Penal code: public safety

[Chat Noir]

Hi

Am wondering if anyone knows what the relevant penal code is relating to public safety in your commune?

For example, hooligans speeding in their cars on bridle path clearly marked "no entry" to vehicles.

Thanks in advance.

CN

[pettersmith]

I did not understand what are you saying i need some more explanation Penal Code for what ???

[Clair]

Forget the code (and it's more likely to be the code de la route, possibly this art.)

Your first port of call is the maire's office (and I don't mean just the mairie, but him/her in his/her office).

Talk to your maire face-to-face, explaining your concerns regarding public safety.

Then if required, put the same in a recorded letter, which will ensure the problem is not swept under the carpet but looked at at the next conseil municipal.

The minutes to the meeting are made public at the mairie and you can also be present at the conseil.

[Chat Noir]

Hi Clair

Many thanks for your reply.

Just to expand more on this matter. We have been complaining directly to the maire on this issue for over 5 years (two different mairies, in fact, as the original chap died in office). On several occasions the local gendarmes have been asked to monitor the situation, but do not have the resources (or care too much about the problem!).

We have photographic evidence of many of the law-breakers, car/motorbike registration numbers etc, which the mairie and his secretary are keen to take possession of and positively encourage us to do. But then do nothing about it!

Two years ago our neighbour (French) drew up an official letter of complaint that we all signed and it was presented to the maire and discussed at the council meeting - but no action was taken.

We have asked that a barrier be put in place, but have been told that this would be denied under some local by-law. The track narrows down so cars cannot pass right through to the neighbouring commune (where there is a barrier!), but small motorcycles can pass right through and it is used as a regular short-cut in this respect.

We recall reading somewhere that there is a code in French law whereby the maire is responsible for the safety and security of members of his/her commune.

In our opinion car drivers ignoring a very prominent "no entry" sign and driving at excessive speed (we are talking 100kph!) along a single unmade track, used by walkers, cyclists and horse riders, is getting beyond a joke and we are looking for an appropriate solution.

rgds, CN

[idun]

Don't suppose that any of your neighbours or friends has a JCB? And someone has a very very big rock that they could contribute to put at the entrance to the bridal path, leaving enough room for horses and walkers to get by.

For me it would have been easy to get organised, and I suspect that we would have done it. Still we had lots, well probably thousands if not millions of big rocks in the area, when they called Apremont, Apre Mont, it was after the mountain had fallen down and the whole area got more than it's fair share of monster rocks.

[Chat Noir]

It has crossed our mind...

[Clair]

[quote user="Chat Noir"]...

We recall reading somewhere that there is a code in French law whereby the maire is responsible for the safety and security of members of his/her commune.[/quote]

A quick search brings up this reference:(art.HERE)

[quote]CODE PÉNAL

(Partie législative)

(Loi nº 96-393 du 13 mai 1996 art. 1 Journal Officiel du 14 mai 1996)

(Loi nº 2000-647 du 10 juillet 2000 art. 1 Journal Officiel du 11 juillet 2000)

Il n'y a point de crime ou de délit sans intention de le commettre.

Toutefois, lorsque la loi le prévoit, il y a délit en cas de mise en danger délibérée de la personne d'autrui.

Il y a également délit, lorsque la loi le prévoit, en cas de faute d'imprudence, de négligence ou de manquement à une obligation de prudence ou

de sécurité prévue par la loi ou le règlement, s'il est établi que

l'auteur des faits n'a pas accompli les diligences normales compte tenu,

le cas échéant, de la nature de ses missions ou de ses fonctions, de ses

compétences ainsi que du pouvoir et des moyens dont il disposait.

Dans le cas prévu par l'alinéa qui précède, les personnes physiques qui

n'ont pas causé directement le dommage, mais qui ont créé ou contribué à

créer la situation qui a permis la réalisation du dommage ou qui n'ont pas

pris les mesures permettant de l'éviter, sont responsables pénalement

s'il est établi qu'elles ont, soit violé de façon manifestement délibérée

une obligation particulière de prudence ou de sécurité prévue par la loi

ou le règlement, soit commis une faute caractérisée et qui exposait

autrui à un risque d'une particulière gravité qu'elles ne pouvaient

ignorer.

source[/quote]

[sid]

However irritating and dangerous this is for you, I think I would advise against taking action yourself, that is, JCBs, rocks etc. If it's a road or track belonging to the commune then surely you'd also be breaking a code by causing obstructions or potential accidents. Yoiu could end up being the ones punished!

Far better to pursue through the proper legal channels. If the Maire doesn't help, what about consulting a notaire or avocat for further advice? If you all contribute, hopefully the cost to each individual will be reduced.

[Chat Noir]

Again, many thanks Clair.

We will go armed with this article and our latest photo evidence to the mairie.

kind rgds, CN

[Chancer]

Sounds to me that despite you describing  it as an unmade track with a no entry sign it could in fact be une impasse for vehicles but not motorcycles, a public right of way not closed to motor vehicles that serves to link the two communes to two wheelers.

If this is not the case then I dont see why they cannot fit a further width restriction at the entrance to the lane, if it is in fact classified as a vehicular right of way then in the absence of a speed limit sign 100km/h would not be speeding.

