idun Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 It was on tonight and a woman said, that the french couldn't make marmalade. Well actually Bonne Maman Confiture d'oranges ameres is sold in UK supermarkets. And it was sold in France and obviously I have no taste at all, as I thought it was very nice and still do.Then the same woman was mushroom picking, cepes I think and didn't cut the green part off, which we were told we had to do in France by our fungus finding friends. There again, I never just liquidise a soup. I wouldn't have served 'that' to anyone. I liquidise and then seive, a velouté is refined, and I take pride in my cooking. Still I obviously have no taste.And then John Franklin with his neighbour Michele. After six years does this man not speak french, other than the odd word, or is the english just for the camera? I didn't hear him say anything in french even when there were non english speaking french people there apart from one french word. Does he speak french? After six years, with a friendly neighbour, his french should be good. I feel like I have taken this program quite personally tonight and feel very very irritated. I won't be in the morning, but now, I am! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivor Nidea Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 Sorry I can't help myself! It's always been your thing ever since I remember being on this forum. John Franklin cannot speak French after being here for six years...what??? I've been here for over eleven years now and still cannot hold a proper conversation with my two neighbours, and one of them is English[:-))] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idun Posted December 10, 2012 Author Share Posted December 10, 2012 It is actually my 'thing', because I don't understand why anyone would move to another country and not learn the language. I actually hate it with a passion. Whether someone moves to France or the UK, I really do not care....... move to another country........ learn to speak to the locals, it seems a very polite thing to do, rather than the contrary to polite...........And my french will never be brilliant, I have not got the gift, but I do my best and at least I can do everything I need to do and deal with everything I need to do, I don't use anyone else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolybanana Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 Who the eck wants to speak to the natives? They should speak English! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sprogster Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 I have found the second series of Little England boring and have given up watching it. The fact that there have been so few comments about the new series presumably indicates I am not the only one.By comparison I have enjoyed the similar programme shown on the same channel regarding expats in Corfu.I do agree that many of the participants are not shown in the best light and a better title would be an idiot abroad, if Ricky Gervais had not got there first! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabbie Posted December 11, 2012 Share Posted December 11, 2012 I agree. So much of the program is repeating what has been already said that you feel they could halve the transmission time without loosing any content. Still if some people enjoy it, who am I to get worked up about it. It's not as though I am forced to watch it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chancer Posted December 11, 2012 Share Posted December 11, 2012 For me learning French was a simple matter of survival, how those that dont manage to get by let alone survive without leaning heavily on others I really dont know.Perhaps they live where there are lots of compatriots some at least of whom speak French, perhaps the French (shopkeepers etc) who have contact with them have learnt English.Of those that I know they are all couples and one speaks some French, 99% the female, the other never seems to bother, how they cope with the loss of a partner I do not know, its not as if this is an easy country even when you do speak French.And then there is being able to socialise, very important when living alone and all the more so after the loss of a partner.I recall the sad case of an elderly British guy in a French retirement home who spoke no French, the staff were desperately trying to re-unite him with his son, not sure if it was this forum or another.I recall Cooperlola posting before she knew of her cancer that she wondered how her husband would cope if he had to live without her (language skills), does anyone know how he is getting on? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
