Josephine79

Ok, ok maybe it wasn't a smart idea, I have now withdrawn the remark.

Wen, your experience is not ours. In the Deux Sèvres (and Vendee, where I think Alison said she might be moving is only just across the border) there are many English speaking children in the colleges and lycées, including Dan. In the lycée in my own town there is a regular influx of them. Some have been here a while and speak the language to a greater or lesser extent, but there are also  pupils with ZERO French. Not necessarily because their parents moved here, there are also Rotary exchanges etc. They come from Sweden, Australia Japan and the US as well as the UK. Obviously how well they do depends on their motivation, but it is perfectly possible to come here, go to lycée and learn the language in the space of a year. Some youngsters may prefer to re-do the year for the content once they have mastered the language, but not all have to. Dan: thank you for sharing your experience with us, maybe I'll see you around! Jo

Eek, Petomane: I hope you mean you have had one point taken OFF your stock of 12. 'Cos if you only have one point on your licence you need to go VERY carefully. In France things are "back to front": everyone starts with twelve points which are then taken away if you've been a bad lad /lass. No wonder you have to exchange it in order for them to apply the penalty: otherwise the two systems would cancel each other out!

Some nice ideas there J.R. . Unfortunately they are already complaining that they will sue because the electricity is unsafe (it isn't) and threatening to call the police if anyone goes round to try and fix it or anything else ..........

Ariege: what do you mean "temporary accomodation"? They have signed a three year lease. But 12 months in to it they still have their previous address on their cheques. They have doubtless updated their details with the bank and will be receiving bank statements in their present home, but if they have an old cheque book they are entitled to carry on using it. And bearing in mind how few cheques anyone writes these days a chequebook can last for eons. My point is that an address on a cheque is no form of guarantee that the signatory of the cheque (and your supposedly short term let) actually lives at the place indicated. Although the gite owner in the case which was the subject of my original post refused to extend the contract for the gite beyond the original fortnight the family just stayed there without paying rent and despite the eviction order obtained against them. The bailiff could do nothing. A further word of warning. In this case the tenants offered rent for the next month after the end of their "fortnight". The gite owner turned it down because if she had accepted it it would have given them a de facto contract. So they were "occupants sans titre" with a court judgement against them, but when it came down to it they were in the gite and nothing further could be done.

Yes, BUT........ they're in the wrong, you have an eviction order signed by the judge, but that doesn't mean they'll go. They have nothing to lose. Unfortunately if you evict them by force you have plenty to lose.

Sorry but if you do any of this you will fall foul of the law which could well end up costing you more. Bear in mind that the people we are talking about have no assets and nothing to lose. If you give them cause to sue you they will!

Dear Ariege, we have tenants who have been with us for twelve months and the address on their cheques is still that of the place they came to before us, so this should NEVER be taken as being a proof of address. Most commonly in France proof of residence is a utilities bill less than 3 months old. You need to check and check again against things they can't fake; the name matching a number in the phone book, (for example, for English or French tenants) -  if in doubt ring the number. If they say they only have mobiles ring the mairie of the place they come from - or their next door neighbours (can be found in pages blanches by putting street name without number  and leaving "name" blank). The whole point is that these people will not tell the truth. In the case I personally experienced they came for "a fortnight" in September and were still there without paying rent come March. The whole point of the "scare story" is to make property owners more wary: I've had another e-mail tonight telling me a similar story - the people in question have debts and the bailiffs are fed up of chasing them. I think it's natural to take people at face value, unfortunately you cannot afford to do this when it comes to letting property. Jo

"I know I nod off occasionally but aren't EDF and GDF one and the same?" Haven't you noticed that since about April everything has come in separate envelopes, with snazzy new logos (that I bet we, the customer, have paid for). Now EDF are offering to supply gas and GDF are offering to supply electricity. At present it is only for "businesses", but I guess Gites count. In the New Year everyone will be able to switch their domestic supply to whomsoever they choose.

[quote user="Josephine79"] "In this case the law is very definitely an ass." [/quote] Well, just look at that. Are we being moderated by Americans? You all know what the end of the expression is, but I actually wrote it in full. So why has it come out as "***". http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ass "Ass, from Old English assa, ultimately from Latin asinus, is the older word for donkey".

Sorry, the past true story has some how become telescoped with the present situation. The Gite story is all true, but over and done with - they eventually moved on when the bailiff applied (possibly illegal) pressure - but not until March, anyway so they were there for 6 months without paying rent. The present situation is a long term let that as gone horribly wrong so there is a signed contract, but the bailiff says that it can take three years to get them out if they won't go. Neither of these families were my tenants, but  I am trying to help the victims and prevent anyone else from being conned because I find such behaviour inexcusabale. Unfortunately it is on the increase as the family who are at present causing problms is not the same one that did a runner from Fumanzoku's property, although they are in the same area. Jo

All the paperwork was shown to the bailiff, but as it's all e-mail and verbal, there's nothing to go on legally speaking - unfortunately!

