Which English tenses will have been covered in school by the age of 13?

[westland]

I have been asked to help a 13yr old with her English as she missed some schooling last year.  She wanted to look at irregular verbs and I started with the past simple.  I have now prepared some information on the present perfect/progressive but I would like to have an idea which tenses should have been covered over the last year.  I have tried to ask her, but it has taken me some time to remember the different tenses myself and also to make sure that I don't confuse her as I can only relate to the tense titles in english.

  If anyone out there teaches, has children in school here or who can help with either the correct tense names as studied in France, or with information as to which tenses Melanie ought to have already studied,  I would be grateful.  Kate.

[The Riff-Raff Element]

Since no-one has answered this I will try, but I should point out that I am neither a parent of a child doing English at this stage, nor a qualified teacher - I teach on a voluntary basis children up to 11. The grammer books I use for my own prep, suggest a working understanding of:

- présent simple "I work in London"

- prétérit simple "I worked in London"

- what is described as the "ing" form (but what we might describe as the progressive aspect) with be: présent "I am working..." and prétérit "I was working..."

- present perfect "I have worked..." formed with "have"

- past perfect "I had worked..." formed with "have"

Quite a lot of work seems to be done on aspect (perfect or progressive) which can present conceptual difficulties for French speakers.

After that children move on to the use of modal auxilary forms - will, would, could, should, must, etc to express furture forms, obligation, etc. I think that they are expected to know the of existence of these forms by 4eme. The subjunctive in English is not covered until much later.

There must be someone out there with better knowledge than I - having children of the right age, for example, whom they could ask?

If you are willing to spend a few euros in the interest of helping this child, you would probably find the "Bled Anglais Grammaire & Conjugaison" very helpful.

Jon

[LisaJ]

You would find the materials relating to the Literacy Strategy at Key Stages 2 and 3 the most helpful, I think. These can be accessed through the Standards Sites of the DfES. (Now the DCSF, but the web link is still DfES.)

www.standards .dfes.gov.uk

regards

Lisa

[LisaJ]

You would find the materials relating to the Literacy Strategy at Key Stages 2 and 3 the most helpful, I think. These can be accessed through the Standards Sites of the DfES. (Now the DCSF, but the web link is still DfES.)

www.standards.dfes.gov.uk

regards

Lisa

[westland]

Thanks for the replies.  I thought that Melanie was only coming to see me during the holidays, however today she was making arrangements to fit me in around her school timetable when she goes back next week.  As such I don't think that I can continue to spend ages trying to produce grammar exercises myself, which might not even be absolutely correct. 

 I find it difficult when I ask her to translate a sentence back into French to make sure that she has understood the meaning, I'm never sure if the French tense that she has used translates exactly to that in English.    I did print off some notes in French on how to use two of the tenses that we have done, but she didn't really understand them.  Perhaps I am making things too difficult for both of us, so I think the use of text books is a good idea.

 It does worry me that I am not a qualified teacher and although I have my English 'A' level it was achieved many moons ago.  Until I started researching on the internet I couldn't have informed anyone about the different tenses.  However, like you Jon I'm doing this on a voluntary basis and I do keep pointing out to her parents that I am "not a teacher" so I'll give it my best.  Thanks again. Kate.

 

[LisaJ]

I think the basic problem is that the way that we learn verbs in our first language is not the same as the way we learn them in a second language. Although pupils in schools will be taught about tenses and will change writing from the present tense into the past and future (for example), they probably won't learn to conjugate verbs in English as they would in French or any other foreign language. Are you helping her to understand French verbs better or to maintain a good standard of written English? If it is the former then books about French grammar might help. If it is the latter, then it is more important to write things that she will enjoy, as well as ensuring that she expresses herself clearly in accurate English. As someone with A level English you will be more than capable of doing this. I suspect that you may be trying to translate into English, things that she really needs to understand about the French language in French and that is why you are finding things difficult.

I hope this helps rather than confuses!

regards

Lisa

[westland]

[quote user="LisaJ"]

they probably won't learn to conjugate verbs in English as they would in French or any other foreign language. [/quote]

Yes thanks it does help to know this as I had been making up sentences to be conjugated with the past simple and past continuous tense. 

 I think that your comments have prompted me to ask her family exactly what they are hoping for when she comes to see me.  It started with her grandma asking for some "help with her English" so we had a few conversational sessions and I did a couple of basic exercises in the present tense about her interests, pets and animals, thinking like you that it was a good idea.  However, she came one day with a list of a few irregular verbs and asked me to explain them.  So that's when I moved onto making things a little more structured and now it all seems heavy going. Ah well, as she is back at school next week I might get a chance to look at her English homework and text books to see what stage she is at and what type of exercises they are doing.  Thanks Kate.   

P.S. Just a thought I haven't confused things have I?  Melanie is French. 

[LisaJ]

Sorry - yes I had assumed she was English. In which case forget all the stuff about the literacy strategy and learning English as a first language - what you need are her English course books and text books from school. A book on teaching English as a foreign language would also help a lot, I think. I would look at what she is learning and then give her lots of oral / aural practice. For example, if she is learning about the past tense ask her to tell you about an event which has happened in the past, try to pick up on what she is consistently getting wrong and then give her lots more practice. Make sure she is telling you about something she is interested in and (I am sure you do this already) give lots of praise along the way. Then you might look at the written stuff and the lists of irregular verbs (bit of a nightmare in English), but you will be looking at it in context.

Hope this helps

regards

Lisa

[westland]

Many thanks for the tips and encouragement.  I am going to try all the suggestions in these postings; will order the book as mentioned by Jon and concentrate a little more on oral/aural practice.   Hopefully I might be able to help with homework too.  Kate.

[Tourangelle]

Generally when a French child asks for help with irregular verbs, they haven't learnt the list of preterites and past participles that you find at the end of text books.  It may well be this is what she is concerned about, because teachers generally get the pupils to learn them slowly, say 10 by 10 or 20 by 20 at a time.  If the girl has missed a period of school she is probably behind on these.  Otherwise there aren't really irregular verbs in English except have and be.  She should have learnt these in 6eme.  The tenses, as such, are not taught in "isolation", but integrated into the chapters, so she may well not have done a lot of exercises.  I am sure you will find it all much easier as soon as she gets the text book for the year and you will beable to go over it with her.  If it is just the irregular verbs, try games, like throwing a ball to each other when you say the verbs, or miming the active ones.  Try to get her to find rules, like those that do not change, ie put, cut, those that are the same whether it be the preterite or the past participle, such as spend spent spent, have had had, and those that are different all the way through, give gave given, etc.  Get her to spot the odd one out of those that you say, for example.  Vary the activities, make them fun and put them in context and she'll be well on her way!