oh no, questions on selling house in france again !

[londoneye]

Hi everyone

OK, will try to make this reasonably short.

I need to sell my property in France.      The reason is unimportant, I just need to sell and as quickly as possible.

Our property has been on the market for about 6 months and although we have had a few viewings, no offers.        

I have three thoughts for trying to find a buyer and being out by the end of this year (my aim), and would like, if possible, feedback on any of these three ideas.

1.    Very simple - drop the price drastically, ie to well below the value of the property.     Of course I would take a financial hit, but I have already come to terms with this in my own mind, so can live with it.    The only problem here is that if I drop the price drastically and it still doesn't sell, then can I put the price back up again.    Yes, I know it sounds a bit crazy - but if no-one is out there buying at any price, then I would basically have to stay here until sold, in which case I might as well get the best price I can.    Suspect that logic may only make sense in my own slightly weird mind, but hopefully someone else will understand what I mean.

2.  Putting the property up for auction.   I have read everything I can find so far and sort of understand the process.     The things I don't know are

-   Who can value your property and do you have to pay for it?

-  If the property does not sell at the auction what costs would I still have to pay ?

-   Confirmation, if anyone has sold at auction and/or knows, that the 'standard' reserve price is around 60% of property valuation, but that the vendor is able to tell the auction house what reserve price they would like (ie 80% of value for example).

3.   I am currently looking into PR firms to see if there are any that get involved in selling houses in France.   Has anyone used a PR firm to help them sell a property and was it successful?

Anyway, thanks for reading and any ideas/pearls of wisdom would be gratefully received.

[Mikep]

No real advice to offer, but just wanted to sympathise - we've been on the market for 18 months, but fortunately under no pressure.

We did try advertising (in England) for a possible exchange and found a couple who wanted ours, but we couldn't see ourselves in theirs, otherwise it could well have worked.

Good luck!

[idun]

Ours took 18 months to sell. We reduced the price by 25% in the end. We had reduced it three times in total and the last asking price was probably about 20% below our original figure. Then someone made an offer and I argued a couple of thousand €'s and they agreed.

 

[londoneye]

Thanks for the support - clearly there is still hope (strangely just got back from walking dog to find a phone message for viewing on Thursday - fingers crossed for me please !).

[connolls]

Hi londoneye,

Just wanted to say good luck, all the best for your viewing on Thursday.

Best Wishes Mel.

[debbie]

londoneye: we've noticed several properties for sales which are now being let instead. At least that way you may be able to keep the mortgage payments going and try and sell it later, if this is a possibility for you.

[londoneye]

Thanks mel.

Mortgage-free thankfully debbie - other reasons more pressing than finance are driving this, but thanks for responding.

[Renaud]

Firstly, my sympathies for your predicament.

Secondly as you asked for thoughts…

Back in 2005, when you joined the forum and I guess started buying your house, the world was different. And I don’t just mean that Amanda Lamb with her embonpoint and lisp were on A Place in the Sun, rather than the girl with the least attractive accent possible, they now use.

Credit was easy, the (our?) baby boom generation could look to use the huge increases in the value of our homes to buy abroad. France was great as when us baby boomers were at school French was still taught and even O level failures such as myself felt France was a friendly kindred place rather than an alien one. (Please stop sniggering all those who have gone three rounds with the functionaries in the car registration office).

The immobiliers had started to use the internet and the comparatively low prices (by UK standards) made all those slightly tumbledown houses with blue shutters look very attractive when stuck at your desk on a wet November afternoon.

What the best of the immos did was ‘sell the dream’. The copy in the descriptions mentioned, “The patio is perfect for watching the sun go down with a glass of chilled rose” etc etc etc.

Back then I was also looking at properties on the net, and the sites were a lot more chaotic that they are now. (I am getting to the point of what I want to say).

There was a guy selling his house near Sarlat. He had a well-written listing on the French Property News huge jumbled-up list of assorted properties. His listing pointed you to a website he had set up. This was a master class of how to make a property desirable.

The photos were all sunny and attractive, the text was seductive with the ‘glass of wine watching the sun set after a lazy day investigating the markets in Sarlat’ touches. There were plans of the house explaining the possibilities in each room. The text let you know that the local farmer took care of the garden whilst they were away and somebody took care of the pool and the lawn. On top of all this the furniture was included and there was an old car and a mobilette thrown in with the sale. Talk about a complete turnkey sale.

I emailed the guy to congratulate him on a great website and he told me that an Irish couple had flown out the next weekend and bought it. They knew more about the place than the neighbour who showed them round.

As I said earlier the world was younger then and the economic was different. Talking to a local estate agent she said that the French market for houses under €200,000 was healthy but above that less hot. If you are looking to sell to the French then they know what sells at what price, good luck.

If you want to sell to the British, Irish or not-French buyers I humbly submit that you must also sell the dream and as the guy with the house outside Sarlat did make the potential buyer feel that they are buying a turnkey dream. So I advocate getting a website done stressing all the positives. By all means bait the dream by saying that you are selling at a price that will never be equalled.