"but what if you had a contract with someone to live there throughout Winter" Jasper Hi Jasper, one would think so, but as the squatters are in residence and the people with the contract are not, then it's not you kicking them into the street. Presumably the logic would be for them to sit tight wherever they were before and create a "chain" - but if they are upright citizens with incomes and assets then this will not appeal. I suppose they could actually sue you for breach of contract! In this case the law is very definitely an ass. "is there not any urgent work that needs attending to at the property"? Could be arranged, but they've thought of that and are demanding to be paid to leave! And of course we couldn't in all conscience foist them off on to anyone else...... In this case it's very much "caveat lessor "! Jo

"Susan wrote the following post at 18/11/2006 13:06: Pun, I thought Josephine was making the point that the two types of rentals are connected?" Dear Susan, you did indeed read me aright! Jo

We thought of this, but you put yourself in the wrong if you do any of it and believe me, these squatters know their rights and will sue you at the drop of a hat!

Dear Jon, and who appoints the Préfet? Our elected representatives! The Préfet is the government's man and will not risk doing anything unpopular.

I notice that the thread about the family who bunked off leaving debts has been locked. I read it all carefully and would like to add my two penn'th. This problem DOES affect gite owners - it happened to someone I know very well. This is how it happens. The Family book for a holiday, lets say two weeks in September. Or they say they are waiting for building work to be completed on their new property. They are due to leave on or before 1st October. Who asks for proof, references and guarantees for two weeks? No one. They arrive, pay and take possession, but then fail to leave. They make some excuse, (the builders haven't finished yet: it's easy to believe)  but they are still there on 15th October. Folks you have MEGA problems. Gite or not, no one can be evicted from anywhere between 15th October and 15th March. You can get all the huissiers, avocats and tribunaux you like to agree that they are there illegally - the judge will even stamp the eviction order, but you CANNOT evict them by force (not you, not the huissier, no one) - if you do you will be in the brown sticky stuff up to your neck as they will sue you for entering their "domicile" illegally, never mind that they are occupying the premises illegally - a Frenchman's domicile is his castle! Of course in theory the huissier can get the boys in blue to put the frighteners on them, but they will only act if the "Prefet" authorizes it. And the Prefet NEVER does because it's a vote loser to evict  poor, downtrodden tenants. So there they are, in your gite, using your water, your electricity, your gas - not only are they not paying you rent  and preventing you from letting to bona fide tenants, but you are paying their bills. And of course you have paid the bailiff and  the barrister. Don't bother trying to get social services involved - they are on the side of the tenants. If it happens to you there is nothing you can do but wait for them to move off of their own accord and hope they don't wreck the place. Sorry to paint such a dramatic picture but this is a true story - it happened in the Deux-Sèvres and is doubtless being repeated all over France. YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED. Jo

The cinema Le Foyer in Parthenay is showing The Phantom of the Opera in English on Sunday (20th March) at 2 pm and again on Monday afternoon (21st March) at 1.30. Apparently the French don't like this film - well there's no acounting for taste, but I saw it last night and will probably go again, I enjoyed it so much - especially as it's the "Printemps du Cinema" so there is a reduced ticket price of 3.50 Euros for everyone on Sunday, Monday & Tuesday. In fact this applies in the whole of France, so even if you're nowhere near the Deux-Sèvres you can see a film for 3.50 Euros. Jo

OK folks, I'll let you in on a secret. A lot of French people don't actually eat food. What they do consume in large quantities to prevent themselves from keeling over is rehydrated powdered gloup in a wide variety of flavours. This powdered muck is sold by pyramid sales and bears a name which phonically combines the first name of Mr Woodhead, the former Chief Inspector for schools, and the family name of an actor called Jude (don't want to get sued, here). It is sold as an 'aid to well being" and the people who use it swear by it - although their bank managers are not so keen...... Personally I'll stick to everything in moderation (cream cakes, chocolates... anyone know where you can buy Creme Eggs here?) Oh, and another interesting thing I was told by a Frenchwoman this week: on Sundays it is not Lent. Yes, really - even the priests are allowed to pig out on wine and cake on the Sundays between Ash Wednesday and Easter. When I was a kid and you gave something up for Lent that meant all day every day - it seems rather a cop out to have a "day off" once a week. Hope you found this illuminating, Jo