No Carte Vitale - can this be right?

[Daft Doctor]

Hi, I've just come back from our local CPAM office very confused indeed.  When I handed in my first S1 in May, it was only valid until 04/01/2013 as I still needed to pay 3 months Class 2 NIC in the UK from my previous self-employment (DWP went to delayed payment of Class 2's a year or so ago).  I received an 'Attestation de droits' from CPAM soon afterwards, valid until 24/11/2012, having been told it would take a good while to get the Carte Vitale through.  At CPAM Annecy's written request I then sent off copy of passport, birth certificate and translation 'assermentée', then sat back thinking that at some point my Carte Vitale would arrive.  Once I caught up with my Class 2's, I contacted overseas heath in Newcastle and they sent me out another S1, valid from 05/01/2013 until 04/1/2014.

My visit to the CPAM Sallanches office today was primarily to hand this in to avoid a potential break in healthcare coverage, but after I had done this and the assistant had said all was in order, I asked when I might expect to receive my Carte Vitale, as I'd been in the country for almost 6 months.  She then told me that I wouldn't be getting a Carte Vitale at all, as I had a social security number beginning 71, I would just use the Attestation instead!  I have never heard of this before, and quite frankly I don't believe she is right.  For a start the current attestation expires on 24th November, so will need renewing, but do I really have to spend the next 15 months sending Feuilles de Soins into CPAM to get reimbursed a month later (as has just happened) every time I see a Dr or dentist?  Could anybody tell me before I fire off a letter to CPAM in Annecy whether or not the woman in the Sallanches office is correct?  Any clarity in the mist would be most appreciated!   [8-)]

[andyh4]

Right or wrong an attestation cannot be read by the doctors' machines - so you will end up paying and then having to claim back the hard way.

 

 

[NormanH]

Remember that this was always the way before the plastic card came in..

We had to do as you describe for years.

For quite a while there were some professionals who hadn't got the machine to read the cards anyway, though these are fewer nowadays but still exist.

http://www.ameli.fr/assures/soins-et-remboursements/comment-etre-rembourse/la-feuille-de-soins.php

On the other hand your social security number is strange. It must be a special ss number for those on S1s.

Your normal one would be

1 (for a man)

46/47 et for year of birth

01 -12 for the month of your birth

99 because you were born abroad

3 digits to show the country you were born in (I think it is 133 for UK)

then 3  more generated figures referring to your birth certificate, and a 2 digit 'key'

https://www.lassuranceretraite.fr/cs/Satellite/PUBPrincipale/Salaries/Comprendre-Retraite/Releve-Carriere/Votre-Numero-Securite-Sociale?packedargs=null

[Chancer]

[quote user="Daft Doctor"]

She then told me that I wouldn't be getting a Carte Vitale at all, as I had a social security number beginning 71, I would just use the Attestation instead!  I have never heard of this before, and quite frankly I don't believe she is right.  For a start the current attestation expires on 24th November, so will need renewing, but do I really have to spend the next 15 months sending Feuilles de Soins into CPAM to get reimbursed a month later (as has just happened) every time I see a Dr or dentist?  Could anybody tell me before I fire off a letter to CPAM in Annecy whether or not the woman in the Sallanches office is correct?  Any clarity in the mist would be most appreciated!   [8-)]

[/quote]

Thats precisely what I have been doing for 7 years now; my number starts with 5.

The system works fine and as Norman said that is how it used to be, besides we have to create some illusion of work for all the staff that were not laid off when their jobs should have dissapeared with the introduction of the automated CV payment system, much easier to say that you are completement debordé when you have an in tray overflowing with feuilles de soins, thats why they take so long to process them.

Editted, You are lucky they refused point blank to give me an attestation de droits, the system wont allow them to, they did begrudgingly agree to turn a blind eye while I did a screen print of my account status which shows my rights open to 2015, I use this in lieu of an attestation.

[Gardener]

Doesn't it depend on the Dr one is registered with?

