NuBeginnings Posted June 11, 2011 Share Posted June 11, 2011 I have a boundary wall that is in very poor condition. I am intending to rebuild the wall but would like some input.I intend to deconstruct the bits that are in poor condition and rebuild. However I have a huge length of wall that is totally shot I will have to start from scratch more than 2000 meters.For the above section I was thinking of rebuilding the wall in breeze block then facing the block with the old stone on the road side, the internal wall is concealed by a forest, this would seem to be the quickest solution. Has any one done this before how did it look ?If I use the block I will lay a membrane on the bottom and on the top.[IMG]http://i1116.photobucket.com/albums/k562/NBeginningsFrance/Boundary%20wall%20repair/IMG_0057.jpg[/IMG][IMG]http://i1116.photobucket.com/albums/k562/NBeginningsFrance/Boundary%20wall%20repair/IMG_0052.jpg[/IMG]I will also be rebuilding one of the disused external gates as its such a shame as it would make a great entrance looks in such a poor condition, we intend to cut the old stone back the face it of with new stone.[IMG]http://i1116.photobucket.com/albums/k562/NBeginningsFrance/Boundary%20wall%20repair/IMG_0058.jpg[/IMG]Does any one have an idea of the cost Tufo by pallet ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Théière Posted June 12, 2011 Share Posted June 12, 2011 What is the purpose of the membrane on the bottom and top? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cendrillon Posted June 12, 2011 Share Posted June 12, 2011 Crikey! have you bought a chateau? That wall looks as though it was once surrounding a very grand property[8-|][I]I've just remembered that you have indeed got a chateau hidden away behind those walls. I was confusing you with another member of this forum.[:)] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolybanana Posted June 12, 2011 Share Posted June 12, 2011 Yes, that looks a bit like the wall surrounding Chateau Sweet 17. The 'douves' are inside! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NuBeginnings Posted June 12, 2011 Author Share Posted June 12, 2011 Those gates are not our main gates, I believe they were once were the main gates to the chateau as the was a tree lined avenue winding its way up to the chateau sadly most of the avenues trees have long since gone and the gates have seen better days.We will be restoring them back to their original splendour.As for the membrane just to help protect the stone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Théière Posted June 12, 2011 Share Posted June 12, 2011 [quote user="NuBeginnings"]As for the membrane just to help protect the stone.[/quote]Allowing moisture to move into the stone will also increase the evaporation, using a membrane will result in the stone below remaining saturated so shortening it's life unless you are using some differnt stone on the bottom like flint. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIG MAC Posted June 12, 2011 Share Posted June 12, 2011 That wall isn't too bad.It was once quite a nice looking wall. I notice is has three tie courses which will often be full thickness at least in places.Why not strip the wall down to the most viable tie course, clean up the remainder and repoint it in lime mortar then rebuild using the materials that are there to be re-used? - No need for blockwork even if a lot of stone has been lost it should still be available.The entrance could be really special and a chance to really make something. I would strip the iron work and have it taken away for shot blasting, new pins and collars to hinges let in and the whole lot primed ready for paint. I would recreate the 'impression' of the avenue using road stone or slate but deliberately tapering the path in a gentle curve and lining it with saplings. Be good if it could be used as a viable entrace with automatic openers and uplighters onto the stonework.........I would love to own an entrance like that! good luck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mint Posted June 12, 2011 Share Posted June 12, 2011 Laugh all you want, guys, but, you know what, having a dry moat (no rain for months) PLUS boundary walls that don't keep out the hordes add up to a less than happy existence......[;-)] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NuBeginnings Posted June 12, 2011 Author Share Posted June 12, 2011 Some sections of the wall are in ok condition and will be repaired in the traditional manner. But if you look at the top picture left the wall for the most part is non existent.The entrance will be restored properly using traditional methods the iron work will also be getting the treatment you mentioned ;-)I have toyed with the idea of the saplings which I may do in September as I have a lot of oak saplings I need to move and was wondering where to put them.When we get under way I am going to document the process. As for the block work I am still sitting on the fence or perhaps I should say the wall ;-)The main entrance we use now is as grand as the old entrance and has electric gates, so the old entrance will be for the most part decretive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIG MAC Posted June 12, 2011 Share Posted June 12, 2011 Seriously the wall isn't that bad ....even in the bad section. I would try to rebuild it 'on the flat' firstly to get the best fit for the stones then transfer them up to the wall. I am suffering from 'entrance envy' and am uncomfortable with the suspicion that this may be the subject of an entire specialist web facility all on it's own!I should have mentioned the wall looks that ropey because the 'core' is exposed (largely made of small stones, clay and poo - otherwise known as farmers concrete) clear that lot out of the way down to a tie course and start rebuilding sympathetically to the remaining coursing and you will get a decent result. Worth hacking back the vegetation too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chancer Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 I am with Big-Mac on this Nubeginnings, please please please dont even consider rebuilding a composite mur using parpaing or damp proof courses.As you know I had a long look at the project but you were away at the time so