Gluestick

Said Dave and all the other motley lying bunch of Europhiles, of: 1.    An EU joint military force. 2.    Turkey joining the EU. Remember? See here:

[quote user="alittlebitfrench"]If I bought a new house that run on oil, I personally would not invest in a 'new' oil boiler. I think that money could be better spent in insulation and other heating technologies.[/quote] Or even "RAN"... That said. what a sweeping statement! Depends on the geographical area; the size and type of the house; and whether it was possible, for example, to retro-fit underfloor wet heating, using Geothermal Energy. Which costs; boy does it cost! As Stevedeisel and I calculated on here some years back when this perennial came up years back, one also needs to compute mortality and amortisation of cost and thus arrive at a pay back curve. Whilst it is eminently possible to retro-fit superior holistic insulation on some houses, it isn't possible to do this on all, realistically. For example, exterior cladding is wonderful. A chum in Spain had his nearly new posh villa upgraded (mainly to prevent sun heat raising the interior temp and costing a bundle for Aircon). Nice job. A £20,000, nice job..... I suppose one could install wood burners in each room..... [Www]

[quote user="Mike"]Hi...I know this is sometime later than your post but I was wondering if you could help....I'm thinking of buying a de Dietrich GTU C120 for about €8000 including installation. However, having looked elsewhere, boilers seem to be between 700 and 3000 euros. I just can't seem to fathom why the C120 is so expensive.[/quote] Simple answer. The de Deitrich is a condensing boiler which makes them circa 90% efficient, against a normal non-condensing boiler's circa 70%. Additionally, with Veismann boilers, they are the crême de la crême of domestic and industrial boilers. The de Deitrich uses a Ceramic Heat Exchanger, which is not only much more efficient, but also resists calcification to a far greater level than the usual stainless steel. The boiler casting itself is cast from Eutectic Iron, which again is far more resistant to corrosion, plus it has a For the Life of the Boiler Anodic Protection System to again prevent corrosion. Most similar anodes would require periodic replacement as they are a sacrificial form of electrolytic protection. All of the controls, detectors and process management systems in de Dietrich and or Veismann boilers are of a superior quality. A Condensing Boiler requires more complex control systems to a standard type. How does a Condensing boiler work and what's different to a "Normal boiler? The condensing boiler, captures the waste heat from the flu gases. This is passed through the heat exchanger, which extracts the heat (and is used to pre-warm the colder water returning to the system from the last rad in the series) and in cooling the gas, it becomes a condensate, which is discharged through a drain vent. [quote] I read a couple of bad reviews and some moderate but nothing extolling their virtues. I don't want to be a pain but you seem to be the only person I can find that's got one. Can you throw any light on what you paid and how much oil it uses and its reliability. Obviously any info/help would be greatly appreciated. Kind regards...Mike[/quote] As already stated, the amount of oil ANY boiler burns all depends on demand, i.e. how long it is on; the temperature you operate the system at, room by room, how many months per year heating is used, etc. Most critical is the building's Heat Loss and overall size. People always fail to grasp, any heating system is really only a classic Heat Engine: i.e. Energy In - Energy Out. Concerning the cost of a new boiler, well, you does the homework, makes your choice and pays the cash! Just remember, a 20% gain on efficiency means 20% less fuel consumed for a given level of heat demand. Mazout has varied in cost for our place from 30 cents/Litre back in 2001, thru nearly €1.20/Litre. At present the oil and gas market has collapsed and prices are on the floor. This will, however, change at some point forward. When? Me Crystal Ball exploded, sadly, from overuse! [:-))] Bon courage !

