Typical Utility Costs in France

[JRdeVries]

Hello.

What is the average monthly cost for utilities, for a detached house in central France (electricity, heating, water, cable, Internet, etc)?

Which is the common fuel source; oil, propane or natural gas?

Thanks.

[idun]

I used to live in a village en plein campagne and I ended up having natural gas so it does exist in french villages, although not common.

[andyh4]

It is an absolutely impossible question to answer JR (I hope you don't mind me calling you that).

Regarding heating cost that will depend more than anything on the level of insulation - which can range from zero to very good. Do not be fooled into thinking that thick stone walls provide good insulation - most usually they don't. Is the property double/triple glazed or not - many older properties are not.

Outside major cities, as Idun suggests, mains gas is rare and liquid gas is an expensive way to heat a house throughout the year.

The generally accepted ranking for cost of heating is (from cheapest to most expensive)

wood, natural gas (piped), oil, electricity, liquid gas.

Within the ranking you are of course at the mercy of oil prices, which directly impact on LPG and have a pull through effect on natural gas. From cheapest to most expensive can be up to a factor of 6 according to some sources.

Electricity prices depend on what level of supply you subscribe to. The higher the power level you need the cheaper it is per unit, but the standing charges also vary with the power demand and the higher your need the higher your standing charge. There is (or more precisely I think was) an off peak option called Tempo, where night time consumption was cheaper than day time, but this is being withdrawn, and unless you are able to run major power consumers like dishwashers, washing machines, water heaters etc exclusively overnight, the benefits are now dubious.

Water charges depend on who your supplier is and where specifically you are located - and will include waste water treatment unless you have a fosse septique.

Cable - not widely available outside the major conurbations. Most people have access to pay to view channels via aerial or satellite.

http://www.recevoirlatnt.fr/particuliers/

English language TV is also available via satellite.

Internet - expect to pay 20-30€ per month. Do not expect that this will necessarily provide a high speed service. The further out of the big towns and cities you are the worse it is likely to be.

[EuroTrash]

If you're thiniing about your renovation project, then depending on the extent of the renovation you will probably have to comply to strict normes as regards insulation. One of France's priorities in meeting its carbon footprint targets is ensuring that new builds and major renovations are energy efficient, and your plans will need to include energy calculations. So you don't have the option of building an energy-hungry house these days.

[Cathar Tours]

Exactly and a friend of mine who has completed a full renovation got quite a bit of money in grants to do this but then you need to be tax resident to get them. Even though it means you can't DIY the installation of things like insulation and windows to get these grants you can reduce the cost further by becoming labourers for the installers i.e. doing all the humping about, fitting the windows fillets and sealing the windows frames yourself if your up to it. At the end of the day he claimed his windows cost the same as buying from a DIY store and installing them himself and that they were a better quality.

[JRdeVries]

Thanks Andy.

Seems like there are many variables. How does it compare to the UK or Noryh America I wonder?

JR

[EuroTrash]

No idea about N America, but overall I would say very similar, perhaps slightly more here than the UK. I used to have gas central heating and water heating in the UK and could be constantly toasty warm for no effort at all, just set the thermostat and the timer and forget about it. Here I use wood and electricity, it is perhaps slightly cheaper but definitely not as toasty warm all the time, and more hassle. Telecoms, well when I arrived adsl definitely cost more here than the cheap deal I'd had in the UK with TalkTalk, but since then prices in France seem to have come down and I don't know whether they've gone down or up or stayed the same in the UK, so it might or might not be about the same now. Water I think is more expensive here, I don't know why because my water wasn't metered in the UK, and here it is and I don't use much so you would think it should be cheaper, but it doesn't seem to be.

You haven't asked about the cost of health service contributions. That is the big thing that costs a lot more here than it did in the UK, and for me I think that's what tips the balance and makes living here more expensive overall.

[Chancer]

A correction for AndyH4.

 

Unless I am going senile I think the unit cost for electricity on domestic tarif bleu is the same whatever the puissance suscrite, its just the abonnement that changes and apart from the 3kva tarif all the others are proportionate to each other, i.e. abonnement for 12kva costs double that for 6kva more or less.