we have never had the chance to discuss it at length, BigMac has given a good description, from my poking about you have 95% of the stone that you need it is buried in the vegetation/soil on both sides of the wall, the bottom structural part of the wall(s) is for the major part intact and retains all its structural integrity, it would be a sin t knock it down to build something in parpaing which would be too rigid to move with the ground as the existing wall has for centuries.As with all things the preparatory work will take the lions share of the work yet show little return, you must remove all the trees that are growing beside, in and through the wall including their roots to a distance of at least one metre, whilst doing this you will recover 50% of the missing stone, there are a couple of corner junctions and piers close to the 2nd entrance that will need close attention at this point, the remainder of the stone will be found on the outside of the wall, carefully scraping back and levelling the soil with a digger would be the most practical but you will probably need to talk to the commune.When you have recovered all the stone it will need to be sorted through so that the dressed stone can be set to one side, there are 3 heights of dressed stone (I have forgotten the French names for them) and you can see how they are used by examining one of the properly rebuilt sections of the wall near the main gates, one section has been improperly rebuilt using cement mortar and will need redoing.I chatted with a retired maçon about the repairs, and looked at the wall again afterwards to verify that it had indeed been buit in the manner he prescribed, it needs to be taken back to solid material as BigMac described, it was built and should be rebuilt as two individual walls at each side using mortier bâtard, the dressed stone being used at the front to match the existing, it is infilled with all the small stones/rubble/whathaveyou then a liquid weak mix mortar is poured in to consolidate them, finally a protective coping is formed to shed the water just like the one that has been done by the main gate, the one in lime mortar not the cracked cement one.Whatever you choose good luck, I am in awe of you for having the courage to tackle such a chantier navale which has been ignored for so many generations, if you want some inspiration for what it will look like when done properly, stop the car the on the way to Richelieu the next time that you go and have a look at the rebuilt boundary wall that fronts the route nationale, compare it with the two rebuilt sections of your own wall, the lime mortar and cement ones.I reckon the finished entrance will even outshine your current one being set back and flanked by the rebuilt walls. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pachapapa Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 boutisse (n f) bond stone / bondstone, header, band boutisse non ragréée unfinished bondstone boutisse parpaigne throughband boutisse traversante throughband boutisse traversière throughbandwww.english-for-techies.net/lettres_b_et_l.doc OR www.pierreseche.com/vocabulaire_pierreseche_B.html OR http://www.pierreseche.com/index.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolybanana Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 This is fascinating; one learns something new every day Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabbie Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 [quote user="sweet 17"]Laugh all you want, guys, but, you know what, having a dry moat (no rain for months) PLUS boundary walls that don't keep out the hordes add up to a less than happy existence......[;-)][/quote]We bow to your chateau expertise[:D] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pachapapa Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 In rural areas of france, in buildings up to about the 18th century, the boutisses parpaignes were left with their ends clear of the walls.As a testament to the continuity of the reinforcing. The stone can be sounded to confirm this fact.The maçons were paid extra for the incorporation of a boutisse in the wall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NuBeginnings Posted June 13, 2011 Author Share Posted June 13, 2011 I will take on board the comments that Chancer & Bigmac have made although its more work Better to the job properly.Here is a picture of the gates we use at the moment the old gates are very imposing but as I have just installed electric gates the old gates will remain as a secondary entrance.When we start Ill post some pictures of the progress.[IMG]http://i1116.photobucket.com/albums/k562/NBeginningsFrance/Front%20Gates%20Milly/IMG_3509.jpg[/IMG] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 2 KM of wall is going to be a massive cost, however you rebuild it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pachapapa Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 [quote user="Derf"]2 KM of wall is going to be a massive cost, however you rebuild it.[/quote]Cant see why...just a bit of tax deductible repair & maintenance over several years starting on both sides of the focal gate point.The more Sarko loses on tax revenue the better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Zoff Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 Wow. That gate must have cost as much as some of us paid for our houses... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickP Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 [quote user="Alan Zoff"]Wow. That gate must have cost as much as some of us paid for our houses...[/quote]Probably is, but then Alan your house is not a business charging about two grand a week to it's clients , or maybe it is? [Www] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Zoff Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 I wish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIG MAC Posted June 18, 2011 Share Posted June 18, 2011 I think tackled systematically the costs should not be too bad....you probably have most of the materials other than the lime mortar ....so its labour and inclination that are the principal issues Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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