LanguedocGal
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Posts posted by LanguedocGal
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Thanks.
My reference to a Pole was purely tongue in cheek , as it's highly unlikely the municipalite would accept foreign contractors even those from other EU member countries. The urbanists have to approve everything (colours of facades etc) for each building so, even if owners wanted, I doubt very much they could bring anyone over.
I was simply shocked by such a condition as I, naturally, expected all responsibility for non compliance to fall firmly on the shoulder of the owner as they are the one's instructing the artisan. In my understanding, the Artisan's insurance covered the rectification of shoddy work but this goes way beyond that.
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[quote user="helene"]i was surprised by the 25-44 age group - apart from the Alps where are this age group? i am late 20's and in France and only ever seem to meet pensioners living fulltime in france! if you are under 40 - where do you live? h x[/quote]
I agree with you Helene. I don't think there are many British under 35's resident full-time in France.
Re under 40s, apart from Paris, PERHAPS there is a small concentration on the Cote D'Azure around Nice/Cannes/Antibes. I mention this specifically because of Sophia Antipolis where many expats work. However, they may not be full-time residents but here on contracts.
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Good for you Zeb, I thought it would be a pity to lose the job unless it was a really crummy job/client.
On a slightly different but related point.
I have discovered something about Artisan/client contracts that astounded me.
A few months ago, owners of properties in my area a ‘secteur sauvegarde’ were summoned to a meeting by the Town planners and the Mairie regarding the façade renovation programme.
Whilst warning us about what we could and couldn’t do, a French owner pointed out 'gleefully'', it sounded to me, that in any case it was the ‘’Artisan’s responsibility’’ if we installed the wrong thing. I was a little flabbergasted because at this point, we were discussing the replacement/renovation of 18th and 19th century balconies and wooden windows. So, I asked the Urbanist to explain.
It transpired, for example, that if an owner asks an Artisan to install a high quality PVC window made to resemble the existing wooden ones, the Municipalite would pursue the Artisan and not the owner. The logic being that the responsibility lies with the Artisans, as they should know the regulations governing conservation areas, which they are obliged to abide by. So, even if the window and installation were of excellent quality, the Planners said it was their duty to pursue the Artisan and not the owner who had made the decision.
Well, talk about a Nanny State! Even though, I am the protected party here, I can’t say I appreciated it as in so many areas of French life, the ‘State’ determines responsibility in the most illogical (for me) fashion treating the individual like imbeciles.
People at the meeting were saying that the time given to us for the renovations wasn't enough as there weren't enough highly qualified artisans available locally to do the work as it's quite a large sector. I then wondered what would happen if someone brought over a qualified fitter from another European country e.g Poland[;-)] and mistakes were made regarding the material? Who would they pursue? By this point, there were so many angry owners screaming at the planners for other gripes that I thought I’d belt up.
So, my questions to Artisans on this forum; are you aware of this law or were the Planners just fibbing to escape lynching by the angry mob before them?
A rather large can for Artisans to carry..
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Think Clair has hit the nail on the head, ''if adopted''.
This is where I lose my sense of humour and see red in France (becoming the Brit from hell [6]) because measures designed to facilitate the population's existence, within the business and work context, are rarely adopted or if adopted, never in it's simplest form. So, if adopted, I look forward to lots of twists and turns and mountains of paperwork for those affected.
Sorry if I sound bitter and twisted on issues remotely related to doing business or working in lovely France but I have good reason...
I've read articles suggesting this is no more than electioneering but again (for the 1000th time), let's hope it comes to pass in a simple form.
It would appear though that the notion of not paying taxes for the 2008 period (pay 2009 taxes in 2009 and thereby nothing for 2008) is supposed to help sell the idea to the populace.
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Zeb, how about redoing the quote to reflect the new elements? My artisan did that because certain things that I thought could be done were not allowed as the building is in a conservation area.
Providing a new devis meant we were both clear on exactly what his personal guarantee covered. His devis was very precise, even including the brands of certain products.
I had to sign and date the new devis and so I imagine that he is covered but I would be interested to hear other views on this.
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[quote user="cooperlola"]So come on then, who's going to become a French citizen and get into politics over here?[/quote]
Tres drole Cooperlola.
