Moon gardening

[Cassis]

Re the gravitational power of the moon and its ability to suck up sap or water, force it back down, etc.  Given that the moon is so far away, would suspending a large ball of lead immediately above a plant or a person's head have a similar effect to a full moon? 

I know that the tides are due to moon gravity, but that doesn't necessarily mean it's a powerful force.  Isn't it a tiny affect built up over many millions of years? A bit like gently pushing a bowl of water from side to side, once you get into a rhythm the effects are much magnified.  Capillary action and transpiration can easily be measured, I'm not convinced (yet) that the moon's gravity acts on anything like the same scale of force.

Phil

[Poppy]

See I said on friday that there would be a frost this weekend. The man in the moon told me so [blink]

Here in the Lot as Inceni said 'though some say we live a good distance beyond nowhere' they do farm by the moon and we have lots and lots of gorgeous fruit and veg. We also have a wonderful but sometimes cruel climate, at the minute the days are boiling hot but the nights are freezing. I'm sure thats why madam in the village who usually has the best flower displays hasn't put her geraniums out yet.I will put mine out when she does.

Not sure whether after 16 years in the Lot  I am loony or lunar but with the Cahors wine I dont think it matters which [;-)]

Jan

Lost in the Lot

[saddie]

Funny, according to my calenders and gardening magazines the full moon is on the 13th May. What planet are you other people on?

[Cassis]

In  much earlier mail I agreed that it was frosty last night - I was assuming that as others said it had been a full moon then it was!  In fact I see it was actually a NEW moon on the 27th.  Where does that leave us?

Regardless, what does anyone think about the relative effects of the moon versus a ball of lead (see a couple of posts above)?

Phil

[Poppy]

We have had hail storms in May during a full moon. The hail was the size of golf balls, same affect as lead on tender plants. You can check the records vines were wiped out.

Jan

[Cassis]

Plus how many times do we get hail when there isn't a full moon?  I'd be willing to bet just as many.  If there were scientific evidence of the moon affecting weather - and it wouldn't be too ahrd for them to check -  wouldn't the Met office take it into account and maybe even mention phases of the moon in their forecasts?

I think the weather issue is a red herring - hasn't it got to be more to do with whether the moon's gravity is strong enough to have a measurable effect on water levels and sap rising:falling?

[8-)]

[chirpy]

well as a fully paid up member of a local gardening club where we have had lectures on this subject the only question i raised was the objectional hours and the need for good lighting during the middle of the night when we were supposed to plant.!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!![:@][:P][:D][8-)]

[Poppy]

After 16 years I think it has to do with the moon surely weather and gravity are related.. I feel it is particularly noticeable in the months of  April and May, don't know why but have noticed it at this time of the year .

Jan 

[Patf]

It was me who said that there was a new moon this weekend - Friday

night. I've had a puzzled look through my Rustica poster, Jardinez avec

la lune, and it's the ascendance/descendance of the moon which affects

planting most  combined with waxing and waning plus the zodiac

sign so it's very complicated. Just an example : tomorrow 1st May -

tonight at midnight changes from acend to descend for two weeks, zodiac

sign Leo, moon waxing. Favourable for flowers for 3 days. Finish

planting cannas, gladiolas etc and start

to put in place annuals grown from seed. If your broccolis and

cauliflowers seeded 23&24 April have 3 or 4 fine leaves, thin out.

If not wait until 12 or 13 May . If only! Pat. ps MikeJan - Your point

about April May - it also applies Sept. Oct. Something to do with the

spring and autumn equinox which is when you get very high tides.

[Poppy]

 Patf According to the man in the moon and madam in the village that sounds spot on . The 3 or 4 fine leaves is a very important point. for all plants. I'm not joking I will have the best garden award for 6 years running..

You are also  correct re Sept/ Oct  it is another change everything will start to die.

Jan

[Cassis]

I have never heard of that before, weather being affected by gravity of the moon.  Just put a quick search in for moon and weather on google and among a few 'fringe' sites there was one that at least seemed to have the merit of some scientific authority (assuming you can believe anything at all on the Internet).

