Will we be needed? Is there a skill shortage

[catherine]

My husband and I are probably going to retire to France in 5years - we will be 50. I know that neither he nor I will want to lounge around - well not for long anyway. We want to work part time. Our options are:

nursing; computing; building; decorating; teaching - cooking and french; accountancy; b&b; cottage rental;

Please can seasoned Francophiles tell me if any of these are an option or is there a skill shortage in any other area. Big ask I know - but I want to be prepared. Many thanks

 

[Nick Trollope]

Welcome.

There are skill shortages throughout France. BUT, you have several distinct problems with your scheme; a) Few immigrants get skilled jobs - unless they are working for (eg) a UK company and have language skills in addition. b) Employment for "retired" folk is virtually unheard of - France has a special category of unemployment for people who they accept will never get another job - at 55. c) You cnnot be self-employed and work part-time, without making a loss.

Sorry and all that, but most people who come to France, come to retire. Buy a old house and do it up to keep yourself occupied.

 

[Val_2]

Retire at 50? I wish and so do mostof the folks who work here in France for themselves because pensions are rubbish unless you have paid in barrowloads for at least 45 years first. As Nick says, if you want to start a business it would need to be 5-7 full days per week to survive and pay all the cotisations involved. If you have enough savings or pension coming in, enjoy your lives as honestly you will be too old to be employed and would need good language skills as well as qualifications to compete against the locals.

[Panda]

Hi

I agree with a) and b) to an extent although these guys are not really in the 'retired' range just yet, for c) I disagree I am self employed and work part-time and I certainly don't make a loss, it depends on how much you are paid not what hours you work surely?

EDIT, you too Val, 5-7 days, I work 3 days per week on average and I find my income after deductions to be about the same as I would in the UK (i.e. I pay the same level of tax/ni as I would in the UK, ok tax is lower and NI equiv higher but it works out about the same)

Panda

[Chancer]

What work do you do here Panda?

[Panda]

Hi

I'm a contractor I suppose you would say (although my current contract is not a technical role), I work for a UK based company and have done for a while now.  I'm self employed and in my experience finding this type of work is not too difficult, my advice to any one moving out here is look for something whilst still in the UK which can be done from home. 

For me working from home in France is no different than working from home in the UK (which I did before I left), I do go over to the UK for the odd meeting, perhaps 3 times a year but apart from that as far as any one I work with is concerned I could be anywhere in the world. 

I may soon move to full time as I have found a contract with a UK company which works in France, the question then is to decide whether the change in tax regime is worth the extra income.

Panda

[Will]

Although I do not know Panda's individual set up, I would point out that, legally, it is difficult to avoid paying tax and social security in France if you carry out a substantial amount of work when in France, regardless of this being work for a non-French client and being paid in another currency. It is a complex subject, made even more so when you ask the 'how would they know?' question.

As a self-employed contractor you should be registered in France as a business, or working through a portage company. As a salaried employee it can get even more difficult if your employer is not French and does not have a French subsidiary. In a case like Panda's, if you are unsure of your future plans, you may be able to work for a year or two on an E101 form if you are taking existing contracts to France and have retained your UK address.

As far as tax is concerned you will probably pay less under the French system but you almost certainly will pay substantially more in French social security contributions than you would pay UK NI. The best advice is to find a good accountant, and work in a field where you can offset substantial expenses, so that your taxable income, and hence your contributions, can be kept down.

Believe me, I speak from experience.

[Hoddy]

To get back to Catherine's original question -

I don't think any of us can predict what changes will take place in the next five years, The new government may make major changes to the way the economy is run. So the best advice that I can offer is that you work on becoming as fluent in French as you can and save hard. In that way you put yourself in a better position to take advantage of any opportunities that may arise.

Hoddy

[Panda]

Hi Will

I am registered as a business in France (and have been for 3 years), this was really the only way to go as far as I was concerned, I pay my contributions etc. and as I said in my first post, for me, and for others as this has been discussed before on this forum, I pay roughly the same in tax and social contributions here as I did with the combination of higher tax, lower NI when earning in the UK.

I do feel it is a viable option, it certainly works for me, I am living in a beautiful place, I get to pick and drop off my son to school every day, I am using my years of experience and earning a good income, in my spare time I have learnt french (via Uni in France) with the aim of getting more contract work from French businesses, in the mean time I will continue to seek contracts from the UK

Panda

[suzi05]

Hi Catherine

There is always work teaching English around here (either privately or in a school) but then I guess it depends where you want to live. I think it's worth thinking a bit about that - for instance I live in a town of about 5000 inhabitants. People rarely leave their job so you pretty uch have to wait for someone to keel over before you can step into their shoes so the likelyhood of employment is fairly limited! Bordeaux is 45mins away and obviously has plenty more oppertunities.

As others have said, if possible try and get something sorted before you come out here. Although there does seem to be skills shortages eg in building and decorating, you'd probably have to set up on your own which is so I'm told very costly unless you work on the black.  

suzi

www.patiras.com/trinite.htm

[Charlotte3]

Don't forget that if you want to do something like decorating or building you must be time served and have qualifications approved by the French authorities. It's not like Britain where anyone can set themselves up as a builder, decorator, plumber etc.

You need to check out what qualifications you acually have before assuming you will be able to earn a living doing these types of things.

Also, depending where you are moving to, age can be very important. There are lots of opportunities for employment  in the construction  trades, but not at 50 plus and definitely not without appropriate qualifications.( There simply isn't time to teach anyone on the job).

Best bet is to get yourselves qualified (or make sure your qualifications are up to date) and definitely learn to speak some (relevant) French. If you want to work you will need to know the relevant phrases rather than talk about the weather, if you follow me.

Anyway, good luck. Anything is possible if you are well prepared!

Aly

[Will]

Thanks Panda. I am sure you are perfectly well set up and totally legal. It's just that we get a lot of people thinking of coming to France who think they can just carry on doing the same work they did in England, or that the procedure for starting a spare-time business is the same. Of course, although both things are quite feasible, there are some very different rules and procedures to be observed.

I agree - for those who do their homework properly then it is quite possible to do nicely in France. You won't get rich quick, but you can make enough to live on. Too many people seriously underestimate the costs though and find themselves in the poo, so a bit of investigation before you start up pays off handsomely.

The message is definitely as stated above - anything is possible if you prepare yourself properly. A good bilingual accountant is probably one of the best business investments anybody can make.

 

[KathyC]

As the OP listed teaching French as one of the options I would assume that learning the language would not be a problem! There have also been several threads on here about gaining employment for an English qualified nurse so this would also be a possibility, if a somewhat lengthy procedure.

[suzi05]

Sorry, not really relevant to this but Sandra who sent me a message about teaching following my posting here - I wrote you a reply but can't seem to send it to you. can you send me your e mail address please.

suzi

www.patiras.com/trinite.htm