I'm assuming that one would first need to fill 10,000 forms in triplicate, sign with ''lu et approuve'', queue to kiss the Maire and his wife (because it would be a male), the head of the sous-prefecture (another male) plus 1000 other fonctionnaires to even get a look-in.
Whose life is that long?
Associations are a good start and hope that one day, we can vote in all elections on the basis of being residents.
Here's hoping...
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[quote user="Gary aka Bugbear"]
.... I love the fact that no-one is interested in what you wear, or what you drive, or what your house is like. I like not having to lock my car or not having to put bars up at the windows.
Do they have different ways, well yes, but give me their ways anyday over the crime, vandalism, overcrowding and taxation that we left behind in the UK.
[/quote]
Less Taxation etc etc..
Gary aka Bugbear, are you sure you live in France 2006? [:D] Or do we have to be at retirement age to find this glorious land of low taxation, lack of vandalism ...
Just because some posters point out the other realities of the country that affects the vast majority of the population isn't necessarily a bad thing and doesn't mean we don't love aspects of the country.
I think it is a super thread . It can be both light-hearted and serious and it would still be a nice thread.
PS: Where is 86, perhaps we should all head there and not stray far from it.[;-)]
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5-Element, Well said!
I would also add foreigners who want France to remain in some sort of time warp frozen in a countryside idyll/TV holiday Ad (economic suicide for the country) because it suits their current lifestyles, which they can afford here for having earned it in other countries.
I somehow don't hear the zillons of unemployed, those unable to secure rental accommodation or owners unable to get their properties back all due to horrendously daft laws crying out to keep things the way they are.
So, I'd say, whinge away ...
By the way, I whinge considerably less than virtually every French person I know [;-)]
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Everything Chris pp states PLUS southern French men in their 40s...[6] Sorry but had to get that one off my chest!
I hold impartiality highly but not on this specific point.
Forum moderator, please feel free to delete if my wish to Santa is inappropriate...
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It's a large and rather silly 'tranche d'age' to use for such statistics. Between 25-35, I can't imagine many Brits settling in France, however, I have noticed an increase too amongst the say 38-45 age range.
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5-Element
Have replied but still not sure If I know what I'm doing on this pm thing, so it may have gone to the Kremlin [;-)]
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Hi Llwyncelyn
I've also pm'd you re three villages/town in Western Herault. First time I've pm'd on here so not sure if it has gone through. If you don't get it, let me know and I'll send it again.
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You're no doubt right.
I think they should update the number of French in Britain though because the 2001 figures have no bearing on the realites of 2006. The huge influx of French into the UK occurred after 2001 due to the onset of the French employment woes.
I suppose it's easier for them to check the Brits living permanantly abroad as IR must be a great source of info.
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Agree, extremely interesting.
The figures for France are more or less what I had always understood to be the case. However, I have read some ridiculous articles putting the number of Brits in France as high as 1/2 million and always wondered how these writers did their research and where these Brits were hiding. I think writers on this issue often confuse figures for Brits with homes in France with those of permanent residents, hence inflating the figures.
However, I thought the figures in Spain were around 600,000 so I was way out there...
Thanks for the link RH. The next time, the French get too paranoid about Brits taking over their country, I suppose we can always show them this.
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Just another thought, probably strayed too far from the original topic (sorry OP)
Another possible reason why Beziers city centre may seem cooler to me (my opinion only) is the fact that it is actually quite green compared to Montpellier centre, which has very little green space. Beziers centre has a lovely park running from the station to the main Allees, which is also tree-lined up to the theatre, as well as other parks such as the Plantade beside the Orb River. Furthermore, it’s minutes from the river Orb and the Canal du Midi as well as from the open countryside as is clear when you look from the Cathedrale.
Montpellier centre is woefully lacking in green spaces and trees to protect the pedestrian from the summer sun. If Freche wills it, money would be found to plant thousands of trees in his beloved city overnight, even if the region's coffers are empty, so perhaps this should be pointed out to him[;-)]
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5- Element, Great minds think alike. I think our posts virtually crossed. I'll do my best to unearth the article though won't promise miracles as it goes back a couple of years. It may be on my hard disk somewhere.