I suspect that we are not getting the full story here, I can see the reason for the motorcyclists using it to go from village to village but its the speed of the cars you are complaining about, where are they going to or is it a convenient secluded test track?

[idun]

If we are talking about this happening out in the french countryside, well I think I understand. If it is anything like my french village and the surrounding ones, there is little for the kids to do. Now I say kids, as I find that those that I consider fully mature adults still acted like kids quite often. On their mobilettes with the noisiest of exhausts until they can get a car or proper bike and then they go wild.

So they race, they tail gate, dangerous driving really on normal roads. These particular 'drivers' may even think that this bit of 'track' is safer than going on normal roads and maybe they are right. And my big rock wouldn't stop the bikers would it.

Me, I'd be mad about it happening near where I live, proper NIMBY me[Www], but that would not stop me understanding 'why' I believe that they are doing it. Living nulle part is very hard for the young, especially as they get older and there are so few job opportunities.

So go to the Mairie once again armed with your evidence Chat Noir and tell them that you will be contacting your deputé and Prefecture if nothing is done.

[sid]

[quote user="Chancer"]

I suspect that we are not getting the full story here, .....

[/quote]

More than likely.  [;-)]  As I read it there is a gate at the other end, so where are they all going?

 

[idun]

Just as far as they can and back again?

 

[Chat Noir]

idun has hit the nail on the head - there is no through road for cars due to a narrowing of the track through the forest and a gate at the other end.

The young car drivers are using the track for racing purposes and the old muppets use it to reduce the length they need to go to walk their dogs/fish the river/snog, marry, avoid!

To put Chancer further in the picture - no holding back info here - there is an official road sign (at the entrance to the track, which is right beside our front gate) for no entry to cars, motorcycles and mobilettes.

This morning we had another example of arrogance, when a local (we know who he is) sped up the track in his jeep, spent some minutes collecting ferns from the forest, raced back down and nearly ran over a holidaymaker who was returning from fishing the river!

And, yes, we have the evidence and am off to the mairie - again!

CN

[Chancer]

I cant see why they cant put in width restrictions then, even a staggered hurdle will put off most two wheelers, if access is needed for farmers there could be a locked gate, maybe they need to keep the access open for the sapeur pompiers and ambulances, sounds like there might be a fair few accidents and heart attacks.

You wait till the doggers find your little impasse [6]

[Chat Noir]

They already have...

[sid]

... and you have photographic evidence of that too?? [:-))][:-))]

[Chat Noir]

No but we have audio... although we have had trouble translating the grunts and eeks into recognisable English!

Anyway on a serious note, we have just returned from a meeting with the mairie, his secretary and the sous-mairie, at which we drew to their attention the relevant code penal (provided by Clair in an earlier post).

This woke them up and they have now agreed to present a complete dossier of all our photographs to the gendarmerie - together with the provision of a new and more prominent sign, which indicates that the bridle path is "interdit" to cars, motorbikes and mobilettes.

They have also asked us to continue photographing those who defy the order on the sign.

Many thanks for the advice given.

CN

[idun]

Good, I'm pleased that they realised that they should be doing something.

Wonder where these people will go now, because sure as eggs they will find somewhere else.

[sid]

That sounds better, CN, good luck then!

[Clair]

[quote user="Chat Noir"]... we have just returned from a meeting with the mairie, his secretary and the sous-mairie, at which we drew to their attention the relevant code penal (provided by Clair in an earlier post).

This woke them up and they have now agreed to present a complete dossier of all our photographs to the gendarmerie...[/quote]

Thank you for coming back with an update.

Do let us know how this evolves...

[Chat Noir]

Update on our bridle path problem: the maire finally ordered a new sign and had it added to the post carrying the existing "no entry for cars, motorbikes and scooters" sign, warning that there would be sanctions for anyone who ignored the notice. Needless to say, everyone is continuing to ignore the notice and the maire is not bothering monitoring the situation in order to hand out the "sanctions"!

Now we have another issue, so have approached our maire again but am not expecting a positive resolution, but some of you kindly folks here might have a solution (don't know if large blocks of concrete will work for this one unless dropped from above LOL).

Our property is opposite a municipal camping site overseen by the maire (!!) and we have recently began to see a significant rise in noise disruption, comprising of one caravan owner seemingly running a carpentry business from his plot and running an industrial-size band-saw all weekdays day and all weekend (from 9am to 6pm). The secondary noise pollution is from occupiers of another caravan who insist on playing music at high volume, when they are in attendance at their caravan, mostly all weekend (Friday evening through to Sunday evening).

The secretary at the maire advised us today that we can call the police to report such noise and we would be interested to know if anyone else has had a similar problem, if the police dealt with it, or if any further legal action was required and if so, what?

Interestingly, in the same conversation, the maire's secretary mentioned that a 15 minute lawnmower session by my OH at 12 noon one day (didn't realise the time!) had attracted a telephone complaint to the maire's office by one of the offending caravan owners protesting that we were spoiling his lunch and warned us that we could liable to a police visit!

Obviously to find out who the noise makers were we had taken a quiet wander around the caravan park and the secretary also told us that no resident of our village is entitled to enter the municipal caravan site due to not being insured against accidents - something that is not highlighted on any notice at the park gates, or detracts other locals from going about their business (dog-walking etc) in there.

All sounds a bit one-sided to us?!

CN