[quote user="Lehaut"]Is there a link between being a Remainer and the gates? Only in trying to shut it after the "horse" has bolted!![/quote]  No need to get on your high horse, LeHaut! [:D]

http://www.spiegel.de/politik/deutschland/geheimdienst-islamist-schleicht-sich-bei-verfassungsschutz-ein-a-1123676.html ( Go to Google; copy and paste and enter URL and Translate this page). Or if you read German well, See Here:

In this case, Wooly, it seems nomoss is a remain recidivist. And thus now realises the Gates must be shut, for various valid reasons. Which can be a wee bit tricky if one does not possess any gates to close! [:D]

[quote user="nomoss"]Although denied any vote, I was not in favour of leaving the EU, really for selfish reasons, but am gradually thinking differently, as the reaction to Brexit is starting to show the worst aspects of the EU and the Brussels elite. [/quote] This is THE MOST HONEST post I have seen on this forum! We all, at times, I am sure, support a position through selfish and personal reasons. To support a position because of embedded socio-political views and long-held desires, is the root of all evil. After love of money, of course.... P.S. Hope you have now sorted your new gates out, nomoss! [:)]

See here: Interesting weekend and beginning of a new week! Mad Mutti Merkel now demands the alternative media are silenced! Next is a proposal to set up a new internal spy service...again by Mad Mutti, no doubt drawing on her STASI experiences in her earlier life. Shades of the past. First censorship; next Secret Police; finally Mind Control and brain washing. And people are worried that Marine le Pen might become president? Loved this bit! "Mr. Juncker recognised the threat from insurgent eurosceptic parties in national elections, saying the EU “is entering a ‘last chance’ phase because the gulf between Europe’s citizens and the public and political action of the EU is growing ever wider…”" Oh dear oh dear; cannot have the pesky voters and citizens interfering in the way we mismanage the EU, now can we!

[quote]  ............Fillon’s programme “economically insane” for wanting to slash 500,000 public sector jobs.[/quote] And this is "Deliverable"?? Whereas: [quote]...............the FN tempted by their (undeliverable) promises [/quote] Surely, well worthwhile remembering how both Domenique de Villepin and indeed, Juppé himself both failed dismally in trying to break the embedded Social Contract? Even Lionel Jospin, the hard Socialist who introduced the 35 Hour week (With Martine Aubry) and created the social benefit structure which led to the present fiscal problems in France, tried and failed to raise this to 37 hours per week... ALL politicians "Promises" delivered on the stump prove tenuous in the arduous face of harsh reality.

Fascinating................... This thread reminds me of all those years ago, when I had taken my intermediate and was working (and studying for finals) in the City for a Belgian shipping line. Now in those far off halcyon days, freight rates had to be calculated from the ship's manifest for billing (using a comptometer, incidentally) and depended upon cube and weight and type of cargo. An older guy was one of our chums; and when he went out to lunch, a couple of us young pranksters, made up a spoof freight note for: Ten cases of De-Hydrated Water. The poor sap spent an hour tearing out his hair searching and searching what were called The Conference Books - Short Sea English Channel - for a rate! Eventually, we heard him ask his manager: "Sid, where can I find a rate for De-Hyd  r  a  t  e  d  W  a  t................. "You barstewards!" he screamed as the penny finally dropped. [:D]

[quote user="mint"]By all means, have all the facts and figures you like.  I still think that all raw data need to be examined in the light of what else is out there before jumping to conclusions. As you will have heard during your many business meetings, you could say a glass is half full or half empty.  So, even physical "facts" can be interpreted in different ways.  Depends on the person's outlook and also, of course, on what the person is trying to "sell". To brighten up your Sunday evening, or not as the case may be, here are a few figures for you to ponder on: [url]http://budgetresponsibility.org.uk/overview-of-the-november-2016-economic-and-fiscal-outlook/[/url] See, I can quote them too![:D] [/quote] Oh dear old Minty! If you did actually look at the webref I included reference the laughable "Stability and Growth pact" then you would see which major and minor EU states exceeded the benchmarks; which includes , err, Germany and Italy follows Greece on the worst offenders. Note date - 2014. I must advise my clients, when they have drastically exceeded their overdraft limit, to use your "Half Full- Half Empty" analogy.......... Sadly, I fear, I would be sued, as they shortly afterwards, collapse in bankruptcy. [:-))]