just john Posted December 11, 2012 Share Posted December 11, 2012 [quote user="woolybanana"]Who the eck wants to speak to the natives? They should speak English![/quote][:D] exactly! [:D] Was it not Alexander Dumas who said "English is just French badly pronounced." [:D] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabbie Posted December 11, 2012 Share Posted December 11, 2012 Having lived in Sweden for 10 years some time ago perhaps I could add my twopence worth. Even in a country where the vast majority of people speak reasonable english I found it essential to learn Swedish not so much for work but for the social side. Swedes were always happy to speak english at parties for about 10 minutes and then they understandably wanted to switch back to Swedish. I did find swedish subtitles on TV helpful in expanding my vocabulary and I did go to swedish classes provided free by the government. I just don't understand why people living in a country don't want to learn the language Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NormanH Posted December 11, 2012 Share Posted December 11, 2012 "I recall the sad case of an elderly British guy in a French retirement home who spoke no French, the staff were desperately trying to re-unite him with his son"Do you mean they were looking for the person responsible for the bill? [6]In my case I speak what I think is French, and they congratulate themselves on understanding my English [:-))] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mint Posted December 11, 2012 Share Posted December 11, 2012 When and where exactly is this marvellous programme on?Have pity on me, somebody, and tell me, will you?Nevermind whether I speak French or not, the question is, can I possibly survive in France without watching Little England?And why "little"? It's not that small? England, that is..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
just john Posted December 11, 2012 Share Posted December 11, 2012 [quote user="sweet 17"] When and where exactly is this marvellous programme on?Have pity on me, somebody, and tell me, will you?Nevermind whether I speak French or not, the question is, can I possibly survive in France without watching Little England?And why "little"? It's not that small? England, that is..... [/quote]http://www.radiotimes.com/programme/mvxpz/little-englandhttp://www.itv.com/itvplayer/video/?Filter=327636Enjoy [:D] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cendrillon Posted December 11, 2012 Share Posted December 11, 2012 Sweets, it's the Little England of Dordogne-shire and there may even be people you know featured on this programme![8-|]Idun, I also thought that soup looked dreadful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivor Nidea Posted December 11, 2012 Share Posted December 11, 2012 Quite why some of you are obsessed with the idea that you have to socialise is a concept that has passed me by for most of my life, so forgive me if I don't change now. Back in the UK (prior 2001) I wasn't desperate to spend my precious leisure time in somebody elses gaff swopping small talk about things that seemed important to the others but irrelevant to me or my life. We had one or two couples that we used to enjoy the company of if we felt the need, or if they thought they might enjoy our company. Other than that we survived quite nicely with getting pleasure out of our childrens activities up until the time they left home. They all became independant and left home in their late teens or early twenties which, as I write this, has me now thinking that maybe they couldn't wait to get away!Ironic that some of you should wonder how it would be to survive the loss of a loved one out here, when the one missing was the one with the language expertise. Well...I can tell you, it's blooming tough. Much harder than I would ever have thought possible. But if you possess strength of character, living in France is no big deal, and most probably no tougher than it would be back in England under the same circumstances.I have a few friends who seem to enjoy my company (none French) whenever they or I feel the need. The French people that I know are every bit as friendly as any English people and do not seem to object to the fact I am not fluent in their language, at least that is my impression on meeting them face to face, and I have had the pleasure of dining with two separate neighbours at different times before I moved houses a year ago.I pay all of my due taxes and health costs and have managed so far to deal with any bureaucratic problems.At times, apart from getting grumpy at all sorts of strange things, I go through stages of being cross about the number of brits driving about on UK plates and boasting about not being "in the system". But I let the feelings pass as I have found that life is too short to worry about what other people get up to. So, in closing, socialise by all means if you want but it's really not my thing. As France is a nice place to live in I like living here and shall continue to do so, happy in the skin I am in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sprogster Posted December 11, 2012 Share Posted December 11, 2012 Ivor, I don't think we are talking about being fluent in French, far from it, it is just a bit cringe worthy that some of the participants in Little England who have been in France several years, don't seem to have even the basics! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mint Posted December 11, 2012 Share Posted December 11, 2012 [quote user="just john "]http://www.radiotimes.com/programme/mvxpz/little-englandhttp://www.itv.com/itvplayer/video/?Filter=327636Enjoy [:D] [/quote]Thank you, JJ, helpful and kind as usual![;-)]If there's anyone on there who is remotely like my English neighbours, I shall merely be piling on the agony, methinks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
