Badger LX

Jeff & I have a mutual client in my commune so, yes, I know him.

I'm not going to comment about the OP's competence or otherwise, but to answer the question: A 2A disjoncteur is required to protect the internal switch contacts inside the meter. It's absence doesn't stop the system working as it should (i.e. if the current to the switch is fed directly from elsewhere) but it does endanger the switch contacts in the meter & also doesn't comply to regulations). As a secondary effect it also protects the winding of the jour/nuit contactor. Regardless of whether you have a switching arrangement or not the whole supply goes over to cheap rate when a signal is received by the meter via the mains network. This is why so many appliances have a delayed start feature in France so that they can be made to come on during the cheap period.

I can't really comment about how your friend's board is wired, but the two wires on the "télécommande" box are simply the two sides of a switch. A live feed from the distribution board is sent down one (& needs 2A protection) whilst the other wire, the return (which will be live during the cheap rate/HC period), goes to the one side of the contactor (the jour/nuit unit) that then switches on the water heater (the load of which is protected via a maximum 20A breaker). The other side of the contactor is connected to neutral. A simple wiring diagram can be seen here. I think that your friend's board may lack certain bits......

I the change is recent & you were using the old meter before the new one was installed then if I were you I'd get EDF to sort it out - they should require the readings from it anyway. However, if it's an old supply, long dead (& you're sure that it is), then EDF will have forgotten about it long ago.....

EDF/ERDF's repsonsibility continues up until the output of their main "disjoncteur d'abonné", which is probably the "big brown trip" referred to. The client is allowed to connect or disconnect from the output side of this device ONLY i.e. you can't remove it from the system - it will have seals on the bits you can't touch & tampering with them is illegal. Not only is it there to protect you as a current leakage fault cut out (i.e. 500mA interrupteur différentiel/RCCB) it also governs the power you are allowed to draw, depending on your electrical contract.

This is not so.  I've pasted in a bit below I wrote elsewhere that explains all....... "One of the most frequent questions I hear is "I need to swap the plugs on my UK appliances to French ones, but there's no indication which side of the plug is live or neutral - what do I do?". Until recently this would have opened a large can of worms as even the French couldn't seem to agree on the matter. However, I have always had a belief as to which side is correct, which has now been proven right. Anyway, if you look at the front of a French socket (assuming it is the right way up, with the sticking out earth pin at the top), the LIVE (phase) is on the right (or clockwise from the earth if you like). Translate that to the inside of a plug, & it's the same. Put another way, it's the same as a UK 13 Amp plug. More to the point it's the same principal as the Europe-wide standard (CEE17) for industrial & weatherproof connectors that most people will have seen in the form of the blue 16 Amp plugs/sockets used for caravan hook-ups, or the yellow (110 Volt) version used for building site power tools. Although this standard also encompasses three-phase connectors & goes up to 125 Amp capacity, the live connection in a socket (viewed from the front) is always clockwise from the earth. So, how do I know what's right? Well, in recent times Legrand & other major manufacturers of fittings for domestic installation in France) have introduced colour coding to their ranges. Lo & behold, the live is on the right! In the absence of any more official information this move is as good as it gets. Whilst agreeing that in terms of physics the polarity does not matter it is really bad practice to mix things up in the same installation. What leads, adaptors etc. then do is whatever they do, but at least an installation should be correct."

I suspect we are talking at cross purposes here, but the answer to your immediate question is "one that can handle the maximum current rating of the disjoncteur/s that follow it"..........? I do get involved with stuff on a commercial/industrial scale as well as domestic.

You have your facts the wrong way around. Type AC interrupteurs différentiel are the cheaper kind & only deal with AC faults. Type A deals with both AC & DC faults & are marginally more expensive in the common sizes, & a lot more so for triphasé types. I believe there is a move afoot to make Type A standard & for Type ACs to be phased out as then all the bases are covered.

To quote Dave: " true..... but that's the power to the house ........your water heater needs a " disconjoncteur divisionaire" they only come max 20 amp......" Dave - I'm not sure where you get your information from as I have personally fitted plenty of disjoncteurs above 20A i.e. 32A, 40A, 50A, 63A, 80A, 100A etc., etc. To the OP - Personally I think that instantaneous water heaters on a domestic scale are a waste of time on many levels, & in France they just don't add up with keeping your overall "abonnement" at a sensible level. You are probably better off having a decent small "sous-évier" unit that has a "groupe de securité" that drains like a normal ballon, therefore you don't have the dripping associated with above sink units, or the large electrical load.

Sounds like you need some form of air admittance upstream of this lot. The water departing to your drains/fosse/wherever is creating negative pressure in it's wake & trying to suck the water out of the various traps. Allowing air to flow in behind it will stop this happening. You need to either send a vent up & outside or fit a one-way air admittance valve. They are available at most places that sell waste pipe & fittings.

Anton is correct - the competence, or otherwise, of some inspectors does leave a lot to be desired & is a bone of contention amongst properly qualified professionals. Having said that I have seen some very thorough reports & have even used one to help a friend get a property rewired as condition of buying it (yes, the installation was that bad). I'd be curious to know what other electrical faults you found - the inspections are really only interested in electrical safety i.e. if one half of a two way lighitng circuit that doesn't work it's not really an issue, but if there is no main earth or there's a distribution board next to the shower that's a different matter.....!

I'm not entirely sure what you are asking, but to "tell it how it is"...... Lighting & power (socket) circuits must be supplied separately. You could use 2,5mm² for your 10A protected lighting, but it would be a pointless exercise & a waste of good copper. As you point out, the socket side of things can be done in 2,5mm², with a 16A fuse or 20A MCB (disjoncteur) to protect it (though personally I always run general socket circuits via 16A breakers). The sockets could be run in 1,5mm² as long as they are part of a circuit with no more that 5 outlets on it & the circuit is protected by a 16A disjoncteur (fuses not allowed). All circuits in a salle d'eau must be protected by a 30mA interrupteur différentiel & your socket(s) are only allowed in Zone 3 & not above a sink. If you have copper plumbing &/or metal window & door frames then don't forget about putting in LEP - liaison équipotentielle.