Apart from the Sports Medical centre at the Caserne St Jacques, my personal experience is limited re the medical service but I have to say that I've heard and read excellent things about it. No doubt, people will also have bad experience too. I also know that there are quite a few retirement homes so it may be a little like the Bournemouth of Languedoc.
Re my comments about the cooler summer; I think the cooler feel is due to the fact that Beziers old town is perched high up and often gets a good breeze from the sea when the wind is in the right direction. I know both Mtp and Beziers very well so can make some comparison but it's all a matter of opinion.
I would also take the comments at the MTP hospital with a little pinch of salt as I know a few researchers in the town. There is great rivalry between the two towns with poor Beziers always drawing the short straw because of Freche's preference for 'his' town and complete disregard for most other towns in the region. Freche and the Mayor of Beziers are always at loggerheads as you will no doubt know if you read the local press.
Agree with you on the grotty exterior which they seem to be working on but knowing quite a few locals now, I can tell you that many of those grotty facades conceal hidden gems and my friends super appt is one of them.
As they say, never judge a book by it's cover.
(For readers not from Languedoc, George Freche is the Regional Leader and the former mayor of Montpellier. He was the one that recently made the comments about the black footballers in the national team. He is a colourful figure who is usually in trouble but seems to get away with everything.)
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[quote user="Teamedup"]
Now that was interesting to say that they have the best care of the old in the Bezier area, as I remember reading that that area had the fittest old folks in France. I wish I could remember where I read it, some Santé magasine I think and it was probably a while ago.
[/quote]
If my friend's neighbour is anything to go by, I'd say the article was right. I first met her when she was 91 and we had to be convinced she was even in her 70s. She is now 93 and still amazing though has become a little frail due to illness over the past year. She gets home help from a nurse a few days a week plus a weekly visit from the doctor. I think she's probably part of the fit and well cared for category.
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The Western Herault (Beziers Region) has a good reputation for hospital and home care of the senior population mainly because it has a higher percentage of retired than the Montpellier region (Eastern Herault), which is generally known around here as a ‘student town’. It has an enormous hospital which is quite new.
Re the quality of care in the Beziers region for the retired, I get this from reliable sources but posters with specific experience, please feel free to put me right. I have in the past read national surveys saying it’s the area (Beziers) that offers about the best care for the senior population in France. Will post the data, if I can find them, as they were all part of my research re location location location, as the availability and easy access to all facilities from Transport, Cultural, Health and a zillion other things were important criteria governing my choice.
Weather wise, I agree with the general comments about Languedoc but note that even among departments, the amount of rain, damp and wind seem to me to vary quite a bit. In my experience, there is less rain and flooding in the Herault compared to the Gard that seems to suffer quite a bit from flooding. I remember the flood zone reports I got from govt websites a few years back showed that a lot of areas in the Gard are regularly affected during heavy rainfalls. But those who live there are obviously the best judge.
Dampness is not something I associate too much with the Beziers Region, but even there, there are flood zones to be avoided if buying and the last major flood, I believe, was in 2003. This area also seems to suffer less from windy conditions than the neighbouring Aude and even Montpellier, 70km away, where it can really blow even in the old town. However, it has the hot summers already mentioned but being close to the sea, the sea breeze can make it more tolerable. Last summer I spent cooler days in Beziers old town than in Montpellier.
Please note that in my location research, damp was also a small factor, hence though I loved the Gard, it was eliminated from my list on the flood and wind basis. The Vaucluse and Var because too dry and windy, the Aude too windy and the Pyrennees Oriental too windy and too far from Montpellier. All regions north of Cevennes, eliminated for lack of sun. No one can accuse me of not doing my research [:)].
Ok, you could call me a fuss pot but I figured that I was buying my home for short and long term comfort (to include services and environment) so had to consider everything in minute detail. Perhaps my pseudo should be HeraultGal.
I should also point out that the Beziers region is poorer than the Montpellier region and so I don’t really know how that affects specialist healthcare. I can confirm that it has an excellent medical sports monitoring service available to residents of the region for free.
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A little Britline/Call centre humour
I promised to bow out of this thread but this is too daft not to share. Hope no one else has had to go through this.