I don’t know your property or what it looks like on the sales sites but I have seen too many houses on private sales property websites that have a desperate “Hey, it has all go wrong for me and I am having to sell at a sad loss” properties. The message is “Hey I need another looser to take this off my hands.”

So perception, perception, perception.

Never forget you are selling a dream. Get a website built that sells ‘great property, turnkey sale, all the information you need, sharp price. Question is how do you drive the potential buyers towards the site? Small ad in French Property News? Ad in the Lady? In the Royal Academy’s magazine? Think about magazines that those dreaming about “the glass of wine watching the sun go down”. The ad should not need to be big as it should only say ‘Great house for sale, just look at this website’.

Bon chance.

[P-D de Rouffignac]

If a house has been on the market for six months and you have had a few viewings and no offers, then it's time to take a hard look at your property and ask yourself Why? Currently property sales are NOT significantly down on previous years and programmes such as 'Maison à vendre' (Channel M6) - which I recommend - regularly show how completely hopeless cases end up being sold. It is rarely (just) a question of price, but decor, presentation, numerous unfinished DIY jobs, old fasioned furniture in a house that would attract young buyers, etc etc.

If you are not using an agent (among other things to get an estimate of potential sale price) I'd take a look at similar properties to yours and/or properties that are similarly priced but perhaps more attractive than yours. Private sellers often have an inflated view of the value of their property, not just in cash terms but sentimental value as well. You need to be totally dispassionate and follow the above guidelines and those of the TV programme mentioned above.

Hope this helps - P-D de R.

 

 

[londoneye]

Hi

Thanks everyone - I know what you mean about selling the dream - that is what I am hoping a PR company might do for me, for less money than I would probably spend myself trying - still working on that one (well, only just started working on it, last couple of days).

P-D R I was actually hoping you would respond because I know you are in the 'business'.   We are using an agent (as well as on-line sites) and when we decreased the price slightly in March to bring it into a different price 'range' they told us they thought it was too early and that the price was correct.

Our neighbours and friends are delusional regarding price and tell us that our price is at least 100,000 less than it 'should' be.    We are, I believe, fairly realistic ... as far as I can see our kind of property is actually priced more favourably than a lot of similar properties, but it's hard in France isn't it, there are some many different kinds of properties.    I take your point however, everyone has a blind spot to their own property (bit like thinking your kids are all gorgeous).

We are willing to drop the price but unfortunately I just can't seem to find an immobilier I trust enough to tell me what the most realistic price would be for a quick sale !    And I am not against estate agents - I am one of the minority who has been lucky enough to find absolutely great estate agents in the past (admittedly in UK) but sadly seems not to be the case in this area.

P-D R - any views on auctions in France please ?

[Sprogster]

Peter, I bow to your greater experience, but in my opinion there is currently a significant regional variability in the French housing market. So although property sales on average across France are not significantly down, this statistic is distorted by booming areas such as Paris. By contrast some rural areas that were over dependent on Brit buyers, are badly affected.

Also a lot depends on the price range, as the top and bottom ends of the market seem more resilient, with the middle market much quieter, probably because buyers in this segmenty are more reliant on bank finance, which can still be difficult to obtain.

[P-D de Rouffignac]

A couple of quick replies:

Auctions - seems to be only the case in connexion with wills, probate, enforced sales where there is a legal requirement to try and achieve the highest price. Re estate agents - you can employ more than one, get an estimate(s), agree the commission rate, sign a mandate for as little as 3 months, cancel if not satisfied.

Property sales - According to latest FNAIM report, based on current activity, the number of overall sales expected to be 750 000 during 2011, compared with an average 850 000 pa during the boom years and 570 000 in the worst year. All points taken about variations from area to area, but the same FNAIM report said price reductions (apartments) earlier this year were recorded in only four cities - Annecy, Chateauroux, Perpignan and Reims.

Regards, P-D de R.

[Sprogster]

Peter, a criticism I have heard about these FNAIM stats, is that they are distorted by the current Paris property bubble, which has seen property values increase by over twenty per cent during the last year and that if you extrapolate the Paris market, average property values elsewhere in France are at best static.

[nectarine]

Renaud's answer is excellent .... get yourself a website and sell the dream, that way you can place cheap ads in lots of places. For pricing, why not ask your local notaire to have a look and give some advice ... they'd be dealing with the sale when it goes through and will have an idea of what's a realistic price.

But to sell ... the answer is promote, promote, promote. Tell everyone to tell everyone else, get friends in firms to put a little ad on their notice board and in their firm's magazine, go on every property marketing site you can find. Ring up the newspapers and ask if they want an article written about selling in France (newspapers are always short of copy) and submit it ... with your website address on the end.

Good luck, I wish you well.

[londoneye]

Many thanks to everyone who replied.

I am going to re-read all the responses in next couple of days and I am sure will be inspired to move forward again.

Sadly I had a bereavement today, so will probably not be answering if anyone else posts in the next few days - but please accept my thanks in advance if you do and be assured I will read and digest any thoughts/advice given.

xx