Coming to France for 6 months

[Whitters]

Hi

 

Not quite sure where to post this, moderators please feel free to move.

 

We have had a holiday home in La Manche for the last 8 years. During that time we have visited about 5-6 times a year.

 

Due to change in circumstances I am now in a position to make a more permanent move to France. When we visit in May next year I am looking to stay until October. My wife, teaches in adult education wants to work for another couple of years. She gets large amounts of holiday in the summer and aims to fly out to so that we can spend them together in France.

 

The reason for this is that we are wary of making a total break from the UK straight away. I feel it is very different to have a holiday here as to living here on a permanent basis. I want to take this opportunity to see if I can fit in on a permanent basis, also I think it is the only way to improve my French.

 

I think I have the financial side covered quite well, but I was wondering if any of you could think of areas the I might have missed, or may be relevant for a 6 month stay such as health cover, car insurance etc. I am in my late 50’s.

 

Look forward to your replies.

 

Andy

[EuroTrash]

Keep it to five and a half months, it will be a lot simpler. Officially there are not degrees of permanence - either it's a permanent move or it isn't, no such thing as a 'more permanent move'. Officially, 6 months of a year in France makes you resident here and liable to fill in a residents tax form and you don't want that yet. Not that anyone's likely to be keeping tabs on you, but it keeps your conscience clear.

Check with your car insurers how long they provide full cover for European use. It varies a lot from one insurer to another, but there are plenty that offer 6 months.

Enjoy.

[NormanH]

If you are going to use the EHIC for health cover don't forget that this only gives you the same as  French person gets, 65% of expenses, not the whole lot.

To cover the rest most French people have a 'top up' insurance a Mutuelle  which pays the other 35% and other incidental expenses.

35%  of a Doctor's visit at 23€ isn't too bad, but once you get into Xrays scans etc it can quickly add up, so have a kitty or some way of covering an accident or emergency.

You are being very sensible not to rush in, as you are quite right that living here isn't the same thing as being on holiday.

[EuroTrash]

NormanH makes a good point about healthcare (although in practice, people sometimes do seem to get the whole lot refunded under their EHICs). As a UK resident you could take out holiday insurance to cover any shortfall and also any repatriation costs.

[idun]

According to the service public.fr web site, three months is the magic amount of time to start being a french 'resident'. Three months is also the amount of time non state pensioners are allowed out of the UK to retain free NHS hospital health care. I realise that GP's are different.

Also, many UK home insurers won't insure an empty house for more than 30 or 40 or 60 days, that can be hard to get. And as was said, cars have to be insured, which is probably the easiest bit to do really.

 

I realise that many people play the system.

 

 

 

 

[Sprogster]

idun, you have missed the main point in that the OP says his wife will continue to live and work in the UK during the six months, apart from the summer holidays. Therefore there are no issues concerning an empty house in the UK, or entitlement to NHS care.

Under the new UK residence rules the OP will still be clearly UK tax resident, as long as his wife is working and resident in the UK.

[idun]

Maybe I haven't got it at all. Sometimes people end up being french resident with their other half working in the UK, if the french rules don't coincide with the new UK ones, how does this work.  And I'm not sure that it is 'us' who really decide this.

However, the house could still be a concern, even for holidays. Good friends of mine know to their cost as they had a major problem in their house whilst they were on an extended holiday and the insurance paid not a penny, as they only covered for 30 days. Cost a fortune, and I mean a fortune to get it back to it's previous state!

[Gardengirl]

Welcome to the forum, Whitters.

We spend half the year in each country, although it's rather more split up than you're thinking about; summers are spent in England to escape the heat and crowds. We make sure that we are in France for no longer than 2 months at a time, to keep within our house insurance terms. I see that your wife will be in the family home for much of the time you'll be in France, but many people in her position easily spend 2 months in France in the summer holidays.

We have Saga car insurance, so we have cover for the year. However, we don't leave the car in France for more than 3 months at a time.

For health cover we have our EHIC cards plus good travel insurance, which covers us for up to 90 days per visit with no limit on the number of visits we can make abroad. Simple visits to a doctor and medicines etc are covered by the EHICs, which has usually resulted in most of the costs being repaid to us and emergency treatment is covered by our travel insurance.

You're so right about living somewhere being different to just visiting for a few weeks each year on holiday. We have a very busy life in France, belong to two main associations in which we play active parts, and feel very much a part of the local community. It's only a small town, but it's interesting how many comments we get from shopkeepers, waiting staff from restaurants etc as we walk down the street, about being back.

You'll definitely find your French improving if you spend longer in your second home, especially if you get involved in activities. One association we belong to is AVF; there are branches all over the country, it's cheap to join and all activities are free apart from when meals etc are involved. Ours is a very active, convivial group, with many activities on offer; your level of understanding just has to improve by leaps and bounds when you're out on a ramble with 20 or so French people for a few hours a week, at a wine evening, on a visit etc.

Good luck with your plans.

[Whitters]

Good Morning All

Thanks for the welcome. I have been using the forum for several years now, and have found it incredibly useful.

Thanks for the comments. This has already raised several points that I not got totally covered. Any further points will be gratefully received.

I have not felt so upbeat about life since we got married and had the kids (long time ago now ! ) Only hope the move comes up to expectation.

Thanks

 

 

[Sprogster]

In the situation of a Brit retiree spending 6 months a year in France with his wife still living and working in the UK, I can state categorically that HMRC will still treat the OP as UK tax resident and there are two recent court cases to back this up. (Gaines-Copper)

The French Fisc will be quite happy, as they would apply exactly the same criteria to a French national who spent six months a year in the UK. Otherwise, it would be too easy for the wealthy French to avoid the new higher French taxes, by spending half the year in London.

Unless you are going abroad for a genuine contract of employment, if the centre of your family life remains resident in the UK it is now impossible to become non UK resident, as you have to meet the new clean break test.

[andyh4]

+1 to Sprogster's post.

 

The double taxation treaty mentions 183days once (yes I know I am a sad person and has read it from end to end), and that is in relation to being employed in France.

 

Six months has no relevance whatsoever to your case therefore.  Your economic and social interests will remain in the UK and you will remain UK tax resident.

 

As others have suggested health care and car insurance are much more improtant issues.

[Loiseau]

...and possibly inheritance issues, if either of you has been married before and has children from another union.

(I know the OP didn't mention such a scenario, but I toss it in just in case it could affect others who may be avidly reading this thread.)

Angela