The effect of the moon on weather is indirect in that the moon affects
ocean tides that can alter ocean currents that can affect weather. To your
second question, yes also, the gravitational pull of the moon does produce
atmospheric "tides"; however, the effect, while measurable is small and
overwhelmed by other atmospheric factors. Another effect, that while known
and measured for several decades at least, has recently begun to receive
more attention by geologists is the tidal effect of  land masses. In
particular new satellites that can measure the topology of the earth show
unmistakable "ups and downs" due to the gravitational pull of the moon. It
has been hypothesized that these small shifts might be correlated with
earthquakes and/or volcanic activity.
Vince Calder
====================================================
Donald,
The atmosphere, being a fluid, is affected by the moon,
resulting in an Atmospheric Tide, a wave that propagates
through the atmosphere.  However, the increase in
atmospheric pressure that occurs at the front edge of
the wave is so slight that it is hard to detect from
the myriad of other waves that are always present in
the atmosphere.
David R. Cook
Atmospheric Research Section
Environmental Research Division
Argonne National Laboratory
====================================================
Dear Donald-
   The moon has no statistical effect on the weather...there is a minute
effect on atmospheric pressure.
   "Tides are raised in the earth's solid crust and atmosphere as well as in
the oceans. Every body in the universe has some tidal effect, however small,
on every other body. This effect is directly proportional to the mass of the
body causing the tide but inversely proportional to the cube of the distance
between the bodies. The earth's nearby moon is about 2.17 times as effective
as the more massive sun in raising tides on the earth, even though the sun
exerts a much greater total force on the earth than does the moon. Thus, the
moon's proximity explains its dominant role in creating tides."  See this
link for more details...
http://www.infoplease.com/ce6/sci/A0861550.html
   There are atmospheric "tides" but they are mainly due to heating of the
upper atmosphere by the sun.  They cause a diunral pressure variation, with
the maxima around 10 a.m. and 10 p.m. each day, with minima around 4 a.m.
and 4 p.m.
Here is a link explaining this phenomena...
   http://www-das.uwyo.edu/~geerts/cwx/notes/chap01/diurnal.html
   And here is an interesting fact...atmospheric tides were a factor in the
period of rotation of the planet Venus, which has a much denser atmosphere
than the Earth.  Here is a link to further explain that...
    http://www.imcce.fr/Equipes/ASD/Venus/venus1_en.html
Wendell Bechtold, meteorologist
Forecaster, National Weather Service
Weather Forecast Office, St. Louis, MO
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Expect major atmospheric upheaval if you see the cow jumping over the moon.
Prof E. Spoon
University of Oz
Kansas

OK, so I made the last one up ....

Phil

[Poppy]

Didn't notice the difference in the UK but do notice it here. The day time temps are so different from the night they are beyond comprehension. Mid afternoon  is boiling hot, we go to bed at 23.00  comfortable,wake up at 5.00 freezing cold..No wonder the plants are confused. 

The farmers in the area however don't seem confused. They know exactly when to to plough and when to plant. wonder why?

Jan

[Cassis]

[quote user="Mikejan"]

The farmers in the area however don't seem confused. They know exactly when to to plough and when to plant. wonder why?

[/quote]

Maybe they follow Old Moore's Almanack?

Phil

[:)][:)][:)]

[Cassis]

I think we can trust the horny-handed peasants of Lithuania to have the true low-down on this matter; here's an extract from an article online:

"When the Moon was young mostly the cereals were sown,

especially the spring-crops, planted and replanted flowers. Also it was a good time to cut

hair, to shear sheep and trim horses tails, to cut hay and clover (to make them grow

better and be of better quality), hens are expected to perch (to perch more hens than

roosters and they could lay more eggs), the cows were coupled (to conceive female calves)

etc. But because of the above reasons a lot of things in this period were forbidden. It

was not recommended to plant leguminous plants, rye and many vegetables. It was expected

that their period of efflorescence may be too long and profuse but the fruit will not be

good and worm ridden. This was unsuitable period for:

- putting the crop into the granary and thrashing because

the grain will be besieged by rats;

- building structures, laying fire stoves, cleaning chimneys, digging new and repairing

old wells (because they may be raided by different parasites);

- making and cleaning clothes, taking baths (the body will grow itchy and become lousy);

- spinning (because the thread will not be strong);

- weaving (because the thread will be uneven);

- slaughtering pigs (the meet will not keep and rot soon, also will lose its taste);

- pickling cabbage (because it will be soft, slimy and rot quickly)."

For more, much more, in the same vein see http://ausis.gf.vu.lt/eka/eastr/moon3.html

Phil

[Pangur]

My elderly neighbour gives me regular weather forecasts based on the moon's activities - I didn't realise it was so popular!  I was a bit bemused by all this moon talk at the start.  He's normally pretty acurate, in fairness.

He also told us that the movements of the moon also used to govern the cutting of wood for building - he claims the wood in our roof, like all traditional roofs in our area, was cut down in winter, at a particular moon cycle and that this helps ensure the quality of wood. No, not sure how it works either.  He's very dismissive of modern building techniques...

[Cassis]

Ah, the good old ways are always the best.  With the old techniques you never needed these fancy ventilation systems to circulate air round the house.  You could just rely on the gaps in the roof and walls.

[:)]

[Dick Smith]

Dendrochronolgy shows that most 'old' wood was cut in the spring. Just like nowadays...