A friend lost her Britline card on Saturday and only realised in the evening. Being away from home, she checked on the net to find the emergency number to stop the card. On the statement page, the following number is given under SOS URGENCES for stolen or lost cards : The number on the site was as follows: 01 45 67 84 84 ( I checked before posting this and still true as of today)
She called only to fall onto a message saying the number had changed and she should call: 0892 69 92 92. (the digits Brits love and can understand easily[:)]). Why they can’t update this section too is difficult to understand. However the correct number is on the CA-Normandie homepage under ‘’Les numeros pratiques’’
So far so good.
Problem (or twilight zone).
The employee who answered, insisted categorically that they did not deal with Britline and only with CA and Mastercard. She speaks fluent French so explained to the employee that Britline was part of CA, he refused to listen and – wait for it- CUT HER OFF. Initially, she thought her mobile was playing up so rang back and unfortunately got the same employee. She explained that the number was on the website and he said that she had the wrong number, then cut her off again. She ended up calling from her friends landline as she was too shocked to believe that an employee of a bank could be so rude (silly girl! Where does she live?). He cut her off 4 times in total. She was furious but as it was Saturday night, had no option but wait until the following day and call again when she returned home. Her evening out with friends was marred as she naturally kept worrying about the card not having been stopped.
The next day, she called again and this time got through to a very pleasant employee who actually knew that Britline was part of CA and who politely apologised for her colleague’s behaviour. She stopped the card but this was now about 20 hours after the loss and around 15 hours from the moment she noticed the loss and it could have been stopped.
Moral of the story
None really, but perhaps a little warning to those who have the ‘When in Rome…’ philosophy on moving to France. In France that only applies to wine, cheese, bread, and, if in the south, lunchtimes 12-14 hrs, it’s the law!
Seriously, perhaps avoid saying Britline if you need to call that number. Simply say CA or Mastercard in case you fall onto another badly trained stroppy employee at a moment of relative stress when you desperately need assistance from knowledgeable staff.
Failing that, just make sure that your card is lost or stolen during Britline’s opening hours….
(can't work out why my friend doesn't see the funny side of this[:D])
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Re: SACRES FRANCAIS
(having problems quoting individual lines)
Agree SB, it’s a great read and, as you say, thankfully no clichéd olive trees and peasants in sight. Ironically, it was a French friend who gave me a copy after discovering it. She loved it too. My copy has done the rounds of French speaking friends but the author cannot be too upset with me as I’ve gone on to buy 2 other books by him and will no doubt get his very latest, about an American who is transferred to run a subsidiary in Picardie, as well.
Pity, his books are not available in English for non-French speakers.
As I said, I’m now reading ‘’Sacres Fonctionnaires’’. Though I’ve known France from a young age, I find the bureaucracy a challenge to say the least. This book tackles the subject well without sending the reader into a coma; not an easy task, I imagine, so bravo to the author. It’s written in the same humorous style as ‘’Sacres Francais’’ and I have to force myself to put it down. Furthermore, it’s also quite educational because I now know that there are other elements of French bureaucracy I have yet to discover.
Yippeeee, can’t wait!
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However, to set the record straight I did not unwittingly highlight problems.
I did not feel the need for the staff to like me, and I did not discuss kids, cats and dogs. David
David, just know that I did fully understand your original post.
However, I think I’ll bow out gracefully from this thread, as speaking the same language is evidently no panacea for communication and mutual understanding. [;-)]
Happy French Banking everybody!
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[quote user="chief"]
Hi.
Just wanted to pick peoples brains on this one. I am always surprised when i get told or read that France is supposed to be a very racist society. I personally, either as a black man or englishman, have never overtly come across it despite my many travels in France, and yet, i am constantly told that moving there is a wrong move for me. I just wondered what as expats, peoples thoughts on it were, either from a an british, or black persons (if you are black) point of view. I am sure it is there, and wouldn't be naive enough to believe it wasn't, but to be honest, you would expect to pick up undertones if nothing else if it was a prevalent feature of French society, and i just don't seem to be getting that.
cheers
Chief
[/quote]
Chief, this might be of interest to you.
Earlier today, I spoke to a black friend living not too far from me about your post. She made a few notes to enable me to write a post to you. I told her to do it herself but she is not into forums.