Quite some years ago, Paul, Mrs Gluey and I were staying at a delightful old style family hotel at Ventnor in the Isle of White. Unbeknown to us then was the fact, Isle of White was a Jazz mecca and more so since the late Johnny Dankworth and his charming wife Cleo Lane used to run an annual Summer Jazz School just along the coast. In the hotel, every Wednesday and Saturday, a jazz evening was organised; wonderful stuff! Having a drink in the bar one Wednesday evening, I was chatting to the extremely accomplished electric piano player, buying him a pint and chatting. Turned out he was a well travelled session jazz musician and one evening, he was playing at a top and very expensive London night club, where many star performers came in to relax in the small hours after finishing their evening gigs.... One evening, in walks Errol Garner; and eventually, he agreed to sit in and play piano for a few numbers. At which point, a well known and extremely wealthy member, invariably well lubricated and well known to the managers, staggered up to the stage and demanded to sing along.......core problem being he was tone deaf and utterly hopeless! They indulged him due to the vast amount he used to spend every week. So this guy turns to Errol Garner and asks "D' yer know Mishty?" hiccup, hiccup. Garner, cool as a cucumber simply asks "Which key would you like it in?" [:D] P.S. For those who do not know, Errol Garner wrote "Misty": perhaps his most famous work... [Www]

Glad it gave you a good laugh, Sue. In Church (Anglican Parish Church), since I sing in tune and reasonably well and since we have the services of a notable Organist and Choir Master who received an MBE for his services to Choral Music, I have had to learn to manage to ignore Mrs Gluey's singing! She loves to sing and loves the music and now enjoys a voice somewhere between Mezzo and Contralto. If you like a cross somewhere between Cecilia Bartoli and Dame Clara Butt! Very off-putting for moi... I have been tempted to emulate that bloke in the folk group, Steeleye Span, here: I have resisted, thus far, in case the Vicar thinks I am taking the rise out of him! [:D]

Fingers aloft to Bruxelle? See here All rather hilarious, since the original Stability and Growth pact has been junked, revised, junked and revised, fine tuned and utterly ignored time and again, even by those member states who now shout loudest at Italy et al! See Here: Oh dear, silly me. There I go again citing facts and numbers, rather than opinions...

Well, hows about logical analysis? See here: Dare I say, err; you read it here first? [Www]

Some quite amazing conclusions about science herein! Science, in its purest sense is simply concerned with the absolute. If for example, a chemist or a physicist postulates a conclusion, then this must be based upon replicable result. Others can therefore test a claimed outcome and achieve precisely the same result. It is called peer validation. Perhaps the most famous series of  leading edge research experiments might be the Manhattan District's nuclear physics. The resultant worked. A few scientists working on the project, Enrico Fermi for one, believed once a chain reaction was started and sustained, it would become completely unstoppable and blow up the World! Fortunately for us, he and his group of like minds were wrong! Medical science, sadly, tends to work on probable outcomes, not absolutes. Unless and until any proposed course of treatment has moved from possibility to mainly definite success. Antibiotics for a bacterial infection, for example; with the obvious caveat, over-prescription causes resistance.

[quote user="Chancer"]despite some people sticking it to me, the sort that get pleasure from kicking someone when they are down.[/quote] Schadenfreude, Chancer. The act of gaining much pleasure from the misfortunes of another. Sick, IMHO and typical of den Krauts!

[quote user="EuroTrash"] Let's hope somebody saved an electronic copy. Except it will probably be on a stack of floppy disks. Maybe even Amstrad disks - anyone still got a working Amstrad word processor sitting in the attic ?[/quote] Well, I have an old Amstrad 1640 (8086 CPU) sat in the loft....... with a hard drive, no less! [:-))] However, in the mid-1970s it would probably have been something like an IBM, DEC, or similar system. Portable media? Err, no. Uless it was 8 inch floppy disks. anyone have an 8 inch external floppy drive....??? I do have a few blank 5/14" disks kicking around somewhere. However they weren't introduced until circa 1978 by Shugart at the request of Wang (WP only systems). Anyone here good with FORTRAN or COBOL??? [Www]

