Pump average lifetime and Filter Sand Lifetime

[Simon]

1) How long, on average, should a (Hayward) circulation pump last?  We use it for 10 hours in the summer per day and 4 hours in the Winter per day.  Given we have guests and it is 3 years old I'm thinking of investing in a spare

2) How often should you change the Sand in the filter?  I intend to change to Zeolite when I do it (perhaps this winter), - any distributors in the Var region?  Does it require a more powerful pump?

Many thanks

[Théière]

Hayward are good pumps and should last a good length of time 8-10 years but and there are lots of them, things can go wrong as all pumps have little viton rubber water seals and if something runs too hot due to a shortage of water etc then that can dramatically shorten the life although it is an easy repair, in France however I don't think there is a phrase for easy repair be done tomorrow! A second pump, if budget allows save the mad rush when it happens but if the dealer is close by then less of a problem

The only real need to change the sand in a filter is if it gets calcaire build up as sand can be cleaned with a bit of work, if you don't fancy the work then changing the sand maybe easier. The sand gets coated in a glutenate bacterial film and that needs removing as it causes the sand to form into round balls about the size of golf balls (Pebbling) and that leads to channels through the sand that much larger particles and bacteria can pass through. In a low use domestic pool 10 years would be fine but it still needs regular attention a good hose to break up the "pebbling".

I have seen really bad sand from a commercial pool that was 10 years old cleaned professionally and under the microscope it looked just like new sand. bare in mind new sand is millions of years old [:)]

Sand actually works better when there is some dirt in the filter as clean sand lets quite a lot of muck back through, certainly any dirt smaller than 25 microns would pass straight through.

You won't need a more powerful pump.

[f1steveuk]

I'm puzzled by that!

The book I brought when we moved to a house with a pool said that over a period of time, the movement of sand caused it to be "polished" smooth, which reduced it's ability to "grab and hold" the dirt flowing through, or is that a specific sort of sand?

[gyn_paul]

The only possible time the sand could move is during a backwash, when the reverse flow is lifting it rather than compacting it, as it would in normal use. As TP said, the sand itself is millions of years old, and I can't imagine the swirling during a backwash is going to effect more polishing than a million years or so of tidal sweep has done.

p

[Théière]

Yes Steve,

I can fully understand that as I was told/believed that too. However when I witnessed really disgusting sand from a commercial swimming pool (in service for 10 years)  and watched it cleaned and then examined it under a microscope it was really obvious that it is an industry lie.

New sand (millions of years old) would also be round too as it has become sand in exactly the same way but is only a few years younger than the stuff in your filter.

[Poolguy]

Notwithstanding all of the above.... sand is hopeless filter media, if you care at all about water quality.

Water which is transparent clear and easy to manage can be had very simply and inexpensively without change of equipment, just the media changes to ZEOLITE

More and more pool builders are offering ZEOLITE as it outperforms anything else for an investment of a couple of hundred euro, which is peanuts compared with the investment in the pool of several tens of thousands.

The water is what a pool is about, keeping it nice is really simple - if only pool owners listen to simple advice, which can be proven. Thousands have many more thousands to go.

 

Andrew

 

[gyn_paul]

Just out of interest, Andrew, what sort of Zeolite is it you're talking about ?

p

[Théière]

Just before bedtime its Zelbrite

[f1steveuk]

Then I'll keep my sand untill I change to "Zeebrite" at some stage in the future.

I have to admit, my "Boys Big Book of Swimming Pools" has never let me down, but it is American, so maybe they use softer sand!

[Théière]

Yes Steve, it's ok o do that but that doesn't mean neglect it until you change it giving it a clean and stir to break up pebbles of sand is also needed.

 

[f1steveuk]

Funnily enough being doing filter maintainence today!

[f1steveuk]

You see, this is why I am confused!!

http://swimming.about.com/od/poolandspamaintenance/qt/changepoolsand.htm

So what is THE correct answer to this?

[Théière]

Good news is Steve, I am not confused and that article is wrong. The sand simply doesn't get worn smooth in the short time it is in your filter with the once or  bimonthly backwash for 3-5 minutes. Initially I was told the same and the chlorine use will not increase either. Body fats, sun cream and sweat are what causes the sand to get glued together and that is also food for bacteria and that is where the additional chlorine demand comes from. The sand does not change and providing you clean the filter from time to time then you can continue to use the same sand for a lot longer especially when there are only two, three or four people using a domestic pool. Commercial pools take a real hammering and require far more maintenance.

New sand

 

10 year old sand that has been professionally cleaned.

It could be that the cost of the cleaner for a small domestic pool and time spent cleaning may be more than the cost of replacement of three or four bags of sand. New sand however does not filter very well as it actually needs a bit of dirt to fill some of the gaps which is why some people add DE powder to their filters. Sand filters better after about a year in a domestic pool.

I am using Dryden aqua's AFM filter medium which is a highly processed and positively charged glass product, it filters finer than sand and costs a bit but it has other benefits too, like the ability to backwash clean easier than sand therefore reducing (in theory) the chlorine demand as oils and fats are washed away. It also attracts negatively charged organics and drags them out of solution. 

Zeolites also filter finer than sand and can also ion exchange ammonia out of water although chlorine will convert ammonia to mono chloramine very quickly anyway. Zeolites need recharging with salt water once a year for maximum benefit and obviously if you have a salt pool you won't get ion exchange but you will still get far better filtration than sand.

 

[Polly]

[quote user="Théière"]

Hayward are good pumps and should last a good length of time 8-10 years but and there are lots of them, things can go wrong as all pumps have little viton rubber water seals and if something runs too hot due to a shortage of water etc then that can dramatically shorten the life although it is an easy repair, in France however I don't think there is a phrase for easy repair be done tomorrow! A second pump, if budget allows save the mad rush when it happens but if the dealer is close by then less of a problem

[/quote]

For once I'm going to disagree with you! Re an easy repair in France: when we get problems with any pump which is out of guarantee our first stop is NOT a pool supplier, but local electrical equipment specialists. These guys mend pumps of all sorts, and have helped us out even high season with a prompt turnaround if they can repair the pump

If you don't know one, type 'rebobinage' and your dept. into the search box of pages jaunes on line (wwwpagesjaunes.fr)

[Théière]

Twas a bit tongue in cheek, A professional pump rebuilder would have no problem, Its the pool shops that I was refering too, you know leave it on the shelf for two weeks before doing anything, precious bunch

[f1steveuk]

Now I am not confused, thanks!

Is there any other way to really clean a sand filter other than lots of clean water from a running hose and a good stir?

[Théière]

Hi Steve,

You can close off the valves stick in some cleaner to breakdown fats and oils and agitate the sand with an air wand  (Pipe from my wet vac blowing!) and then I connect up my wet vac to the multiport valve and on back wash air scour the filter bed, then water backwash and finally rinse.

My services will be available by the end of the year for winterising etc if all goes well. [:)]

[f1steveuk]

Thanks, that is on a post-it, stuck on my monitor!

I have used a 30 inch piece of plastic pipe, which I have blocked one end off and drilled a number of small holes in the end of. The other end is a very very snug "interference fit" into my pool maintainence hose pipe, and this seems to work very well as a pressure lance to stir/flush the filter housing/sand. Quite grim what comes out when you do it!