tasng4 Posted November 19, 2011 Share Posted November 19, 2011 Hi,I have quite alot of experience of importing original UK cars into France but none of importing cars originally sold in Japan and subsequently imported into the UK into France. I.E. The Toyota Surf.Can anyone forewarn me of any problems I might expect? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f1steveuk Posted November 19, 2011 Share Posted November 19, 2011 I tried to get my Mazda Eunos (MX5) into France. Gave up after a year. A lot of Japanese market cars differ from those sold to the UK market. For example, the lower speed limits in Japan meant my Eunos had smaller brakes, which were unacceptable for the European market. The cost of the mod's meant it wasn't worth it. I can't comment on the Surf! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob T Posted November 19, 2011 Share Posted November 19, 2011 Your biggest problem is going to be getting hold of a European Certificate of Conformity. If the car was built for the Jap market then it just will not have one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pickles Posted November 19, 2011 Share Posted November 19, 2011 I had a look at the procedure for importing a non-conforming vehicle:www.developpement-durable.gouv.fr/IMG/pdf/RTI01-2_062011_import_nonconforme.pdfand it strikes me that the first issue is whether the constructor's representative in France or the constructor itself is prepared to issue a certificate of partial conformity or non-conformity: without this it seems to me that you are dead in the water in the French system. Beyond that then, you would then have to have the car tested by an organisation that is competent to certify that the non-conforming aspects of the original vehicle have been modified to meet French regulations. Depending on the extent of the non-conformity (worst case being "complete non-conformity", I suppose), the cost of testing to prove that your modifications make it conform might be rather prohibitive. If the car has previously been submitted for a UK SVA, it seems to me that the documentation for this could provide the basis for proof of conformity of the vehicle to generic European standards, but that would still have to be supplemented with DREAL (?) inspection to check for French conformity.For some vehicles the costs of making it compliant may be prohibitive, but I suppose the starting point would be to get the VIN (before committing to purchase) and see if the constructor's representative in France or the constructor itself is prepared to issue a certificate of partial conformity or non-conformity - armed with this at least you ought to be able to get an idea of the scale of what you are taking on, whilst incurring a (relatively) low charge.RegardsPickles Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glacier1 Posted November 20, 2011 Share Posted November 20, 2011 Hi there,The process will be much the same as importing a US vehicle into France. First of all, whether or not it is registered in the UK makes no difference at all to the French, they say that the vehicle laws in each country in Europe are different (which is idiotic in my opinion as it's European law!). They will ask you to take a RDV with the D.R.I.R.E officer, this is to assess the vehicle, he will give you a list as long as your arm with things which are not conformed to French road laws....from the glass (which might not have a E stamp on it) to the tires, which is normal. This is scary. They will tell you to take a meeting with UTAC (a government official test center in Paris, there is only 1 in France), waiting list is 2 months BUT they will not give you the RDV before you contact Toyota to get a certificate of non conformity, which will list everything which is not up to French laws. You will need to weigh the vehicle and this is when it comes complicated, you need to know the max weight fully loaded of the vehicle, the weight empty, as well as other measures which are very hard to get unless you know what you are talking about. This is where I gave up and took up the offer of getting it passed through a garage which dealt with imports. They charged 3,500 euro and did all the work for me, including all the changes on the vehicle. I personally couldn't see a way round it.UTAC will be a pain, they have the last say in the matter, they will put angle cameras in your vehicle to see blind spots, mirror angles etc.....they will measure noise polution and general exhaust polution etc....they will give a detailed report to you to give to the DRIRE, they will then pass you if it's OK, you will then be given the OK to go to the prefecture, pay the tax on the number of fiscal horsepower, and then you'll have the right to register it.Forgot to mention, you will be asked by the prefecture to prove youve paid taxes on the vehicle, this is the impots (the imports/exports department) they will check your paper work to see if it's taxable in France, if the vehicle is less than 1 year old and less than 8,000 kms on the counter you will pay the full tax.For more info, please read here:http://www.forum-auto.com/automobile-pratique/vie-pratique/sujet378543.htmAll-in-all, its a pain in the ass which will cost you a lot of money and take from 9 to 12 months to complete, even if you push for it.They just do not want people bringing cars from other countries into France....why do you think they reduce the tax regarding the puicance fiscale on French cars? It will well known to be cheaper to register a French car!!! good luck, hope this helps Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tasng4 Posted November 20, 2011 Author Share Posted November 20, 2011 Well it all seems very complicated much more so than importing UK cars but as Glacier1 wrote it seems strange that in the EU we are all one happy family. As this car is my brother's the way forward may be to write to Toyota and ask them when certificate they'd be willing to provide, try to get a french tech spec for a Toyota Hilux and see if I can determine what needs changing. The advantage for us is that we have access to the car before buying.Alternatively..............just drive on UK plates.............but that's a whole other can of worms.Anyway thanks to all those who replied you've all given me alot to think about, I suppose the puzzling thing is why does the UK government allow Japanese cars into the EU (at least the UK bit of it). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glacier1 Posted November 20, 2011 Share Posted November 20, 2011 exactly, drive on UK plates, go back to the UK to service, mot it, and just hope you don't get pulled over, a lot of people in Spain do the same.....this is what I did for a year and a half Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f1steveuk Posted November 22, 2011 Share Posted November 22, 2011 The downside with that is, it would have to be insured in the UK, and UK insurance will only cover you "abroad" for a certain amount of days (31 usually).As an example, someone I know in our area brought their Pajero from the UK, which wqas originally a Japanese import. He only had to change all the lights (rears as well) for Shogun lights, these had the EU stamp. The brakes and exhaust passed. Me and the Mazda MX5 ? Change the headlights fo LHD market, fit a fog light (rear lights were acceptable apprently). Rear brakes were accepted, the fronts meant new discs, new hub carriers (to hold the calipers in the right place!!) plus sundry other bits, hence why I didn't bother. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suej Posted November 22, 2011 Share Posted November 22, 2011 I had the same problem with my Japanese manufactured Toyota Carina a while back. I was getting quite stressed about the whole business and then went to the DRIRE and asked if someone would explain what i ought to do. The fellow there told me which forms I needed, explained I would need to change the headlights and then take the car back for them to check it out. I did that , duly made an appointment and went back for them to do whatever the 'check' process was and came away with forms signed and then able to go direct to the Prefecture to get the new carte grise.Somewhere here I've got the whole file and photocopies of all the forms etc but at the moment can't remember where I've put it! Will have another look.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunday Driver Posted November 22, 2011 Share Posted November 22, 2011 A quick bit of research indicates that the Surf may have been officially imported into France as the Toyota 4 Runner. There are plenty of 4 Runners for sale here so that could well be the case. In any event, a local Toyota dealer would be able to confirm this.As suggested earlier, see what form of conformity certificate Toyota France will supply. It may well be that the engine in your Japanese Surf is identical to the European 4 Runner/Hilux (official imports) so if that's the case, then there may be no need for any of the expensive UTAC visits that Glacier described (his were totally non-conforming US specification vehicles).OK, you'd have to invest 150€ or so to find out, but if the car is anywhere decent, it could be worth it. Plus, once it's on French plates, its resale value will increase...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glacier1 Posted November 22, 2011 Share Posted November 22, 2011 well, here's hoping that sunday driver's right, good luck :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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