[quote user="EuroTrash"] The point being, Gluey, that at our insignificant level, what we're speculating about is what the politicians WILL decide, not what they SHOULD decide. I appreciate that you have sussed out exactly how Brexit should be handled, but unfortunately it's not your job. So there's no point, really, in arguing facts and figures and how they should be interpreted and coming to a different conclusion from May & Co. It's more relevant to look at how they are reacting to the facts and figures and which direction that's likely to take them in. What they think may be wrong but that's not the point, the point is, that's what they're going to build their policies on.[/quote] The highlighted bit: Aye, there's the rub! (As the Bard quoth). Being anapolitical, myself, I am only really concerned with the econometrics. 'Cos that is much of what I do. What amuses me are the varying and stoutly vehement opinions flying around. As a matter of interest, I wonder how many participating on this thread have actually read Article 50 of the Lisbon Treaty? Well, to save those with interest the fag, here it is: Article 50 1. Any Member State may decide to withdraw from the Union in accordance with its own constitutional requirements. 2. A Member State which decides to withdraw shall notify the European Council of its intention. In the light of the guidelines provided by the European Council, the Union shall negotiate and conclude an agreement with that State, setting out the arrangements for its withdrawal, taking account of the framework for its future relationship with the Union. That agreement shall be negotiated in accordance with Article 218(3) of the Treaty on the Functioning of the European Union. It shall be concluded on behalf of the Union by the Council, acting by a qualified majority, after obtaining the consent of the European Parliament. 3. The Treaties shall cease to apply to the State in question from the date of entry into force of the withdrawal agreement or, failing that, two years after the notification referred to in paragraph 2, unless the European Council, in agreement with the Member State concerned, unanimously decides to extend this period. 4. For the purposes of paragraphs 2 and 3, the member of the European Council or of the Council representing the withdrawing Member State shall not participate in the discussions of the European Council or Council or in decisions concerning it. A qualified majority shall be defined in accordance with Article 238(3)(b) of the Treaty on the Functioning of the European Union. 5. If a State which has withdrawn from the Union asks to rejoin, its request shall be subject to the procedure referred to in Article 49. ________________________________ What is perhaps of much interest to myself, requires a little story. I majored in International Trade at B School with a focus on what was then the EEC. At the time, Britain was in its "Run In" period (Transitional amelioration of reciprocal customs duties and charges). One of our External Lecturers, was the senior Customs Officer (it was then of course HM Customs and Excise) and he had been sent to Brussels as the UK's Point Man to negotiate how when and why. Problem was he spoke zero French; and all the negotiations were in French! Ergo the Brussels Nomenclature as it was called (big boring tome, yuk) took forever to negotiate and agree. Despite the fervent Brexit supporters screaming "Brexit Now!" and the increasingly virulent angst emerging from the EU leaders, this process will take a long time. Just the training and production of fresh new Customs manuals for officers at Dover and Calais etc, will not be a short process; plus all the discarded procedures will have to be restored. Imagine the bloody chaos at the ports! If these (following) positions of war are anything to go by, then clearly, the last bit if Para 3 will surely be invoked. By both sides... (apols. I simply do not have the time, today to turn them into URLs as HTML.) http://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-britain-sterling-idUKKCN12K1AT http://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-britain-eu-hollande-idUKKCN12629T http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-latest-uk-must-leave-eu-by-2019-theresa-may-martin-schulz-european-parliament-president-a7323411.html http://www.reuters.com/article/us-britain-eu-juncker-idUSKBN1300LA http://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-britain-eu-juncker-idUKKBN1331F5 http://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-britain-eu-germany-idUKKCN124146 http://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-britain-eu-germany-idUKKBN12X14L http://www.reuters.com/article/us-britain-eu-germany-idUSKBN13A1PL

