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90€ poorer but wiser about unmarked police bike on D958


just john

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Heading back north on the D958 towards Caen between Argentan and St Clair I overtook a slow moving car on a clear straight downhill stretch, and got back in just before the lines priority changed on the uphill section, safe manoeuvre I thought, with no other cars around and good visibility etc;  barely noticed the black bike and rider in black helmet and leathers pull out and follow me. About 10k further on he was joined by a police bike who then switched on the lights and pulled me over, discussion was pointless said the black rider since he had seen me cross the line; my abysmal french was soon replaced with their faultless english, even understanding the comment 'harsh'. 90€ or they would confiscate my licence and passport, at which point he left and the nice policeman wrote me out a receipt and returned my passport and licence. He explained the rider was an unmarked police bike and my treatment was not harsh and how lucky I was not to receive an endorsement which the french licence holders receive. So now, not just road conditions, marked police cars and bikes, but unmarked bikes lurking in side roads.
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I thought it was a requirement to carry your passport?  I always have mine with me...and I guess, faced with a burly gendarme demanding money with menaces I would probably hand it over too.  Sounds like the public fund raisers are branching out.  Who said the french weren't entrepreneurs!

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Requirement or not I do not believe that any Gendarme has the right to confiscate a passport.

I carry a laminated photocopy of mine in my wallet, absolutely no legal standing of course but I simply cannot risk losing my passport so it will have to do - or not !

Hopefully I'll never have to put it to the test.

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[quote user="just john "]barely noticed the black bike and rider in black helmet and leathers pull out and follow me. About 10k further on he was joined by a police bike who then switched on the lights and pulled me over,.[/quote]

I think that perhaps WB and baypond should re-read the OP.[geek]

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Contrary to popular myth there is no legal requirement to carry a passport with you at all times.

 

However - and it is a fairly big one - the gendarmes do have a right to detain anyone they suspect of a crime until they (the person being held) can establish their identity.  A passport is often the quickest "get out of jail free card" that is available.  Lots of other things though - driving licence, utility bill tucked into your wallet, even the person you are with, can all act as substitutes for the trusty passport.

 

As a kind or reinforcement to this I had to give my passport to a foreign embassy to obtain a visa.  During the time it was being processed I was regularly travelling between France and Germany and at every police and security check, my driving licence was fully accepted as proof of identity (picture licence naturally).

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For those interested in further explanation, in hindsight the overtaking spot was one where indiscretions were likely to be committed and clearly the local force had taken the decision rather than post a marked vehicle to prevent infringements, that they would post an unmarked vehicle to report and prosecute infringements. The marked bike pulled in front of me and stopped me while the unmarked bike parked behind. The first request was for my licence and then my passport (in each case asking me to remove them from their case) the policeman then explained the reason for stopping me and this was backed by the unmarked witness who was then confirmed as a policeman. My defence that I thought that it was harsh one-sided justice was dismissed. An official receipt was given.

However my thoughts are that others might be made aware of the spot and the mind set of the local police on what is a new tactic to me and on what must be a busy spot for people on their way to and from Caen and Cherbourg.

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[quote user="AnOther"]Once again John, and for complete clarity,

'You say you 'got back in just before the lines priority changed on the uphill section' so are we to presume that the black rider lied ?'

[/quote]

The thrust of my post was the tactic AO,
This is not a pic of the bike involved but an article thanks to SD

http://www.alencon.maville.com/actu/actudet_-Une-moto-banalisee-pour-traquer-les-infractions-_dep-853395_actu.Htm

but for complete clarity, I thought I had got back across.
However I wasn't watching the line but my nearside mirror since I was in a 'blind' van, to avoid cutting across the car's bows. However either way it was a manoeuvre without risk to others at the time and a matter of a close thing as to whether I had technically infringed the thing by whatever. Eitherway, I wasn't going to win an argument with two police at the side road and I didn't intend to miss the ferry, so to me it was a 90€ fee to avoid a lose lose situation.

 

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With respect John whether you crossed the line or didn't seems to me to be the thrust because you were essentially accusing the black rider of lieing, may I remind you of your original statement which was pretty clear and unequivocal.

[quote user="just john "]got back in just before the lines

priority changed
[/quote]

The fact's now seem to be that you committed the offence and got caught and fined, and as upset as you might be about the manner it really is immaterial. Would you have been any less disgruntled if you'd been caught by say a watching Gendarme on a bridge over the road you were on ?

I might add that if indeed it was slow vehicle you overtook yet you were still concerned about getting back in in time without cutting it up it might suggest that there just may have been insufficient room to perform the maneouver in the first place.

Come on, fess up, you're amongst friends. Coming up to single lane section with no overtaking, slower car ahead to potentially hold you up for that couple of km uphill grind, thinks 'if I put on a little spurt I can just nip by ?' - there's no shame in it, we've all been there, well most of us any way anyway [Www]

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Whether or not they were technically right (and from John's description it sound's like there was only a gnat's whisker in it) it also seems like it was a safe manoeuvre.  It's a bit like those speeding fines handed out for doing more than 40 mph....at 3.00 am on a clear dual carriageway.  It would be nice if they focussed on those situations where the driver is actually driving irresponsibly...and then throw the book at him.  (You know, the Spanish / Portugese lorry drivers that think it's great fun to race each other around the periphique, weaving in and out of traffic...with not a gendarme in sight.)   The other stuff is petty money raising antics.

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As we all know, the English are far better drivers than the French, so in John's case, it was certainly petty of the law enforcement authorities to enforce the law and book him for breaking it....

I wonder if the the overtaken driver was thinking 'just look at that and not a gendarme in sight' - until 10kms further on when he caught up with John being booked.....[;-)]

 

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Methinks a degree of schadenfreude might be showing SD[:D]; However I have tried to show the incident in its full light, including a degree of uncertainty on my part and if I have made others aware of the novelty of the tactic and mindset then that was my intention. I didn't bother to mention the suitability of the rider in black who's arrogance and aggression certainly qualified him for his task by comparison to the other policeman who was politeness personified including shaking my hand as he left; certainly their language skills demonstrated a qualification for talking to English registered vehicles. They also demonstrated there was no room for anything but payment.
Perhaps the best side effect of this must be an additional respect drivers should profer to powerful bikist's.[8-|]

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[quote user="Sunday Driver"]

As we all know, the English are far better drivers than the French, so in John's case, it was certainly petty of the law enforcement authorities to enforce the law and book him for breaking it....

I wonder if the the overtaken driver was thinking 'just look at that and not a gendarme in sight' - until 10kms further on when he caught up with John being booked.....[;-)]

 

[/quote]

LOL - I think we all know what I was referring to!  When legal techicality points mean prizes we all know which way the gendarmes will bend....

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[quote user="Chancer"]A French cheque yes, Visa no! But they will insist on looking after your car keys for you while you walk to the nearest town with an ATM.[/quote]

Chancer, they gave OH his car keys to drive to the nearest distributeur de billets BUT they kept his passport to ensure that he'd come back with the fine!

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