just john Posted December 11, 2012 Share Posted December 11, 2012 If you look at the itv player edition you may recognise Rose . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kitty Posted December 11, 2012 Share Posted December 11, 2012 I think that the programme is unrealistic about life in France. "I can't believe that I am now living my dream" said one contributor and that seems to be the general theme.The programme makes it look oh so easy to live in France with none of the problems of tax and health costs and paperwork etc. It suggests that it is easy to run a business and make sufficient money from it to live. Children are shown integrating into school without any of the parental angst that is mentioned time and again on this Forum. No filming takes place in the long hard winter, just the hot summer. So life is one long sultry day.Mmmm. Worrying for those Brits watching in Blighty and thinking "I can do that". Yes, they can, but they need to know that it isn't as easy as the programme protrays it.By the way, in the advert break, there were no adverts for commercial products and only trailers for forthcoming programmes - a sign that advertisers have stayed away? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YCCMB Posted December 12, 2012 Share Posted December 12, 2012 [quote user="Ivor Nidea"]Sorry I can't help myself! It's always been your thing ever since I remember being on this forum. John Franklin cannot speak French after being here for six years...what??? I've been here for over eleven years now and still cannot hold a proper conversation with my two neighbours, and one of them is English[:-))] [/quote]I read idun's comment a little differently. I'm sure if she didn't mean it this way she will correct me, but what I understood was that a "friendly" neighbour would perhaps be of some assistance in helping the person to practise or improve their French, not necessarily become a friend for life or a regular dinner guest.I am sure that, however long you have been in France, there must be an occasional frustrating incident where lack of French is a cause for problems. Unless, of course, you are underplaying your command of the language. I recently visited a friend in hospital. This person had been confined to a hospital bed for the best part of 3 months on and off. Part of that time was spent in a hospital some considerable distance from home, where it was impossible for his wife to visit daily, and in an area where there were no other close friends. On the day we visited, a nurse arrived to take blood pressure and ask various questions and it was clear that the patient understood nothing of what the nurse was saying or asking. It then became clear to me why this friend had phoned me in the UK, on my mobile, from his mobile (and hence to not inconsiderable expense) on half a dozen occasions during their hospital stay. He was so bored and deprived of any conversation that he was ringing anyone he could get hold of! And this is also a person who has lived full-time in France for the best part of 10 years. He has the good fortune to have a wife who is comparatively fluent, but without her, he is not able to manage from a language point of view.I expect that many people who don't manage to make any progress with French are content to rely on friends or acquaintances who CAN speak the language. A few are happy to pay for that service, but a majority (speaking from experience) seem to believe that anyone who has made the effort to learn French is simply gagging to spend their free time using it to help them organise their own lives and problems.On a separate thread, Norman has posted a link to a Guardian article showing some of the key data to emerge from the latest census figures to be published. Ploughing through all the headline stuff about how many of the population were not born in the UK, the increase in other religions and the indications that some "minority" groups are not really minorities after all, is the interesting fact that in 91% of all households in the UK, everyone speaks English. That's despite the fact that in London alone, 37% of residents are not UK born. And, regrettably, that is a thing upon which far too many native English speakers rely as they travel or relocate across the globe. What I can't understand is why those who can't won't or simply don't make the effort are so bloody proud of the fact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivor Nidea Posted December 12, 2012 Share Posted December 12, 2012 I was not especially referring to Idun's comment but to the general tone of looking down on anyone who has not got a very good grasp of French, doesn't want to socialise or has moved here without wishing to embrace all things French. I didn't particularly want to embrace all things English when there for most of my life...just going with the general flow wherever I happen to be.I assure you I am not underplaying my grasp of French, which has led to some strange situations rather more than frustrating ones. Like the one at my doctors where unknown to me he had decided to conduct my very first prostate inspection. I am sure he explained exactly what he wanted me to do but I only understood the bit about getting all my clothes off (apart from socks, which was kind of him) and clamber onto his couch. On my back I lay, then first on one side then the other until I understood about face down. If he had used the word chien at some stage I would have understood what he was on about. The frustrating part about it though was I was unable to find the French words for "I don't usually go this far on a first date!"I have others, many others but it's all part of life wherever you happen to be, as long as you accept we are all different in what we want out of life.As far as the programme goes, I am sure we all realise that those sort of shows are heavily edited in order to show participants in a particular way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chiefluvvie Posted December 12, 2012 Share Posted December 12, 2012 Only seen one but my immediate view would be that it would all come across very differently if they filmed during the Winter!Chiefluvvie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolybanana Posted December 12, 2012 Share Posted December 12, 2012 When and where is this programme on, svp? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idun Posted December 12, 2012 Author Share Posted December 12, 2012 This neighbour, Michele, is apparently John Franklin's best friend. And Michele speaks english, rather well actually. But even with non english speakers, I didn't hear John Franklin speak other than in english, apart from say 'chevreuil', which is what they were eating.And maybe he speaks french and it was for the cameras, but even if I was in front of the camera, if I was with non english speakers, I would have spoken to them in french and not english. It wouldn't matter if it was poor french, if any one understands what a hard language it is to learn, I do. But I would have applauded the effort.Britline and english speaking help lines that have started in France, seem an odd notion to me. As does everywhere 'official' in the UK saying that translation services are available. Spend the money used for that on english lessons and then you don't need translators....... bit like the give a man a fish and he eats for a day, get him a net and he gets food for life. As you said Betty, life throws things at us and we can end up in situations where we may need to know what is being said, and if we cannot understand, then I suppose if we are ill, it could be very worrying and maybe frightening to boot. And yes, I think that some people do under estimate their knowledge of french. Some will over estimate and others will mercilessly 'use' those around them and probably believe that they are doing these people a favour! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
powerdesal Posted December 12, 2012 Share Posted December 12, 2012 Idun wrote:-''It is actually my 'thing', because I don't understand why anyone would move to another country and not learn the language. I actually hate it with a passion. Whether someone moves to France or the UK, I really do not care....... move to another country........ learn to speak to the locals, it seems a very polite thing to do, rather than the contrary to polite...........''I do not disagree in principle but..........things are not always that cut and dried as ''move to another country........ learn to speak to the locals,''.I have lived in a number of different countries, mostly in the Middle East, for many years. Did I learn to speak Arabic - no. The reasons being that it would have been pretty pointless. Whilst the 'locals' were of course Arabic speaking, they were and are a minority. A minority who were in charge but the day to day life involved people of various nationalities who spoke Hindi, Urdu, Pashto, Pushtun, Farsi, Malayalam, Tagalog, Rumanian, French, Norwegian, Welsh, plus the different forms of Arabic from Sudan, Egypt, Saudia Arabia, Oman etc.For those not really in the know, Gulf Arabic is not the same as Egyptian Arabic as just one example. So which language do you learn in order to 'do the polite thing' ?I do agree that the people portrayed on 'Little England' are shown (possibly) in a very bad light in respect of their French language ability. Perhaps it's just for the programme, perhaps it's genuine. Maybe there are forum members who know some of the individuals personally who could confirm which it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YCCMB Posted December 12, 2012 Share Posted December 12, 2012 [quote user="idun"]Spend the money used for that on english lessons and then you don't need translators....... bit like the give a man a fish and he eats for a day, get him a net and he gets food for life. [/quote]Oddly enough, free English lessons were available in England till about four or five years ago, and then the LSC (as it then was) stopped them - largely because they were "too popular" and had ended up costing far more than initially envisaged. Funny, though, that in these times of difficult financial decisions, the lessons are still offered, at a fee, and still popular. In fact, they ARE still free to asylum seekers and those in receipt of certain benefits. In my area, which admittedly isn't that representative, the uptake is still good, and classes are full of people from all over the world, paying out of their own pockets (and, for non-EU members, that's a whopping £400-odd every 11 weeks) to attend. Of course, the majority of them are also working, which also flies in the face of what some of the media would have you believe. Other areas still have the numbers, but may have more who are not eligible to pay fees. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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