I have declared my médecin traitant and he works alone, no secretaries , no booking rdvs and I have to fill in in a feuilles de soins everytime.

Mrs G for various reasons has changed to a female doctor in town, has to wait a week for appointment via secretary but her dr puts the carte vitale in her machine and everything ( payment and reimbursement) is done quite quickly.

[mint]

Gardener might have a point.

Never had to pay any money upfront to our lovely doctor in the Charente Maritime.  Now, here in the Dordogne, we have to pay the old codger (I am not kidding, he looks like he should no longer be practising) the full amount, even though he duly puts our cards in his card-reader.

Even worse, there were several months when we first moved when the new CPAM took ages to register us and so we didn't get anything from our mutuelle either.

Only recently, OH had a letter to say he was not entitled to any remboursements from the new CPAM (but I think that was because he hadn't seen the doctor for so long that his card had "run out" and he hadn't been to update it on one of those little machines at supermarkets and chemists).

I can understand your confusion, DD......the French health service might be marvellous but it certainly is not the NHS and our doctor is only too quick to ask us for payment each and every time (not free at the point of use, fact!)

As an aside, did anyone see the Panorama programme last night that showed how easy it was for anyone (including imaginery people) to register for primary AND secondary care with the NHS?  Made me proud and sad at the same time....proud that NHS doctors and other personnel aren't trained to weed out the "undeserving" and sad that anyone from absolutely anywhere in the world could so readily take advantage of the lack of rigorous tracking and following up for payment.

[suein56]

[quote user="Daft Doctor"]I asked when I might expect to receive my Carte Vitale, as I'd been in the country for almost 6 months.  She then told me that I wouldn't be getting a Carte Vitale at all, as I had a social security number beginning 71, I would just use the Attestation instead!  ][/quote]

Things haven't changed much then in 6 years then as this is exactly what happened to us. If you have been self-employed in the UK as we were, then the piece of A4 paper called an attestation is all you get here until you can prove you have the right to have a more permanent entitlement which leads, eventually, to a plastic card. And that involves both furnishing proof of your credibility from the UK and building a history in France.

It all takes time and patience. We survived and so will you.

Sue

[idun]

As I have always said, that attestation is far more important than any carte vitale, you can show it at a french hospital and then you won't have to pay up front, they'll just link you into the system, or at least that is what they always did and I cannot see why they wouldn't continue to do that.

 

As I said previously, make sure that you stick those vignettes onto any feuille de soins that you get from the pharmacie, or they won't reimburse.

 

We had most of our years in France with feuille de soins and it can be costly when making the initial payment. All I can say is, keep photocopies of every last thing and keep your eye on your reimbursements.  And it works just fine.

 

[Daft Doctor]

Well, I have learned yet another new thing about life in France, thanks to all for their insight.  I'm really surprised that in all the research I did leading up to our move I wasn't lucky or thorough enough to find a mention of this particular quirk.  I always presumed CV followed within months not years if at all.

To be honest, at the moment (hopefully to continue) I rarely attend the doctor, so sending off the feuilles de soin now and again is no big deal, and I'm not so hard up that I can't wait a month for the reimbursement.  It's having the cover that matters, be it through attestation or whatever.  I'm slightly relieved in a way, it means I haven't got to write yet another letter to some corner of the French administration!  [:)] 

[EmilyA]

It seems to me it might be because you haven't got a proper social security number yet. We had a temporary number at first and didn't get CVs until we got proper numbers starting with 1 for men and 2 for women. Maybe you will get the number next year?

[Jo]

When we moved out in 2010 we had cover from our earnings that year, (they had to be over £5000+ for the 2 years before we moved) we applied to CPAM with our S1s and got an attestation through the post within 2 weeks, just as well as I had a fall in the garden that needed treatment! The fact that I had the attestation was sufficient. Within 2 months we had the new carte vitales, the one with the photos. Certainly didn't have to wait for a year!!!!