DaveLister

I note you haven't answered the question Ken. What would you accept as proof.

Yep, that's exactly it, discussing how to interpret raw data to provide an accurate model. Just like any good scientist. The 1940's ocean blip for example was caused by WW2. Prior to that, the UK and US fleets had contributed roughly equally to the global temperature record. From 1942 to 1945, UK ships were mobilised on the front and contributed just 5% of measurements. Measurements taken from US ships made up 80%. The key, then, is how each nation took its measurements. UK ships tended to throw a bucket overboard and lift it on deck to take the water’s temperature. US ships by and large would sample water drawn into the engine room before it was used to cool the machinery. Researchers have known for some time that each method has a bias. Temperatures measured in the buckets tend to be lower than those obtained when a thermometer is placed directly into the ocean because heat escapes from it as it is heaved on deck. The type of bucket can influence the temperature as well: wooden buckets, common in the 19th century, offer better insulation than the canvas buckets used in the 20th century. Engine room measurements, on the other hand, tend to be higher than the actual water temperature because these rooms are hot. So a temperature record dominated by US measurements in the early 1940s would show the sea surface to be warmer than it actually was at the time. Moreover, late in 1945, the UK resumed its measurements and for a period was responsible for half the global record while the US share dropped to 30%. This period is biased towards cooler, bucket-based temperatures, and corresponds to the sudden 1945 dip. It's reckoned that the fallout from the UEA data hack lost the world ten years. They never did find out who did it.

Love the music, hate the musician.

As far as I'm aware the only other 'controversy' around NASA's data stems from an open letter from former employees requesting NASA refrain from commenting on what they consider a debatable situation. The reasons for their letter are not made clear and, if I was inclined to believe in conspiracy theories, I'd suspect I'd be looking for links to the oil industry. Unfortunately as someone once said "A lie can travel halfway round the world while the truth is lacing up his boots"

It comes from an old blog post by a climate change denier which was picked up by Fox News in 2014. Stacy Dooley on Fox and Friends pointed out that, up until the year 2000, NASA had declared 1934 the hottest year on record then 'suddenly' changed their mind and announced it was 1998. Unfortunately the reasoning is a little complicated for the average American so "conspiracy" was shouted from the rooftops. To put it very simply temperature measurements were taken very differently when records began. Some of the measuring stations didn't exist a hundred years ago, or were in a different place. Temperatures might have been taken in the morning or the afternoon whereas nowadays they are taken at night. There were many reasons why it was not reasonable to compare apples with pears so computer models were designed to extrapolate more accurate trends from the historic data available. Such models have become common place, not just at NASA. If you have not seen the BBC drama "The Trick" about a Norfolk professor accused of massaging the same raw data to prove the existence of Climate change I suggest you look it out.

I second the question Ken. What would you regard as proof? It is an empirical fact that human activity is releasing more greenhouse gasses into the atmosphere than the planet is capable of reabsorbing. It is a scientific fact that these gasses help prevent heat from leaving the planet. They are the reason we don't all freeze to death at night when we are out of sight of the sun. Logic would say more gas would lead to more heat retention. The question is what happens next. You believe that 'the weather' will evolve. You're right. Unfortunately the evolution will probably lead to extinction. There is another planet in the solar system whose 'weather' has evolved following a dramatic greenhouse event and that's Venus.

In her last speech in the HOC before she resigned Suella Braverman blamed road protests on 'the Tofu eating wokerati'. For reasons I'm not sure about the Daily Star decided to test whether or not the Truss premiership would last longer than an iceberg lettuce. They had a live feed of the vegetable on their website which gained fame around the world. The lettuce won and, although a little brown around the edges, has vowed to stand against Truss in the next GE.

Braverman lost to Tofu, Truss lost to a lettuce, vegans are having an amazing week. 🥬

Oh FFS. She could have stuck it out for another fortnight. When I found out you didn't need to be a UK resident, or even a UK national to be a member of the Conservative Party I stumped up the 25 quid for a laugh. If she'd held on for another two weeks I would have been eligible to vote. Oh well, chances are there will be another one before the next election.

Looks like Truss is now PM in name only. I'm no fan of Jeremy Hunt but I think he made a good start this morning to calm the markets. Like him or loath him he's an experienced operator and, with luck, the party will STFU and let him and the other remaining grown ups navigate the troubled waters ahead. They won't be able to turn things around in time for the next election but they can hope not to be totally wiped out. As for Liz, she's probably breathing a sigh of relief. She can hide in No 10 deflecting all questions to her Chancellor and concentrate on her Instagram account.

Resurrecting an old thread, I thought this was a nice gesture. https://www.laposte.fr/notre-selection-coup-de-coeur/collector-4-timbres-elizabeth-ii-lettre-prioritaire-internationale/p/2122909

I'd agree with you but then we'd both be wrong

How true! I have always felt that the world would be a much nicer place if humans had never existed.

Congratulations and fingers crossed it all goes smoothly

I agree ( although I draw a line at ants )

Well she looks not the slightest bit bothered by it.

He's a sweetie

Ken, there is something I've been meaning to ask you for some time. What is the name of your cat?

Every time I think of Ken an image springs to mind of a man sitting in front of a bank of screens, scanning for something to be offended at. A kind of pound shop bond villain for Forums. Unfortunately, occasionally his joy at finding something he considers controversial leads him to jump into the fray before the brain engages. Racism is defined as "Prejudice, discrimination, or antagonism directed against someone of a different race based on the belief that one’s own race is superior." Mr Banana has already stated he is white and therefore his comment cannot be considered racist anymore than a black person calling another black person the "N" word is racist.

Morning Ken, Had a good holiday?

Correction, it appears that the fire affected one distributor only ( albeit a big one ). Still not good news.

The Marché de Rungis in Paris ( the second largest food wholesaler in the world, employing 13,000 people, and larger than the principality of Monaco ) has been completely destroyed by a fire. Expect some gaps on the shelves folks.

Interesting. Just looked up my address on HERE and it couldn't find it. The village went over to house numbers around 12 years ago with a couple of streets being renamed but HERE hasn't been updated. Maybe door to door isn't it's thing.

I've always found the RAC route planner to be reliable.

Before normal service is resumed, can I just have a shout out for the Princess Royal. IMHO all the royal family have behaved impeccably over the last week during what must have been a most surreal time in their lives but Princess Anne has stood head and shoulders above them all. Her stamina during the trip down from Scotland was frankly amazing.