[quote user="AnOther"]I've got CAT5 in the same gaine as 240v power and no interference problems at all. Is it to regs, no. Do I care, no. My house and I'll decide what to do with it [:P] [/quote] There's no polite answer to that. I won't be looking to buy your house anytime soon though......[8-)]

[quote user="Quillan"][quote user="Badger LX"]No huge issue with the cable thing, but for the sake of clarity you cannot have mains voltage wiring & low voltage TV/phones sharing the same conduit. I know it's not what you are asking but communications cabling (i.e. phones/Cat 5/6 etc.) have to be at certain minimum distances apart (depending on screening type) on parallel runs over 35m, but then the separation is not required for the entire length. [/quote] Sorry but that's not strictly true. You can buy bundled Cat5e cables that contain data, phone, satellite, terrestrial TV and others. Below is a picture of one such combination cable sold by Belden Cables which contains the following.: Two high-quality quad shield RG6U 75 ohm coaxial cables. Two high-quality Category 5e rated 4-pair telephone/network unshielded twisted pair (UTP) cables. Two 62.5/125 micron multimode glass fiber optic cables. It's sold on 500ft drums. [/quote] Sorry, I wasn't clear - the separation I'm talking about is for comms from mains, not comms from comms. Nice cable by the way - do they do it with FTP (or better) cables in it?

No huge issue with the cable thing, but for the sake of clarity you cannot have mains voltage wiring & low voltage TV/phones sharing the same conduit. I know it's not what you are asking but communications cabling (i.e. phones/Cat 5/6 etc.) have to be at certain minimum distances apart (depending on screening type) on parallel runs over 35m, but then the separation is not required for the entire length. Plumbing: you can get toilet exit spigots that already have small waste bosses moulded into them for exactly the purpose you are asking about.

No, not just a switched live. It is used to transmit various signals which are interpreted by the device/s being controlled, normally heating. There is a standard so that all devices will respond in the same way to the same signal, but not all devices have the capability of the full "6 ordres". There's a handy guide here.

The harmonisation shown is only applicable to three-phase supplies & wiring. Once you drop down to single phase circuits then any colour can be used for live apart from those already mentioned. It would be a real pain if all lives were the same as the different colours available in France make it very simple to distinguish between lamp returns, va et vient, fil pilote etc.

Whilst I don't dispute the values you state for earth resistance they are a bit of a red herring...... The earth resistance requirement is a product of the value of the disjoncteur de branchement & as I've yet to find one below 500mA fitted by ERDF, 100 Ohms is the effective maximum value allowed. As a footnote, as well as requiring all circuits to be protected by 30mA inter diffs  NF C 15-100 also forbids the fitting of unearthed sockets. The only exception to that is if they are sockets supplied via an isolating transformer.

I'm not sure what your chap was reading but the resistance of your main earthing system(s) must be below 100 Ohms, if you have a main "disjoncteur d'abonné" of 500mA (which is the standard these days). If this is the case for all your earth spikes then the suggestion of linking them all up is a good one as you would use bare 25mm² copper wire to perform the task which gives you a lot more contact with earth than a few extra spikes would achieve. However, this should only be done if all the buildings are fed from the same mains supply/meter.

Do check this out more thoroughly (go to the Poujoulat website - they have comprehensive info in their documents), but I beleive that flues & chimneys need to be rise at least 400mm above the ridge line & have no obstacles higher than said ridge for a diameter of 8 metres. Your problem is very typical of the problems you get with misplaced flues, which is why the regulation exists.

If your tri-rated conductors are of a harmonised type then there is no reason or French regulation that prevents you from doing as you suggest (that is, single insulted wires inside conduit/gaine). You could wire an entire property in flex if you were so inclined (& rich enough to afford it). However, given the trend for push wire connections these days using flex would give you a headache finding decent accessories that will accept it, or force you to use cheap screw terminal equipment only, which would my personal idea of hell.....

Are back boxes colour coded in France? Not specifically, but manufacturers have their own system within their ranges (Legrand use yellow for placo boxes, brick red for masonry for instance, but Schneider placo ones are blue). In my time I've fitted yellow, blue, green, orange & white boxes all designed for placo......

There are specific connectors for "raccord sur buse" i.e. connecting to the cast outlet of a poele etc. They have a specifically sized reduction which allows them to drop inside the outlet, which a standard male pipe end will not. Check out page 133 of the Poujoulat catalogue This all allows you to keep the joints the right way up (male down/female up).

[quote user="Chancer"]I reckon the Consuel inspectors should hang a 25kg weight on all ceiling DCL's to see if they have been properly fitted and not just relying on the pattes, after all a particulier having bought a chandelier is not going to know untill the whole lot drops to the floor. I dont reckon they will find many that comply do you Badger?, none of mine thats certain.  [/quote]I've never known one to be checked, but as they do state the weight loading on the fitting I don't fancy your chances in the event of an insurance claim........ If I can't get a proper fixing via an M6 bolt, studding, wire & Gripple, or otherwise, I now fit the new larger applique sort (they use standard circular boxes rather than the 54mm ones, or the silly Capri oblong type). That way an end user can't try & hang a cast iron chandelier without providing some other form of suspension.

Absolutely - properly registered electricians (English & French, please note) will have set themselves up with CONSUEL & receive their Attestations pre-printed with their details, & get a deal on bulk purchases of the forms.