pachapapa Posted January 26, 2012 Author Share Posted January 26, 2012 [quote user="Salty Sam"][quote user="pachapapa"] As I understand it, free had to have more than 25% coverage of the population before being allowed to commence operations.[/quote]Now that statement brings a smile to my face. "25% of the population" is easily achieved if one looks where the masses reside. Free can easily achieve their 25% by calculating their existing provision to city and large urban sprawls.It certainly doesn't mean that outside those high populous areas, Free will suddenly invest in the technology to provide cover where the big providers have previously recognised it is not cost effective. So, in lesser populated areas with minimal or no cover, Free will not have a service provider to piggyback upon so, still no service![quote user="pachapapa"]Perhaps you could usefully spend time over the weekend, as it will be cold, checking out for us the recent 4G arrangements resolved by the Haute Autorité for SFR and Free.[I][/quote]Ah yes, 4G! No doubt the French service providers will promise coverage for xx% of the population - at a price!Shame about the remainder of the population not living in the big town or city who will just have to make do - if they can receive a signal at all that is![/quote]Sorry out of date, now 30%. Read C's post.4G is curious as all the TNT will go HD MPEG4 and then the MPEG2 frequencies will be recycled for 4G.Note these will be lower frequencies with better penetration of 80 cm thick walls; lower frequencies than the ones auctioned this month.Xavier with a customer base of 30 million will then suck them up like a hoover. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pachapapa Posted January 26, 2012 Author Share Posted January 26, 2012 PDG Free reply on association with Orange:Le sujet du partenariat avec Orange a également été particulièrement abordé : « Nous avons un contrat commercial avec Orange parce que nous estimons qu’ils ont le meilleur réseau. Nous avons de très bons rapports avec les équipes et ils ont toujours investi pour la qualité. Le contrat repose sur le degré d’utilisation de leur réseau et avec des prépaiements importants. Il est très intéressant pour Orange, mais nous avons accepté de payer plus cher pour garantir la performance du réseau. »The "full monty" Senate Q&A click video window in following link.http://www.pcinpact.com/news/68547-xavier-niel-commission-assemblee-nationale-questions-defense.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pachapapa Posted January 26, 2012 Author Share Posted January 26, 2012 [quote user="Chancer"]It was another dirty tricks campaign probably with Orange or Bouygues behind it, after falling flat with the rumours that very few people with Free mobiles will be able to make calls as Free only have antennas covering 30% of the population and many of those were not working they then publicised pictures of a workshop test bed set up (lash up) which included a Freebox V5 and claimed it was the inner workings of one of Free's antenna stations.[/quote]The photo was taken with an iPhone 4 ; guess wher you arrive if you follow the GPS footprint from the photo data.[:D]See link:http://www.pcinpact.com/news/68543-orange-free-mobile-antenne.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salty Sam Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 [quote user="pachapapa"] Sorry out of date, now 30%. Read C's post.25, 30, or 50%! UK providers advertise 98% of the population, and there are still plenty of blank spots. Population coverage is not the same as terrestial coverage.4G is curious as all the TNT will go HD MPEG4 and then the MPEG2 frequencies will be recycled for 4G.Nothing whatsoever to do cell phone operation which the last time I looked was what this thread was all about, but if you believe 4G will be provided and accessible to all - so be it! Note these will be lower frequencies with better penetration of 80 cm thick walls; lower frequencies than the ones auctioned this month.Xavier with a customer base of 30 million will then suck them up like a hoover.[/quote] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pachapapa Posted January 26, 2012 Author Share Posted January 26, 2012 [quote user="Salty Sam"][quote user="pachapapa"] Sorry out of date, now 30%. Read C's post.25, 30, or 50%! UK providers advertise 98% of the population, and there are still plenty of blank spots. Population coverage is not the same as terrestial coverage.4G is curious as all the TNT will go HD MPEG4 and then the MPEG2 frequencies will be recycled for 4G.Nothing whatsoever to do cell phone operation which the last time I looked was what this thread was all about, but if you believe 4G will be provided and accessible to all - so be it! Note these will be lower frequencies with better penetration of 80 cm thick walls; lower frequencies than the ones auctioned this month.Xavier with a customer base of 30 million will then suck them up like a hoover.[/quote][/quote]Regarding terrestial[:D]coverage, do you mean there are more people per square km in Paree than Patagonia.The ARCEP required Free to have 27% coverage not 25%. Free has actually experienced some problems in achieving this figure as the placing of antennas has been difficult in Paris.Free has accordingly concentrated on large urban conurbations to get the required bums on seats.But of course if you had followed dilligently the french press and Senate enquiries you would have known this and saved me the trouble of regurgitating it to the utmost boredom of most everyone else.[6] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quillan Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 How do they know that? The photo that they use does not actually show the Free router but a Orange 'business router'. It's not the same photo as the one at the top of the page with the Free router. If you click on the photo linked to the GPS coordinates it will enlarge and you can see. About the only thing the same is the colour of the door. Definitely a bit of skulduggery going on all round I think.I also think 4G will come latter than expected and when it does it will be far too expensive for many personal users. The good news may be that business users will be able to move to 4g quite quickly thus freeing up more of the 3g network which also may become cheaper. I understand the biggest problem that the trials in the UK have shown is battery life when running in 4g mode. I am sure this will be fixed in the next couple of years. I also read that rolling out 4g physically in the UK has had a few problems and they may be talking 2013/14 before it becomes operational in big cities. If your out in the stick's then your out of luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salty Sam Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 [quote user="Quillan"]I also think 4G will come latter than expected and when it does it will be far too expensive for many personal users. The good news may be that business users will be able to move to 4g quite quickly thus freeing up more of the 3g network which also may become cheaper. I understand the biggest problem that the trials in the UK have shown is battery life when running in 4g mode. I am sure this will be fixed in the next couple of years. I also read that rolling out 4g physically in the UK has had a few problems and they may be talking 2013/14 before it becomes operational in big cities. If your out in the stick's then your out of luck.