[quote user="ernie"]Hey Glueys - What a strange way you have of debating !!!!! You seem to rely on known, provable facts and figures instead of vague suppositions, tenuous conclusions and a huge worry-bag of unspoken fears blighting your judgement. I love it . lol.[/quote] It's the rigour of academe, Ernie: never posit an hypothesis, unless you can back up your theories with empiricism. As many students discovered, to their chagrin,  when I was marking MBA papers! Plus Business School training using the Harvard Business School Case Study model. However, most of the rest, simply love wild suppositions, assumption and repeatedly parroting myths and urban legends until they are taken by a majority as "Fact"! Most politicians clearly work on the basis of "Don't try and confuse the issue/s with facts! We already have a solution!" I loved this one, BTW! [quote user="EuroTrash"] The economic data and the facts are well known to everybody involved, they're not in question[/quote] Well, that will be a first, then! Except, it seems, a majority of both EU and UK politicians and journalists and supposed "Commentators and Analysts"! I am minded to recalled Thatcher and the European Telecommunications Act; which she glibly and carelessly signed off. And then went crazy, when Red Hot Dutch beamed really pornographic movies into the UK via satellite, flogging access cards in newsagents and etc. Seemed no one had actually bothered to , err, read the small print; once again. And, let's remind ourselves, Thatcher was a lawyer! Any more than did one Gordon Brown when as PM he signed off on the Lisbon Treaty... which again, let's remember, replaced the multiply rejected European Constitution Act.

[quote user="mint"] Indeed, in the last few months, I have read many interesting and thought-provoking articles on Brexit and indeed on other subjects in the Guardian.  And all I used to read in the Guardian were their concert reviews .....................[geek] [/quote] Oh dear, Minty. Next, you will be taking a life membership of the UAF, buying Doc Martins boots, dressing in cammo gear, having your head shaved to resemble a US marine, but with three shades of pink, red and blue and having the nose, ear, lip and brain piercing: plus joining the Hampstead and Islington Marxist club! P.S. You can tell I once (UGH!!) went to the Channel 4 HQ in London, to discuss a potential prog with a young producer, who took me to lunch in the quaintly termed "Refectory" (much more Hampstead than Canteen doncha know); and there was moi, clutching my nasty fibreglass tray with its modest repast, sliding around this den of double weird , with my posterior firmly glued to the walls.... P.P.S. now you can see where my forum alias emerged from... [:D]

[quote user="lindal1000"]But these aren't hidden or secret cards..everyone knows about them, even you..and everyone knows that free trade works both ways and the EU will lose out without it, but if you look at the import/ export data, not as much as the UK will. Yes the UK can trade with other countries, but so can the EU. I still don't see what there is to hide? Worst case senario , Volkswagen may cost a bit more in the Uk. Nissan have already been given a guarantee they won't lose out and they are part owned by Renault anyway. Yes EDF generate and sell electricity to most of the UK. I would have thought the UK would be more worried about that than France personally, as import duties would make electricity more expensive. Of course EDF could pull out of the UK leaving the building of the nuclear generation plant entirely to the Chinese? Still not seeing that hidden card.[/quote] OK, lindal. For the sake of argument, then let's reverse the question... What Big Stick/s does the mighty EU possess, with which to beat the UK into submission? ??? [8-)]

[quote user="lindal1000"]The problem is Gluestick TM doesn't have that many cards to play with. [/quote] Really? The UK's massive contribution to the profligate EU budget? The fact that last time I checked, two weeks before the referendum vote, the UK was in the three preceding months period in Trade Deficit in the EU's favour by £23.8 Billion! And these are stats from ONS, not a biased analyst. After all the sabre rattling and threats and dire forecasts from the head honchos of the EU apparat, the German equivalent of the CBI, were advising Mad Mutti Merkel to very carefully consider the cause of the German manufacturing exporter; to Britain! Riddle me this, Lindal: 1.  How many Nissan cars made in Britain do you see on the roads of France? 2.  How many Mercedes, Volkswagen, BMW, Porsche, SEAT, Skoda, do you see on the roads of Britain? Next Question: 1.  How many Hotpoint domestic appliances do you see in France on offer? (And they're now Italian anyway since they are part of Indesit): 2.  How many Bosch, AEG,  Braun, etc ditto do you see on offer in the UK? Etc. Which global company owns a majority of British water and sewerage utilities? (It is French, BTW!): Keep on going! I could inundate you with business-econometrics if you like. But then, however, Wooly  would suggest I have nothing else to do. I bloody wish! [:(]

