now I want a pizza oven [:D]

[dave21478]

At the restaurant, my pizza ovens went up to 450C I believe, but I got best results at around 350. They had stone linings though, and would take over an hour to get properly heated up, even though they were 380v.

I have never tried the frying pan method either - might give it a whirl later in the week when my giant curry runs out.

My home electric oven....well, I dont know what temperature it claims to get to as all the numbers wiped off the stainless steel control panel the first time I cleaned it!

I just wang it up to maximum and let it pre heat while I prepare the pizza. I have one of those infra-red thermometers which I tried on the oven once. It ranged from 210 to 230 depending on which bit I pointed it at.

I think the heavy stone base helped as a large thermal mass that would not drop in temperature as a metal oven tray would.

I have recently acquired an old wood-fired stove thing with an oven in it. I am still getting used to it, and for the moment its like trying to cook with a nuclear reactor - everything gets burned to shit....Its either really low temp or flat out and almost too hot to approach. Need to work on fine-controlling the air flow and fire intensity.

Bizarrely, I put a frozen sad-person lasagne ready meal in it last week and despite it being REALLY hot, the gruel was still frozen solid and only warm at the edges after 40 minutes in the oven! I think at very high temperature it warps the over door enough to let the hot air escape straight out. There is no kind of seal around it which doesnt seem right to me.

[idun]

I would always have loved a pizza oven, but of all things I would now like, it comes well down on my list. I'd like a good oven for my kitchen way beyond something I would not use very often. And my canon is supposed to be a 'good' oven the price I paid for it not that long ago; I hate it!!!!!!!!!

Dave try this frying pan method, OK you don't get that that added extra of the smell of the burning wood, but it works a marvel for a home made one.

[Gluestick]

Picking up on an old thread; or late to the party, perhaps.......

idun: yes we make pizzas in the pan too. Well, Mrs G does. I prefer my oven method, which is:

Make the dough normally ( I use Italian Organic Grade 00 flour from Waitrose): I also generally use fresh baker's yeast.

I then shape out the base, place on an oiled heavy aluminium square pan and whack into our Neff  double electric oven in the conventional top bit (I've found the fan ovens are rubbish for bread etc), pre-heated, with the 'stat turned up to the end of the scale.

When the top browns, then it's bang on the pre-prepared topping (in our case normally the classic Neapolitan Margherita ( Well drained and carefully dried Buffalo Mozzarella, olives, Italian plum toms blitzed, and added purée and torn up fresh basil and loads of garlic!): and under the grill at max; turning the pizza round halfway, to ensure an even spread of heat.

Seems to achieve the desired result: gorgeous top and and a lovely hard crust underneath.

Wood Fired Bread Ovens.....................

One of my forward plans for France. Problem is UK standard domestic ovens simply are not hot enough!

Luckily, in our canton town 15 mins along the road, a young couple purchased an old boulangerie and the artisan master baker started using the old bread oven. Wondrous!

He and I chat bread (I'm a bread freak) and he proudly showed me the oven: still 450 Deg C in the early PM!

[Www]

I'm allowed to dream?

[idun]

[:D]  mint, mint, mint.......have you seen this someone showing off that they have a good oven............[:@] [;-)]

Gluestick, IF either of my ovens had been in anyway half decent, and the newest canon should be......... I wouldn't have even given this pan method a second glance. My De dietrich circa 1981 defunct 2004 made marvellous pizzas![:D]

Still, I do like how they come out with the pan method and take far less time than in the oven.

[mint]

[quote user="idun"][:D]  mint, mint, mint.......have you seen this someone showing off that they have a good oven............[:@] [;-)]

[/quote]

Yes, id, I saw that but I wasn't even going to reply.

Another frimeur, worse than Norman because at least HE was only talking about the weather and not about his ruddy oven[+o(]

[Gluestick]

[quote user="idun"][:D]  mint, mint, mint.......have you seen this someone showing off that they have a good oven............[:@] [;-)]

Gluestick, IF either of my ovens had been in anyway half decent, and the newest canon should be......... I wouldn't have even given this pan method a second glance. My De dietrich circa 1981 defunct 2004 made marvellous pizzas![:D]

Still, I do like how they come out with the pan method and take far less time than in the oven.

[/quote]

Now point of fact, idun, I wouldn't say "it was a good oven" at all!

When we updated the kitchen a few years ago, Mrs Gluey and I went for the latest Neff double oven and Neff gas hob.

Actually, we both preferred the trusty old free standing gas oven! Which for years, churned out "proper" food.

I started researching this topic, since when we shortly completely redo the old French kitchen, we want a decent range type job; gas.

However, despite even considering catering ovens, none seem to offer a decent high range temperature. American (domestic) ovens do seem to boast a higher maximum operating temperature, for what it is worth.

No doubt, the genius commissars in Brussels, once they have finished ruining vacuum cleaners, after insisting on light bulbs which fail to provide decent light to actually do things such as reading, sewing, knitting and seeing things properly, will look at electric ovens and insist in future the maximum operating temperature will be limited to 175 Deg C.....................

[:@]

By the way, incidentally, the very first pizza Mrs G ate, when working near Covent Garden in the mid 1960s, was at an Italian restaurant in an alley called Sicilian Place ( off Kingsway): this was made in a pan on a hob in front of her eyes; and she fell in love.............

That restaurant, run by an Italian family (last time we went a few years back the founder and his wife still worked there!) founded a chain now all over London.

[idun]

I have a canon gas cooker, friends rate gas ovens and so I bought what I thought was a decent one, well the price sort of indicated that it should be and it is absolute utter rubbish. So a Neff sounds like luxury to me, bet you don't have soggy bottoms and burnt tops.

[Gluestick]

[quote user="idun"]I have a canon gas cooker, friends rate gas ovens and so I bought what I thought was a decent one, well the price sort of indicated that it should be and it is absolute utter rubbish. So a Neff sounds like luxury to me, bet you don't have soggy bottoms and burnt tops.

[/quote]

One has to become adept at using the fan oven: helps to place a shallow dish at bottom, with an inch of water to keep up humidity.

I prefer the smaller radiant upper oven.

What Mrs G really desires is an Aga.

[idun]

If my de deitrich had other options than a fan, I never used them, apart from the grill, and that only occasionally as I do not like meats or fish grilled.

I loved that cooker and wore it out.

I have two ovens with this horrible canon gas stove. Neither bake properly for me and with it being gas, there was no 'fan' option, although I believe that this has become an option recently, but not looked into it, as I will never ever have another gas cooker in my life.

Aga's. I thought I wanted one when I was much much younger, and then realised that I didn't, bit like getting big kenwood mixer, thought I wanted one of them too, until I went to buy one and realised that that wouldn't suit my needs either. Strangely when we were house hunting we put an offer in on a house with an aga, although, my biggest concern was finding space for a proper oven in that kitchen. Aga's and the like, not for me, my current fire, a contura 26THigh, which we ordered with an oven, and that is sufficient for my slow slow cooking.

[Patf]

[quote user="idun"] soggy bottoms and burnt tops.

[/quote]

What about burnt bottoms and soggy tops? (like wot I got!)

You lot are making me envious, though I've got used to mine - which reminds me there's some bread in the oven now. Made by husband, I'm trying to train him to take over the bread making from me. But he goes his own way as usual.

[Théière]

Dear idun, today was the first go with shop bought pizza in the fry pan. Brilliant thank you so much for the tip, not only a far quicker way to re heat a pizza than waiting for an oven of grill to pre heat but a better result and now I don't need to buy a pizza stone either.

Well done [:D] [kiss][kiss]