chessfou

btw my 1534 consists of 2xA4 pages, Caramac's 4xA4 pages (same number as allanb's 1533-K). ali-cat, is yours 2 or 4 pages?

So far form 1534 leads form 1533-K by 3-1 ... any more?

[quote] The box on page 4[allanb][/quote] We're obviously not talking about the same form. I'm on about: No. 1534 Avis d'Impôt (an A4 page with a second A4 page attached on the right-hand side, referred to by me as page 2).

Have you noticed the bit at the bottom of page 2? Basically it says that if you need to send off a copy, THEN you should date and sign the original (which you keep) before sending the photocopy. [my precis of the 5 lines at the bottom of page 2]

[quote]Has anyone tried this calculator, I am already registered but was interested to se what it says I should be paying and in 2010 (a year it doesn't ask for projected earnings) it says I will pay 80% of my gross income in cotisations!  I've clearly done something wrong, perhaps someone else could try it and enlighten me?[Panda][/quote] If the income is small, then you'vr done nothing wrong. See, for example: "However, even if you do not earn enough to pay tax (20,000€ profit per year), you will still have to pay hefty cotisations. Take for example, John Hughes, who by the end of his second year of being in business as a gardener had a profit of €10,000 on a turnover of 20,000€. That year he paid €5,000 in social charges. The next year, his third, he had a similar turnover but paid even more cotisations - about €7,000." http://www.frenchentree.com/france-employment-work-jobs/DisplayArticle.asp?ID=20544

[quote]just change the plugs.[/quote] Quicker and easier is to come armed with a sufficient quantity of 3-2 pin converters. On sale (at exhorbitant prices) at all airports and ferry ports but you should be able to find job lots of 20 (probably enough) on ebay for £20-25 the lot inc. postage. We're still using almost all of them ('cos it means we can use our old UK extension blocks - one 3-2 converter on the end of the extension block and then plug in your UK items to the UK block).

Bottom of the page there should be a full line of asterisks. Just below that line is your RFR and just above it the tax due.

Still there as far as I can see: http://www.french-property.com/newsletter/2007/10/1/health/

[quote]Does anyone know what the qualification for french state pension is in years? [Panda][/quote] You can find all (or more than) you want here: http://vosdroits.service-public.fr/particuliers/N16.xhtml? Basic answer: 0 years 3 months but you won't get a whole lot for that: http://tinyurl.com/3dz83k For a salarié* to retire on a full pension (50% of average annual salary) then 160 trimestres (i.e. 40 years) are needed and retirement can be taken 60-65. Lots more detail here: http://tinyurl.com/2x5axg *Don't forget there are loads of other categories, some of which have the dreaded/valuable "régime spéciale."

I mentioned above the current value of a UK state pension (£140,000) but for those of us here in France (or other country covered by E121) the value is far, far greater. With average life expectancy of ca. 79 years (and rising), we can add on the value of 14 years' health cover.

[quote]A current annuity rate for a 60 year old female is £ 6,333 for £ 100,000 of fund giving an annual income of £ 8,866 based upon £ 140,000. Surely the standard rate for a female pensioner is never that much?[/quote] You're looking at FLAT rates. The relevant ones are RPI: http://www.annuity-bureau.co.uk/AF_CMS/Resources/Annuity%20bureau/rates_rpi.html Note that the absolute best for a 60-year-old female is £3,833.04 (which is not much more than 1.4xstate pension). The fourth best is already down to £3,500.

Ooh, even more complicated*. Since you are not citizens of the EU (UE) then most of the stuff we have all been looking at (including Coop's reference to 5 year residency) probably won't apply. Have you tried approaching Brussels to find out whether you should, in general, be treated in Europe as equivalent to an EU citizen or as an alien? [I thought there were special rules for residents of CI, IOM, Andorra, Gibraltar etc.] *Not least because even the Europa site seems to be in a state of flux, e.g.: http://ec.europa.eu/youreurope/nav/fr/citizens/index.html which includes (today): Vos droits en matière de résidence et de mobilité dans l'Union européenne ont fait l'objet d'améliorations récentes. Vous trouverez bientôt sur «L'Europe est à vous» des informations actualisées sur les droits de résidence et les procédures d'entrée. Entretemps, vous pouvez consulter des informations d'ordre général sur ces thèmes en cliquant ici. which leads through to here: http://ec.europa.eu/justice_home/fsj/citizenship/movement/fsj_citizenship_movement_fr.htm with much talk about EU citizenship.

The minimum currently (at least for women - I am going on the letter my wife received recently from DWP) is 27% of UK state pension for 9 years contributions (and approx 3%/yr contrib thereafter). 30 years contributions qualify for 100% state pension (I think that was passed into law this summer). NB: state pension is INDEX-LINKED with a current value of 100% pension (i.e. cost of buying a similar annuity) approx £140,000. Will it ever be neans tested? Who knows but it does represent tremendous value, especially for all those who may have much of their pension in flat rate form (with average life expectancy low inflation should get close to halving the value of such pensions), so a bit of free index-linking is a real bonus.

