Woodworm fighting

[Morag]

I'm hoping someone on here might be able to help! We need to get the 300 yr old roof beams and attic floor treated for woodworm etc. We've had a company in to look at it and they seemed to think that we didn't need to worry about cleaning off the the birds nests from the beams and the layer of ancient agricultural mud and muck from the floor 'cos the treatment would deal with everything! Ummmmm.... everything we've seen about treatment (on the backs of cans mostly!) says you need to make sure everything is clean, so the question is "who's right?" They also say it'll just take a day to put in lots of little plastic plugs in the wood and spray everything twice over - are we being taken for a ride here? At a cost of around 3.5K plus vat I'm beginning to think we're in the wrong business - fighting woodworm sounds less stressful than fighting Year 10.... Thanks in advnace to all (or any) who might have an answer.

Mo

PS they also said they won't guarantee the floor - it's too eaten, tho the topside looks fine to me... that might be the mud hiding zillions of holes, of course!

[Nick Trollope]

[quote]I'm hoping someone on here might be able to help! We need to get the 300 yr old roof beams and attic floor treated for woodworm etc. We've had a company in to look at it and they seemed to think that...[/quote]

Whatt hey do is drill the beams and inject fluid into the core of the timber. Cleaning won't be necessary as a result. They will probably spray externally too, but dirt will retain the fluid, I guess, which could be advantageous.

If they won't guarantee any part, then I guess that it is too bad! You could always get another quote...

 

[Morag]

[quote]Whatt hey do is drill the beams and inject fluid into the core of the timber. Cleaning won't be necessary as a result. They will probably spray externally too, but dirt will retain the fluid, I guess,...[/quote]

Thanks Nick - I'm still at a loss tho, cos we told the chappie that all the beams will be left showing. How will the treatment spread thru all the wood? The oak up there is like rock! And won't the treatment all come off when we clean up the beams to finish them?

Anyway, I'll see if there's another company with another view on the matter of treating birds nests! They might charge us less if we tell them the birds don't have woodworm!

[oh]

Mo

Having recently discovered a problem heres how I understand it.

Firstly you need to clean the beams a thouroughly as possible, the dirt absorbs the chemicals and prevents it reaching the wood and doing any good.

For the floor, if they say its that far gone have a poke with a screw drivwr, if it feels rotten replace, otherwise treat. But, spraying timbers only protects the outside and about the first 6mm of the wood, which is fine for woodworm as they have to eat their way to the surface periodically and will therefore die, but beatles and such dont, so will eat their way down into the timbers below, delaying the problem and eventually making it worse.

Injecting beams works well, its high pessure injection so it forces the treatment into and throughout the beams, but the plugs are ugly, so try to persuade the bloke whos doing it to choose a side you are not leaving exposed.

You do need to spray twice, but not within 24 hours, as it just saturates the wood and prevents the chemical from absorbing properly. And according to several people in the 'know' around here, proffesionals use Termikok because its the best (just check out the price!), but if used you need to ideally leave the house for three days after as its so dangerous! (not sure about this, but having looked at it I can see why!)

ON the guarantee front, reputable companies do guarantee, and at that money I would expect it. Or, and this is a path Im thinking of, get you own pump (around £600) and do it yourself, I might get shot to pieces for anything I have said so far, and this, but its not rocket science!!

p.s. sorry for being so long winded!

oh

[Dave&Olive]

hi

       k3.5 to fight woodworm a bit o.t.t. think you should look for past postings on this topic it has been covered very well.

so in a nutshell this is from past postings

1 when you start to live in the property the moisture content in the wood will drop below the level that woodworm need to thrive

2 clean all your beams and diy it with xylothene, if you use the water based one it does not smell as bad.

3 buy the treatment when on promo this will save you a lot of dosh eg. price now is say €100 for 25 ltrs .. price on promo in prob june i think €35 for 30ltrs .

4 buy a good face mask and gloves it takes your skin off and is toxic and buy a back pack type sprayer.

i have done our house using the above method total cost was less than €500 including all the safety equipment and sprayer( the wife now uses this for weed killer so not a one off). and no sign of saw dust anywhere.

        just for info good luck

               dave

oh and ps the french thought we went way way o.t.t. on the treatment they do not think w.w. is a problem

 

now termites walkaway walkaway  ect ect........