[/quote]You've highlighted but a few of the problems Q[:(]. It's reported speeds have not been achieved, compatible phones not connecting to the network, and more.As you correctly say, 4G is for the big cities - not for the sticks! As for 'piggy-back' services, one only has to look at '3' in the UK. Where they don't have their own network, they piggy-back the O2 network - at reduced strength, and with dropped connections being a regular feature as 02's priority is to their own customers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pachapapa Posted January 26, 2012 Author Share Posted January 26, 2012 Excerpt from the Click BBC programme earlier this month.http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programmes/click_online/9672822.stm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pachapapa Posted January 26, 2012 Author Share Posted January 26, 2012 Free have a 4G 2.4 MHz licence but missed out on the 800 kHz auction but can piggy back SFR who got 2 licences; however Free have the ONLY national WiMax licence which they would be allowed to LTE ise after 2016. There will also be some 2/3G Spectrum for re-cycling in 2014/2015. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salty Sam Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 [quote user="pachapapa"]Regarding terrestial[:D]coverage, do you mean there are more people per square km in Paree than Patagonia.[/quote]My mistake, I meant to say "UK providers advertised 98% coverage of the country," when in reality they should have stated "98% of the population."So yes, there are more people per square km in Paree than Patagonia, the Falklands, or Deux-Sèvres! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quillan Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 [quote user="pachapapa"]Excerpt from the Click BBC programme earlier this month.http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programmes/click_online/9672822.stm[/quote]I think this film highlights much of whats been said really but the main thing is if you live in a big town or a city then you will be OK but out in the real sticks (the rural location was just outside a large town if you read the signpost) your be very lucky. Also it shows that it's fast but as more people use it then it will become slower. Switched data transfer can only go so fast and as more people use it the slower the individual speed becomes. Then there is the price, far higher than what most ordinary folk can afford. I think you will find that it will be commercial users that will become the biggest users of 4G. The very first section of the film says it all really. The young mother, it appears, can't even afford a Freeview receiver for her telly so I doubt that once the free testing is over she can afford the cost of 4G. Then there is France with some of the highest charges for mobile phones in the EU, one can only imagine what the charges will be here. I doubt very much, after the cost of the licences, that Free will be able to offer substantial discounts compared to other operators. They all have to claw back their investment as quickly as possible. Anyway we will have to wait and see, I might be right or I might be wrong, we will only really know when it arrives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chancer Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 I dont even know what 4G is, nor a smartphone for that matter, neither do I really want to but even without knowing I can add something to the debate.Free have been quetly investing in their own fibre optic network for several years, they now have most of the large villes linked I believe and this program continues, that and not having to date any boutiques (OK they have 2 I believe) gives them a massive and sustainable competitive advantage over the other operators, the cabling project is ongoing so their advantage increases, I have no idea how this relates to this 4G thingy you are all talking about.Free have said that they will eventually have 100 boutiques which goes against all their principals, I dont know whether this is the result of regulator pressure, if it isnt then they sure must be thinking of a huge market penetration. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quillan Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 [quote user="Chancer"]I dont even know what 4G is, nor a smartphone for that matter, neither do I really want to but even without knowing I can add something to the debate.Free have been quetly investing in their own fibre optic network for several years, they now have most of the large villes linked I believe and this program continues, that and not having to date any boutiques (OK they have 2 I believe) gives them a massive and sustainable competitive advantage over the other operators, the cabling project is ongoing so their advantage increases, I have no idea how this relates to this 4G thingy you are all talking about.Free have said that they will eventually have 100 boutiques which goes against all their principals, I dont know whether this is the result of regulator pressure, if it isnt then they sure must be thinking of a huge market penetration.