 

ADSL in France is now a lot cheaper than the UK if you are in a zone dégroupée as there is no line rental, €30 per month will get you ADSL, telephone with free calls to 100 countries plus a free 2 hours per month mobile phone contract with unlimited textos. There are much cheaper introductory deals, there is one at the moment for €10 per month which they claim to be the price for life but I have no doubt that they will eventually wriggle out of it.

 

Health service contributions if you can work out what goes where are probably less than the UK NIC but then does that all go to the health service? My overall déductions, taxes and social charges are a fraction of what they would be in the UK and the OP is talking of going into the same line of business, I choose not to have a mutuelle and what I have had to pay myself over 10 years amounts to next to nothing and certainly a lot less than mutuelle contributions.

 

If you are moving to France to start a business does it really matter what the relative costs would be in the UK or US? Unless you are choosing between the 3 countries why concern yourself? - It is what it is!

[EuroTrash]

"My overall déductions, taxes and social charges are a fraction of what they would be in the UK"

How do you work that out Chancer? When I was in the UK I earned enough to live on but still qualified for a "low earnings exemption", so I paid 0 NICs. Also 0 tax and 0 other business taxes (I had an accountant). I thought you too were on a fairly low income as far as the taxman is concerned, so presumably in the UK you too would pay 0? Possibly you also pay 0 in France, but you can't pay a fraction of 0.

[PaulT]

Our electricity cost seemed to be high - 200l chaffeau, electric oven and hob, microwave, fridge + lighting and power for TV etc.

As there is normally only two of us I also fitted a 100l chaffeau on the basis of less water to heat and keep hot.

I had also bought an 'hours' meter, i.e. records how long the water was being heated, by connecting to the element. Then multiply the hours by the consumption of the element to arrive at the kWh.

Extremely surprised to discover that the cost was extremely low.So presumably, the oven and hob are the main culprits.

Do need to look in to phone and Internet - currently paying 40.99 euros per month which includes International calls.

As has been said, oil prices do fluctuate.

[Cathar Tours]

[quote user="JRdeVries"]Thanks Andy.

Seems like there are many variables. How does it compare to the UK or Noryh America I wonder?

JR[/quote]

Can't answer that but you might find the following link useful.

https://www.justlanded.com/english/France/Articles/Property/Heating-Air-Conditioning

Here is another - https://www.frenchentree.com/living-in-france/utilities/options-for-heating-your-house-in-france/

There are links in the article that point you to French websites. If you don't speak French (like me) then use Google Chrome and it's built in translator. It' about 90% right depending on how good the grammar is in the original text.

Other sites to visit are...

Electricity - https://particulier.edf.fr/fr/accueil/offres/electricite/tarif-bleu/options.html

For town gas - https://particuliers.engie.fr/tarif-reglemente-gaz-gdf-suez.html

For Domestic Butane gas - https://en.selectra.info/energy-france/guides/propane

For fuel oil - http://www.prixfioul.fr

My father has a B&B and his annual electricity bill based on five letting rooms was just under 2,400€ for a year. Some towns have private electricity.

He spends about 600€ on wood every year for heating plus around another 240€ on paraffin for heating (not to be confused with fuel oil).

Water is about 400€ a year. There is no national tariff on water and it can vary wildly between once place and another.

He has Orange for adsl because they have an English speaking helpline 480€ pa. There are cheaper but I think I am right in saying only Orange have an English speaking helpline.

I don't know what his combined property tax is but that varies from one property to another, where it is etc.

It's not really something you can give a cut and dry answer to but you can ask the real estate agent for some of these figures for a specific property.

As for tax I guess these days you automatically go with http://www.lautoentrepreneur.fr/ which is in French so again use Google to translate.

Two things I remember my father saying was firstly do not under any circumstances use a loan to buy a B&B or a property you intend to use as a B&B. Secondly you or your partner need another occupation because normally there is not enough money in a B&B after costs, taxes etc. to live on.

That reminds me you pat tax per person per night for those staying at your establishment. I don't know how much that is other than my father complaining that it has gone up about 500% in eight years where he lives but then he complains about paying any form of tax.