[storeysinfrance]

mo

dave - in the last post - was quite correct in all he said...

in brief (and if you've the energy and inclination) do it yourself... paying 3.5k is (to my way of thinking) absurd...

if the roof is 300 years old then the beams themselves will be even older, like you say they're as solid as a rock and thus a good coating of zylophene (can't spell it) which comes in clear to dark oak colourants will suffice... either spary it on or, as we did, paint it on... preferably two coats but, quite honestly, one will suffice.

before you do that, do clean the beams down - its a mucky old job this but we've found the best way is to use an angle grinder... pick one up cheaply on promo (leclerc i think do them for less than 20 euros) and use a sanding disk... we did our cottage a frame and other exposed beams and used no more than 5 disks and they look absolutely superb now... just remember to wear a good mask as the dust etc is horrendous but, even after 5 minutes you'll start to see the beginnings of a fabulous result... then zylophene them and hey presto, something to be dead proud of and a whole load cheaper than getting someone in to inject them!

bonne chance

neil (24)

[Deimos]

I read somewhere (on this forum I think, but I’m not going to waste my time on the search facility) that the Xylo… products (i.e. the stuff you can buy in the Bricos) needs to be re-applied every year or every few years whereas the professionally applied systems don’t (i.e. have much longer life).

Is this the case as I am looking to convert an attic (the roof is not Oak) and the plaster boarding will make the rafters, etc. inaccessible. I thus felt it a good idea to have the wood work treated before doing the conversion as a precautionary measure. Could do it myself but would not be able to re-apply after the conversion has been done so need to do something decent and long lasting.

Many thanks

Ian

[Ron Avery]

[quote]mo dave - in the last post - was quite correct in all he said... in brief (and if you've the energy and inclination) do it yourself... paying 3.5k is (to my way of thinking) absurd... if the roof...[/quote]

Sorry Neil but what you and dave have done is no treatment at all for beams.   If you really think a zylophene spray over oak beams is going to provide any sort of prevention against woodboring insects then dream on.  Its not woodworm you need to worry about,  its termites and capricorn and the former gets in through the end grain where it sits in the wall.

Zylophene soaks into hard wood as little as 25mm and that is it.  For boards its ok to paint it on two or three generous coats but pressure spraying as Dave did is much better. But for beams the ONLY effective treatment is pressure injection.  So as far as D-I-Y is concerned,  if you can get a compressor and spray equipment and then a drill and cable and spray equipment cables all up ladders to a ceiling as high as 8 metres, then good luck to you, personally I was very happy to let a man who knows what he was doing get up there and do it.

Ian

Zylophene does not need renewing every year or so, Its says on the tin that it is effective for 10 years.  As the professionals also use it there is no difference at all in how long it stays effective, except of course when you spray beams with it and that is not effective for 10 minutes let alone 10 years  You do need to repeat the initial coats after a couple of hours if you are hand applying to new or infected timber boards

[Deimos]

Ron, am I right in thinking Xylo… is best applied by hand (brush) or by spray (in my case its all softwood not Oak for the roof concerned). If I did it myself I would prefer by hand, provided it is effective. I will probably get quotes as well as it’s a fair area (75 sq m floor area with a single “simple” roof (i.e. straight ridge down the middle).

Many thanks

Ian

[Ron Avery]

Ian

I think you will find there are two types of xylophene in 25 + litre drums, one is like water for spraying, the other a little thicker for hand application.  You can also buy it in wood stain colours so you colour and treat at the same time.  The professionals use a pressure spray, but if you are treating roof boards or floor boards you can paint them, but a garden type pressure spray as suggested by Dave may be a better bet.  If you are sure that you do not have any infestation,  you can give roof beams a spray to deter wood boring insects but that still leaves you open to termites if you are south of the Loire.

[Deimos]

I’ve only seen one variant of xylo… so was not aware of the two types. I’m told its dangerous stuff so am unsure about spraying.

Just north of Le Loir – about 30 miles north of La Loire so I guess termites may be a risk. At the moment the roof is pretty open (i.e. I can see al the woodwork and tiles) and the idea is preventative before enclosing it. Its softwood not Oak. What is best for insects and termites.

Many thanks (and apologies for hijacking this thread a bit)

Ian

[Ron Avery]

Ian

Xylo is water based and compared to the old stuff fairly odourless, it is made for the D-I-Yer so its not particularly noxious or toxic. Its not completely harmless though and exposure to the spray needs to be limited, you need to take precautions as if spraying with paint, with plasticised gauntlets,  eye protection, a good mask, a visor is best.  It is not particularly harmful to skin although any cuts or grazes should be covered and you should wash of any excess on the skin ASAP.  It will, soak much better into softwoods, that is why a lot of English people think a quick spray ala Cure or Rentokill will do the trick here on oak and chestnut, but it doesn't.

[Dave&Olive]

hi

 would like to keep this post going for a bit .. it was 6 months ago i treated our roof and beams , so will have to dig out the research i did on it ( the old tins are still in the barn) yes i know you idle sod should have dumped them but ,,so busy at mo ..

              but rem it come in about 5-6 variations water based spirit based 10 warrenty gold was 20 year for brush os sray.

        rem trying the spirit based stuff in the sprayer with all the safty kit on and it run down the rubber gloves up my arm an took the top 3 layers of skin off ... so not dangerous ??? and you must vacate the propery for 12hours ..Olive and her cats no way ..

           read the instructions I do not speak french well but ... well you will understand them .. charpents and  will look deman

                  dave