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Livret 'A' / Associations


Gyn_Paul

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I am connected to a couple of French associations. One of which had its AGM/AG last night.

I had always thought that the reason associations are tax-exempt is because they are not expected (in theory, at least) to carry money over from one F/Y to another. Yet I discovered on discussing the end of year financial statement (and another thing....why can't the French bring themselves to carry a running total down the side of any financial statement? What is the matter with them? !) that they have over 1000 Euros invested in a Livret 'A', which obviously rolls across the F/Y.  Since it's with the same bank as the main account, I assume it's correct and allowable, but it does seem a rather odd idea.

n'est pas?

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[quote user="NormanH"]I thought they were exempt because they aren't supposed to make a profit.

I don't see why they shouldn't have funds in reserve.

[/quote]

But wouldn't you consider the interest (miniscule though it is) on a Livret to be a form of profit?

Anyway, a strict definition of 'profit' would be:-

 'total funds taken in [-]  total annual expenditure [=] profit'.

Surely?

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Think about what you are saying, interest is not profit, its income on an investment.

 

If a society is expected to make a loss how can they be sure of doing so, spend much more than they have coming in in case when they do the year end accounts they find some other income? How long would their reserves last if they did that?

 

The answer is to look at the French legal term but non lucratif and not an approximate translation.

 

What is the aim of the society, it will not be solely to make a profit but it must at least balance its books to continue with its work.

 

My running club raise €800 per year in cotisations and spend €2400 per year on the assemblé générale alone! There is champagne, wine, beer and the most expensive canapés that I have ever seen all served by formally dressed waiters and waitresses, the majority of members are not even runners and are only seen at the AGM with their noses in the trough together with their extended familise having paid one €10 abonnement for 8 people to fill their faces and get drunk.

 

In the meantime the secretary reads out the accounts to an audience of one, myself, not that I can hear because of all the unsupervised feral children running amok, they were completely taken aback when i asked for a copy of the accounts.

 

This club would not exist without the subventions that the syndicalistes within blackmail from their employers, I would liek to say that if a company behaved in this way it would be investigated but sadly practically all the CE's of large companies do just that which is where the running club originated.

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Wow Chancer !

A dispassionate observer might be forgiven for thinking that you're not altogether, 100%  en accord with the way your running club association - and your fellow members conduct themselves. - just a feeling... I may be entirely wrong of course!

Yes, of course, an association should be expected to be financially prudent, balance its books, and carry some surplus across from year to year. But that, I submit, would be a poor argument in the Tax Man's eyes if the accounts show that the surplus is clearly growing substantially year by year.

But you're right. That point doesn't allow for the totally bent old-boy's network with innumerable blind eyes which seem to manage some of these things in rural France!

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We had several accounts when I was treasurer, and I took them over and just kept them. Never thought about it, as I knew that we were an association that needed money so that the kids could enter competitions all over France.  And then there was better interest on accounts.

We also made lots of money for our association each year and we did not squander it. The only thing that we did treat every one too was the end of year,  club competition and it was the post competition apero. We did have champagne and wine and beer, but actually not that much and the canapes we made along with crisps etc.

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[quote user="Gyn_Paul"]Wow Chancer !
A dispassionate observer might be forgiven for thinking that you're not altogether, 100%  en accord with the way your running club association - and your fellow members conduct themselves. - just a feeling... I may be entirely wrong of course!

[/quote]

 

I accepted them the way they are, I know better than to try to change things, this year I have moved to a new club, very successfull, smashing warm friendly open and communicative people, they dont squander the money and as a result have their own locale with vestiare, showers and salle de reunion/fêtes plus its right beside the proper all weather floodlit regulation size athletic track with synthetic surface, the other club rented a swampy gravel undersized piste around the pitch in the football stadium which was waterlogged most of the winter.

 

I have remained with them though, naively thinking that paying my membership was showing solidarité and to continue running with the friends that I made there but running in competition for the new club, big naive mistake. I even talked with the president about what I intended to do before doing so, he got the real hump, they voted in retrospectively a regulation saying that people who are licensed with another club are banned from all entraînements and he told me I was no longer welcome and that they would be cancelling my membership and refunding me my cotisation, big mistake on their part, a couple of people have resigned over it and they are currently trying and failing to justify themselves with La Halde and I make sure that I turn up like a bad penny for footing at least once a week [:P] I have just heard that the president will be resigning at the next AGM.

 

So no, you are not wrong!

 

Editted, new club in different town, 20kms away but it might as well be on another planet!

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