She says that it’s not uncommon to feel a special ‘friendliness’ towards ‘’anglo-blacks’ (American or Brit) in France from black and white French alike. It appears that she has noticed it as you may have on your travels and finds it quite disconcerting and surreal.
In her view, France is roughly where Britain was around the late 70s/early 80s in terms of race relations but it’s slightly more complex for Blacks because the strongest racism (hence more clear-cut) is towards the Arabs as they are perceived as a bigger threat. Nonetheless, if you are an anglo-black, she insists you should not be fooled by the seemingly more tolerant attitude.
However, she says the French being generally more parochial than the Brits of today, tend to fear most foreigners irrespective of colour.
She says that if you want to move to France and this issue is important to you, then you have to do a proper research of your chosen area and it’s racial slant. If you move to an isolated location where you stand out like a sore thumb, your experience may be very interesting but not necessarily for the right reasons. Ironically, all her white French friends, who live in the UK and in and around Paris, advised her against moving to the south but she has adapted and is not duped by any superficial friendliness … She says you may consider contacting black organisations in Paris for their views if you haven’t already done so. She doesn’t know of any but there has to be quite a few.
She read the other postings of this thread today and found them all very interesting. So, just another point of view.
As an aside, days after buying her place a number of years ago, she ran into one of the numerous Estate Agents she had consulted. He asked her if she had found what she wanted and she replied yes and told him where in the town. The Agent made a grimace, adding that the area she had chosen was ‘a little Arab’. Being a no nonsense person, she replied, quick as a flash, that she was not looking to live in a ''white ghetto'’. The agent almost fainted. For about 10 seconds, she probably made him aware of what it felt like to be the target of racism.
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[quote user="Kristine"]I have lived an equal lengh of time in both france and Spain, believe me if you find French systems ,banks,health system etc archaic ,don't ever consider moving to Andalucia .Compared to the way things operate there french systems are wonderful .At least if you go with the flow and follow the laid down proceedures everything works and you achive your goal. In Andalucia no system works because the people will not work to a system.Stay where you are and be thankful you're not here ![/quote]
Kristine, I spent just under a year in Andalucia a few years back and I wholeheartedly agree with you when talking about institutions in general but I found the Spanish Banking System no worse than the French.
However, I feel David has unwittingly highlighted some of the problems with French banks and other institutions. He is praising (rightfully if he has had a good experience) an individual branch of a banking network. As a client, I do not feel the need for the staff of any bank/branch or institution to like me. They are employed to offer a service and I do not need to transfer my financial portfolio (if I had one) to them or anything else. Simple professionalism is all I ask from any institution anywhere and it should not be too much to ask from France.
David then mentions his personal experience in the UK, so I will do likewise.
Out of 3 banks (not branches) with which I had accounts in the UK, 2 provided me with excellent professional service for over 20 years. I could move around the UK and abroad and call 24/7 if I ever needed help or stranded anywhere in the world without having to go in, smile at them whilst asking about their kids, cats and dogs. (Not interested!)
I suppose what we seek depends on our lifestyles and a bank with the ‘village’ mentality may suit some but not others. Not every French person lives in a village anymore as far as I’m aware.
It's a little pointless always making comparisions with other countries though. I live here now and if I find institutions here ineffective, I will demand professionalism, as I would expect them to do if they were seeking a service from me. It’s not personal.
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I take your point about the mindset but at times, this just drags things out forever. If you have the time, that's great but not everyone has that luxury. Have the mindset when dealing with small family firms or local boulangeries etc but Institutions such as Banks, I feel people should be more demanding and I also include the French in that.
For me, it's not a question of France versus UK. If I lived in any western country (incl UK) and were obliged to face this level of archaic systems, I would react in the same way.
However, I will consider your advice on driving on the left but if you hear of an almighty pile up in the Garde, Herault or Aude, consider yourself responsible [:)]
2007 - A New Start - A New Regime
in French Food and Wine
Posted
My first thought (and hope) was that this has to be a doctored image, but then I remembered seeing women almost as hideous as this photo on the beaches of the Cote d'Azur in the early 80s.
If not a hoax pix, I'm with Chris in the sick dept ...