[/quote]4G is the forth generation for mobile phone speeds with regards to (mainly) data. Bit like you have 3G dongles at the moment for laptops so you can use them out and about and 3G mobile phones that allow you to down load stuff like films and watch them on your phone. Would you want to watch a film on a phone or even a tablet, probably not but then when your bored, like waiting for the wife whilst shopping, you might be tempted just as something to do. I have tried films on my Samsung S2 and actually they are not that bad, in fact very good all things considered and it is in HD as well. Business people will be the biggest winners, downloading documents for meeting in an emergency ect, if your a computer engineer or programmer to get hold of stuff away from site but for the rest of us it's of no real advantage. One area that may be of interest is using a 4G dongle if you have poor Internet. Shove one of these in to your computer and you should realistically get somewhere around 20gb speed with no problem, possibly even faster. But then as we have seen theres the cost. Would you for instance be happy to pay around 60 Euros per month (with limited quantity according to Telia) just for Internet at that speed?Going back to Free. I really don't have a problem with them and as I said may well use them for Mrs 'Q's phone. As I can't get an Orange signal at my house it's no good to me at present. What is good is that it has really shaken up the industry in France where historically the monthly charge for mobiles has always been very high. It is forcing the others to reevaluate and drop their prices. This can only be a good thing for everyone. Perhaps once they (Free) have run these new cables in their Internet will also become really cheap approaching prices in the UK like £5.00 per month unlimited download (Sky, Virgin and Orange). For too long these French companies have dictated what we can and cannot have at take it or leave it prices.What I would really like to see is an operator who offers variable prices for the services they offer. By this a I mean first you select the amount of hours you want per month then the number of text's and finally, if you want it, data download quantity. Like three sliders that you can adjust and get a figure at the end tailored exactly to your needs without ripping you off. I think that would be a really neat idea.So I look forward to the next six months. I think it will be very interesting. Even though the likes of Orange and SFR say they won't get in a price war I think their prices will come down even more, not nesessarily matching or less than Free but a bit closer giving people better choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gyn_Paul Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 [quote user="Chancer"]I dont even know what 4G is, nor a smartphone for that matter, neither do I really want to but even without knowing I can add something to the debate.Free have been quetly investing in their own fibre optic network for several years, they now have most of the large villes linked I believe and this program continues, that and not having to date any boutiques (OK they have 2 I believe) gives them a massive and sustainable competitive advantage over the other operators, the cabling project is ongoing so their advantage increases, I have no idea how this relates to this 4G thingy you are all talking about.Free have said that they will eventually have 100 boutiques which goes against all their principals, I dont know whether this is the result of regulator pressure, if it isnt then they sure must be thinking of a huge market penetration.[/quote]it would be nice to think Free is running its fibre-optic cables along the railway lines: we have one at the top of our front field =/< 80m. might get a decent download speed at last!p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chancer Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 I believe that they were. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pachapapa Posted January 28, 2012 Author Share Posted January 28, 2012 Orange, SFR and Bouygue demand a technical evaluation of the efficacity of Fee ADSL Boxes in Mobile Base Stations.[:)]http://www.20minutes.fr/economie/868450-regulateur-telecoms-va-verifier-reseau-free-mobile Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NormanH Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 Niel has really got up their noses [:P] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quillan Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 Seems Eric Besson (Minister of Industry and Digital Economy) Has been asking question's of the official 'watch dog' as to Free's ability to provide the service it claims and to ensure Orange is sticking to it's roaming agreement with them.http://www.lefigaro.fr/medias/2012/01/27/20004-20120127ARTFIG00333-free-mobile-besson-presse-l-arcep-de-controler-le-reseau.phpThis is another situation that has got a long way to run. In the meantime what about the users, it's always the little man (or woman) that suffers.I read somewhere else last night (one of the French papers, can't remember which) that most of the SIM's were sent out in the past week (after sorting their initial problems bought about by over subscription) and many should be dropping through peoples letterbox's today and Monday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NormanH Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 And who pulls Besson's strings? A good friend of Martyn Bouygues [:D] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quillan Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 That's what I mean when I said before how 'incestuous' it all is. Talk about a country that is supposed to be classless with equality for all. I bet the old revolutionaries will be turning in their grave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NormanH Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 Now Besson seems to be trying to speed up the process of changing over your present number:*http://www.lefigaro.fr/societes/2012/01/31/20005-20120131ARTFIG00365-free-mobile-besson-demande-de-doubler-la-portabilite.php Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NormanH Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 I now have my two cards.The cheapo one (PAYG) worked first time, but the one which was with SFR is messing me about, as did SFR all the time I have been with them in fact... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pachapapa Posted February 1, 2012 Author Share Posted February 1, 2012 Orange PDG attempts to justify profit margin on mobile phone business.http://www.20minutes.fr/ledirect/871328/orange-realise-marge-ordre-35-telephonie-mobile-france Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NormanH Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 Now both cards received and working except the 3G for one. Free helpline said it takes 48 hours from the portage de numéro for all features to work fully Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pachapapa Posted February 2, 2012 Author Share Posted February 2, 2012 SFR announced more competitive forfaits on thursday.http://www.lesechos.fr/entreprises-secteurs/tech-medias/actu/0201877557267-sfr-oblige-de-revoir-ses-offres-face-a-free-283555.php Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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