If you are thinking of working as an Entreprise Individuelle you can use a calculator on the URSSAF site to work out what your cotisations are likely to be. http://www.urssaf.fr/profil/independants/services/calculer/acces_direct_01.html

[quote]Presumably because the French don't think the amount they receive from the UK is adequate to cover the risks involved.[/quote] Apparently the transfer figure is approx € 3,750* (found on a thread here, I think) while the relevant comparative figure is ca. € 2,800  (my figure derived from the 2006 "average" cost per head of the French health system: € 3,138** which includes the cost of CMU-C, which seems to average out at about € 338 per capita, although I have my doubts since that 338 seems quite a low figure to me). Therefore I think you may be putting thoughts into French heads which aren't there (or only in those of some xenophobic on-line posters). * It would be nice to see a proper source for this figure. ** "Les comptes nationaux de la santé en 2006," Direction de la recherche, des études, de l’évaluation et des statistiques (DREES)

Yes, they are the same thing (impots.gouv.fr use the terms interchangeably). To answer the other questioner - this is the tax demand you receive, having filled in and filed your tax return.

I would still like to see clarification of (at least) one thing (and yes I have read and re-read the Sécu web page and yes, maybe this is only straw-clutching): Generally speaking (and especially in the rants which have appeared here, there and on times-online) the French, when they refer to "CMU," really mean "CMU-C." It seems entirely ingrained that CMU-C = CMU in a completely interchangeable way. Many of us were/are/would be concerned with "CMU-B." Do the new regs pertain to CMU-C only or to both parts? Has anyone who has been along to (or phoned) their CPAM this week asked specifically about this? CMU-C - free complémentaire on top of free basic = free healthcare; CMU-B - the small minority who contribute 8% of RFR.

Our avis arrived today.

[quote]This issue has made the BBC website[/quote] And also BBC News (24) (maybe BBC1 - usually the same at this time) 5-10 mins ago. A rather disjointed piece - video of the Mochans, "retirement to the sun" may have become more expensive ("at least £1k for private health insurance"), tomorrow - Spain.

I've looked at april but I can't see anything other than "complémentaire" - can anyone point to where exactly (if anywhere) the "full" or "CMU/CPAM replacement" insurance we need might be hiding?

[quote]CMU (Couverture universelle maladie) is designed as health cover for those on very low or no income who do not pay for health care through their work.[/quote] I keep seeing this statement (from French people as well as us imigrants) but it is an over-simplification. (1) CMU was designed as a "catch-all" for those not subscribed to Secu. Yes, primarily for the poor but not just for them, also for the well-off not otherwise included (and I believe, though I have not seen it stated, to ensure that full private health insurance could be outlawed). (2) CMU also provides the "CMU complémentaire" as a top-up for the poor. The following report (from 2000) gives some solid figures (p.6) for: (1) (not counting those who also qualify for comp.) 152,887 (ca. 4% miscellaneous non-poor); (2) 3,643,460 (ca. 96% "poor") www.issa.int/pdf/helsinki2000/topic4/1lelaidier.PDF Yes, overwhelmingly for the poor but not solely for them.

Funny thing about cans of worms - once open, extra worms wriggle out from time to time. Boiling a frog's quoted text suggests there could be yet another category (into which we fall): Arriving in France just (May) prior to July 2006 (relevant date for some of the new legislation), currently covered by E106 (expiring next Jan) and with TdS (which we applied for shortly after arrival) valid until 2011. But I'm not holding my breath. We are (probably) anyway among the lucky ones who can fund the cost of private insurance and should not suffer unduly (just have to shell out more €) from lack of cover for our pre-existing conditions (not directly life threatening).

[quote]Your MEP can be found here http://www.europarl.europa.eu/members/public/geoSearch/zoneList.do?country=FR&language=EN [cooperlola][/quote] But to check which region your département is in, start with the map on this page: http://www.europarl.europa.eu/paris/4/par41eu4912.htm

FWIW, re "ayants droit" for CMU: Sont rattachés en même temps que l'assuré : le conjoint, concubin, partenaire PACS, la personne cohabitant sous le même toit depuis au moins 1 an, s'ils ne relèvent pas d'un régime obligatoire http://www.adai13.asso.fr/fiches/san/san_cmu.htm NB - no mention of sex, age or dependancy. - adai13 is an organization set up to help the "disadvantaged" http://www.adai13.asso.fr/ISANAV/ADAI/qui_sommes_nous.htm so they should know the ins and outs (I couldn't find anything specific on either the CPAM/ameli or CMU sites).

Thanks all, I think I'll relax for another few weeks.