[quote user="chessie"] It was always on the cards that there would be recipricol agreements;  there were pre-existing health and other agreements between the UK and France long before the eu. After all look at Verstiethingy, and all the others.... you really want to give the UK's game and negotiating position away too soon when having to deal with such spiteful people.   Really ? Chessie [/quote] Thank goodness, once again, for some sanity! Yes indeed, chessie, the reciprocal arrangements on state services and benefits have indeed been in place and deep embedded well before the Single European Act came into force. Must also be remembered, at present there are apparently circa: [quote]137,862 French-born people living in the UK. Almost half of these were resident in the capital, London.  According to the Office for National Statistics (ONS) Labour Force Survey estimates for 2015, there are 3.3 million EU citizens in the UK – 1.6 million from the EU14, 1.3 million from the EU8, 300,000 from Romania and Bulgaria and the remainder from the other EU countries of Malta, Cyprus and Croatia. 7. [/quote] Any silly action would be reciprocal and impact as heavily upon the above as well as Ex. Pat Brits living in France. [quote user="lindal1000"]I love the way May and Davis talk about 'not revealing their negotiating strategy' as if there is some sort of secret option they have up their sleeve. Let's face it, there are only a handful of options available.[/quote] When one enters into any negotiation and more particularly where contentious issues are involved, then one never ever places all one's cards on the table! Instead the usual strategy is to ask or demand (depending upon circumstances) for far more than one actually wants; and concede on issues one didn't actually want in the first place. Perhaps it is worth while to examine the extended and problematic negotiations post WWI which, eventually led to the Treaty of Versailles. Then, in context, the Treaty (which in point of fact was a surrender and an unconditional surrender, too), with Germany which officially ended WWII. Germany was smashed, physically destroyed and its insane leaders had either taken cyanide, shot themselves in the head or run away. Consequently, there was no negotiation; rather simply a dictation and imposition of terms by far superior allied powers upon a totally vanquished enemy. Many of you appear to believe, Britain is a busted flush and must drag its sorry tail over to Brussels as a humble supplicant seeking favours from a King! Which clearly, is far from the case! The EU, arrogant and myopic and stupid as it is, has far more to lose then Britain. At present, the ideologues are trying desperately to defend and justify the indefensible and unjustifiable, since to do anything else is to admit their artificial lumbering, monolithic and failed dysfunctional artificial construct, was flawed and wrong. Which it damned well is and they know it! Once it is seen to be wrong, then they will be seen to be wrong, too! Impossible for supreme egotists to swallow, let alone admit. Edit: Corrigendum: I omitted to mention one salient point. Many non-French people lived full-time in France; as they did, particularly in Spain et al, from  the 1950s and 60s on, and were not naturalised citizens. Many American citizens did also and still do...

[quote user="mint"][url]https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/nov/23/farage-trump-buddy-photo-ukip[/url] Interesting times indeed.................... [/quote] What an appalling load of tosh, Minty! Typical Grauniad: no cliche too far; no metaphor too vague. Worth remembering, perhaps, JFK requested his choice of Ambassador: and so did Nixon. Nixon's choice was weird, being an ex-Labour MP. Core problem for the professional elitist political class, is both Farage and Trump are challenging and indeed threatening their cosy hegemony and incestuous long-established links with Big Biz and Big Capital. If Farage is someone Trump can work with, or as Reagan said of Mrs T, "This is a lady I can do business with!", then exploit it for all that it is worth. Instead of sending some pretentious old Oxford clique mandarin from Whitehall, who has spent the last thirty years obstructing change and genuine progress, who would mince into the White House imagining he was far too superior to POTUS. To which Trump would react by simply saying "Go away, you pompous clown!". Nothing stopping Mrs May from seeking to appoint Farage as a sort of envoy without portfolio. After all, the arch villain, Capn. Bob Maxwell, was used as an unofficial envoy to the Russian President and the Supreme Soviet, in his day.......