Cendrillon Posted November 5, 2011 Share Posted November 5, 2011 If you missed this excellent programme last Tuesday (BBC2) presented by Paddy Ashdown, it is being repeated this evening at 20.30 BBC2. A very interesting account of the raid (and an unnecessary organisational cock-up) . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Zoff Posted November 6, 2011 Share Posted November 6, 2011 It used to be a mystery to me how one supposedly bankrupt country (Germany after WW1) could, with limited support, take on the rest of the world and nearly get away with it. For all their hideous faults, Hitler and his generals were effective leaders and organisers - whereas the likes of Britain had Whitehall.... Enough said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pachapapa Posted November 6, 2011 Share Posted November 6, 2011 [quote user="Alan Zoff"] It used to be a mystery to me how one supposedly bankrupt country (Germany after WW1) could, with limited support, take on the rest of the world and nearly get away with it. For all their hideous faults, Hitler and his generals were effective leaders and organisers - whereas the likes of Britain had Whitehall.... Enough said.[/quote]Very interesting! You have ways of making me talk!In the 20th germany just effectively used the weapons of the day...and...it was a damn close run thing.In the 20th under the aegis of the 1st jewish french president, Leon Blum a lefty by the way.In the 21st germany will just effectively use the weapons of the day...and how close is it getting now.Pause take 5 and read link:http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/11/05/us-eurozone-bundesbank-idUSTRE7A428Y20111105So gold is actually something like money...well what a surprise.Oh and not to forget the pseudo third republic welcoming gestures from the 2nd jewish french president, Sarko a righty by the way.P.S. May I just paraphrase Sarko...Fiscal convergence with germany and strict following of the german economic paradigm is the future for france. So no melodious rhythm of marching jack boots this time round. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renaud Posted November 6, 2011 Share Posted November 6, 2011 I agree with Cendrillon that it was an astonishing raid (the boats must have passed close to the beach recently posted on her facebook page). The one point that Ashdown missed was in the aftermath of Hasler's action the Germans had to tie down massive numbers of troops to guard all ports.The programme told little about Hasler himself, a pity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LAiffricaine Posted November 6, 2011 Share Posted November 6, 2011 [quote user="Alan Zoff"] ... Hitler and his generals were effective leaders and organisers - whereas the likes of Britain had Whitehall.... [/quote]Leader, opportunist, demagogue certainly but organiser ... debatable ... It was revealed long after the war that Hitler was actually often playing his generals against each other, all egostistically eager to please him and playing Brutus on one an other ... whilst Britain had our Winnie and bumbling fools in the Home Guard of Dad's Army ... I am glad of people doing great deeds under the cover of being bumbling fools ... Always method in madness ... Having said that the Cockleshell affair was truly a deplorable waste of humans and ideas and perhaps a wake up call to Whitehall ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LAiffricaine Posted November 6, 2011 Share Posted November 6, 2011 [quote user="Renaud"] ... The programme told little about Hasler himself, a pity.[/quote] Nature of the man, nature of the times, nature of the operation at hand ... to melt away and be forgotten in the great woosh of time ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DerekJ Posted November 6, 2011 Share Posted November 6, 2011 The Cockleshell Heroes were one of the inspirations that got me into canoeing and later on I ended up competing in the Hasler Trophy which is a British Canoe Union competition for marathon racing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cendrillon Posted November 6, 2011 Author Share Posted November 6, 2011 [quote user="Renaud"]I agree with Cendrillon that it was an astonishing raid (the boats must have passed close to the beach recently posted on her facebook page). The one point that Ashdown missed was in the aftermath of Hasler's action the Germans had to tie down massive numbers of troops to guard all ports.The programme told little about Hasler himself, a pity.[/quote]I am sure they did Renaud but there was also mention of the men taking refuge on the Medoc side of the Gironde as well, where they were befriended by the French. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Zoff Posted November 6, 2011 Share Posted November 6, 2011 There's a quite good summary of the raid on Wiki: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Frankton Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kewdos Posted November 6, 2011 Share Posted November 6, 2011 HiWhilst the programme was 'interesting' there are number of serious minor AND major errors.The SOE matter is the hook which gives the edge to he programme and without which is a normal prog... the 'evidence' provided for this matter is false.. there is no evidence to support the SOE matter, rather this is just based on heresay from a post war source who himself provides no evidence in support. Want to know the whole truth? READ THIS ...Cockleshell Heroes - The Final Witness ISBN 9781848688612 from Amberley publishing.From a noted individual who has close connections with the event.who...... 'admired' a 'fabulous book'... 'It is probably about as near the actual truth that we will ever get'. ...' meticulous research and the passion' recalling the tale'.... 'exacting standards of research'... 'extraordinary ability to describe the happenings in such an attractive manner'. .... 'a more thoroughly cerebral level...'a' timeless treasure...... 'the chapter on The Four Noble Truths was especially brilliant and very moving.' More than one story inside... Everything about his raid including all about most of the FRENCH people involved as well as the submarine people and much much more ( inc SOE matter explained) and highly detailed at that suggest this recent publication with 7 forewords the first from the UK;s 1st Sea Lord Sir Admiral Stanhope as well as the Royal Marines Archivist Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
just john Posted November 6, 2011 Share Posted November 6, 2011 I watched this too, hooked on the latest rash of documentaries on these exploits of daring do, whatever the devil in the detail, worthy of the airing and I for one felt humbled, a far cry from the current mercenary dropped off by helicopter exploits[:$] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Posted November 6, 2011 Share Posted November 6, 2011 Turned on the tv this afternoon and caught the last 10 mins of said film with T Howard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cendrillon Posted November 6, 2011 Author Share Posted November 6, 2011 I did the same and saw probably 45 minutes of the 1955 film. I must say that having seen Paddy Ashdown's programme the film seemed over glamourised. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Zoff Posted November 7, 2011 Share Posted November 7, 2011 The film is dreadful in almost every respect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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