more trailer issues

[terry1956]

Hi all, as some of you may know, I have been asking a few questions re trailers of late, This made me think a bit harder then I have for some time, Anyway I have a motorboat and its on a trailer, I use the boat for diving so its used both here and in the UK, The boat its self is under UK regt as there was no way I was going to be able to get the paperwork for it, Anyway the trailer is a UK trailer, Now as I understand it my french 4x4 can not tow the trailer as its a uk trailer without insurrance, yet as the boat itself is regt and as insurrance in the UK i can use it without any worries in french waters N/P. So as the boat trailer is over 750kg, does this mean that I need a french boat trailer ????. Sunday driver whats your view on this.

I wish to keep within the law as there are far to many stop checks here abouts caen, and just because I like working within the law of the land.

michael 

[AnOther]

I don't know anything about boats in France but as far as the trailer goes I can't imagine it matters one iota what's on or in it, if it's over 750kg it needs registering - period.

Will watch with interest other replies and views though.

[Sunday Driver]

Firstly, just to correct one point.  The qualifying PTAC (all up weight) for trailer registration is 500kg, not 750kg.  If it's over 750kg then it must also be braked.

If you have a French registered car, then  you'll either have get your UK trailer registered here or buy a French trailer.

 

 

[terry1956]

Hi SD, sorry you are wrong on this point, under licence B it is ok to tow a 750kg PTAV trailer under the towing cars insurance if the towing car is 1.5 tons or over.

I have checked this both with my insurance company AXA, and with the local police. But it still looks like a new boat trailer, Will be looking at replacing next year, as this year was a total wash out.

michael    

[Bob T]

Thats funny, SD said a trailer over 500kg need a Carte Gris, and you tell him he is wrong because your insurance for the car covers the trailer upto 750kg. What has that got to do with needing a CG?

[AnOther]

It takes a brave or foolish man to question SD on points of French motoring law [Www]

[quote user="terry1956"]I have checked this both with my insurance company AXA, and with the local police.[/quote]I'm assuming here that you mean AXA and Police in France and also that your car is French registered in which case, as SD says, you cannot tow your trailer with it's UK number plates behind it - period.

BTW, on a tangent and with advance apologies if neccessary, if your car isn't French registered but you have it "covered" by AXA France, well that opens a totally different can of worms...!

[terry1956]

Hi, after  spending alot of time on this issue. I have been to the local police in caen, a trailer centre and my insurance company AXA, this is what they all said. Under french law a trailer at all under the weight of 500kg all in can be towed without a CG and is under the towing cars insurance, a trailer weighing 750kg all in can be towed without a CG under the towing cars insurance if that car weights more then 1.5 tons. A trailer over 750kg needs a CG and number plate and its own insurance, no matter what towing car etc. As I have a 4x4 and a motorhome each weighing more then 1.5 ton I can tow a trailer upto 750kg all in under the insurance of the 4x4 or motorhome, the trailer does not need a CG its own number plate or insurance. This ruling comes under licence B of the road trafic act.

michael  

[AnOther]

I think you're tying yourself up in knots here Michael.

• Forget Licence Category B, it has absolutely nothing to do with CG's only with permissable towing weights and combinations.

• Forget insurance (and especially advice from a commercial organisation who are known to offer insurance to resident brits still tooling around on UK plates when they shouldn't be).

• Listen to SD

[quote user="Sunday Driver"]... The qualifying PTAC (all up weight) for trailer registration is 500kg, not 750kg.  If it's over 750kg then it must also be braked.

If you have a French registered car, then  you'll either have get your UK trailer registered here or buy a French trailer.[/quote]

QED

[terry1956]

Hi EY, NO I am not tieing myself in knots, What I first wanted to know was what weight of trailer I could tow behind my french plated car, I have been told its limited to 500kg if the trailer does not have its own CG, This is not the fact, I can tow behind my 4x4 a trailer of 750kg without the trailer needing its own CG etc. This is good for me as it allows me to pick from a much larger pond of trailers then before. As for forgetting insurance, how can I when it forms a part of the question, after all they did not try to sell me anything, just looked at my 4x4,s CG and at my insurance and said ok for 750kg. Also the police are not a commercial organisation, they know the law, and if they say its ok, then its ok.

michael

      

[AnOther]

You've obviously convinced yourself Michael so I'll bow out now.

Bon chance.

ErnieY

[allanb]

[quote user="terry1956"]Hi EY, NO I am not tieing myself in knots...[/quote]Yes, you are. [quote]What I first wanted to know was what weight of trailer I could tow behind my french plated car, I have been told its limited to 500kg if the trailer does not have its own CG, This is not the fact...[/quote] Yes, it is.[quote]...I can tow behind my 4x4 a trailer of 750kg without the trailer needing its own CG etc....[/quote]No, you can't.

SD has said it (several times) and the Code de la Route says it: if the maximum permitted laden weight of the trailer is 500kg or more, it must be separately registered and have its own CG.

There's a separate rule about the ratio between the car's weight and the trailer's weight, and there's yet another one about when trailers need to have brakes.  I think you're confusing both of these with the registration rule.  

[terry1956]

Hi all, if the police and insurance company are happy that I can, then I can,

lets call an end to this please. thanks michael

[Sunday Driver]

Code de la route Art R3221-1 states:

Tout propriétaire d'un véhicule à moteur, d'une remorque dont le poids total autorisé en charge est supérieur à 500 kilogrammes ou d'une semi-remorque, qui souhaite le mettre en circulation pour la première fois, doit adresser au préfet du département de son domicile une demande de certificat d'immatriculation.

Never mind what your insurance have told you or what the trailer manufacturer has told you.  If the trailer is over 500kg, then it needs a carte grise.

The licence requirements for towing various trailer/towcar combinations has nothing to do with the legal requirement regarding registration of the trailer.  Nor does the requirement for insuring it separately or not have any relevance.

Of course, you could always ignore this....[8-)]

 

 

[terry1956]

Hi SD, I am not trying to be bloody minded, but why after asking the local police, my insurance agent, and also a french man who had much the same trailer as I am looking for, who all stated thats its ok for me for me to tow a trailer of 750kg behind my 4x4, out all these people wrong, is that french person breaking the law, doe that french policeman not know the law of his country, and does the insurance make up the paperwork for my 4x4 to show that I can tow a 750kg trailer, all make this up. I don,t think so,

michael  

[Bob T]

Some people don't like the answer to the question so they ask loads of people and believe the one that has the answer that suits them.

[Sunday Driver]

Michael

I don't think you are trying to be bloody minded, however, there does appear to be some element of confusion here.  You are considering three different areas:

1.  Does my trailer need to be registered or not?

2. What weight of trailer am I allowed to tow behind by 4x4 and which category licence will allow me to do this?

3.  What weight of trailer can be included on the towcar's insurance policy and what need's its own insurance cover?

Given that the registration requirement is based on a simple, single weight figure with no variation, then I suspect the advice you have received from your sources is related to the questions you have asked about items 2 and 3.....