Jonzjob Posted October 19, 2006 Share Posted October 19, 2006 Hi folks, for once I'm being serious. It's time for the pine processionaries to rear their lovely little heads again. http://web.cortland.edu/fitzgerald/PineProcessionary.html it's just one of dozens of sites about them.Basically they are dangerous to domestic animals, humans and they do a tremendous amount of damage to pine trees...They are dangerous to dogs because a dog will try to pick them up for some reason. This causes the animal's mouth to be 'stung' by the hairs on them. This can, if not treated by a vet, lead to the dogs mouth and tounge swelling and going gangerous leading to a very painful death. I'm not too sure about cats? Humans can be 'stung' in the same way on the skin if they touch them, giving a very painful rash and if the eyes are effected it can lead to at least tenmporary blindness. Not all people react to the hairs, but most do!If you need more info then just 'google' "pine processionary caterpillars". There is enough to keep you in reading for a long time. Why the rench government don't have a blitz on them is a mystery, but I suppose it's all down to money in the end...Another site from Spain. Please forgive me for pinching it Louweezel http://www.valenciatrader.com/index.php?sectionid=87&contentid=7567&parentid=102 Take care, it's a jungle out there (where have I heard that before?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TWINKLE Posted October 19, 2006 Share Posted October 19, 2006 Oh look! They're in love[:)] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meg Posted October 19, 2006 Share Posted October 19, 2006 Quote Jonzjob 'They will give you a very bad time too if you handle them... But that's a different story and a long one..'Do we get to hear it John???Louise Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoddy Posted October 31, 2006 Share Posted October 31, 2006 It seems that Oak Processionary Caterpillers have arrived in England.http://www.rbgkew.org.uk/scihort/news/oak_moth.htmlThose living in the south might see them I suppose. I wonder how much the globe has to warm before they arrive in Leicestershire. Hoddy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonzjob Posted October 31, 2006 Author Share Posted October 31, 2006 Hi H, i souldn't worry too much. Nothing arrives in Leicestershire does it :-))I don't know about the oak, but I would think they are similar and to be avoided! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoddy Posted October 31, 2006 Share Posted October 31, 2006 "Nothing arrives in Leicestershire does it :-)) "I don't think that's quite fair, Jonzjob - they're re-thatching a cottage just down the street.Hoddy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonzjob Posted October 31, 2006 Author Share Posted October 31, 2006 ???confused??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Le Petomane Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 It's actually the time when the parent moth will lay the eggs in their cocoon. The grubs will fatten during the winter and process in the spring. Here in our area (Herault) they use helicopters to spray pine trees. Every October one comes terrifyingly low over my house to spray. But I was still killing the things last spring, so the spray must miss some of the moths. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonzjob Posted November 2, 2006 Author Share Posted November 2, 2006 Hi Le P, I have just taken a cocoon out of one of our trees and burnt it. There were several small caperpillars out of the cocoon, but not for long, they are dead now. They were at the 3rd stage of their development. They have 5 stages before the turn into the moth. The first 2 stages are not dangerous because they don't have the hairs, but even though they are small in the 3rd stage the hairs are still very dangerous.The full life cycle, truncated a bit, is that the moths are bad fliers and don't get much more than 6 foot or so off the ground. They lay their eggs on a pine needle, sometime late September/early October, and actually sheath the needle with the eggs. They cover the eggs with a scale like substance from the underside of their abdomen. The eggs hatch and the small caterpillars make a very scanty cocoon near by. They can eat the pine needles straight away. As they develope they get higher in the tree and build more permanent cocoons until they are fully grown and in large cocoons in the very top of the tree. Around March time they make trips out of the tree and start to look for soft ground into which to bury themselves to pupate.All through this time they stay in the cocoon through the day most of the time and forage out at night to eat. They go out, nose to tail, in long lines of upto 300, hence the name, and lay a silk and pheramone (spelling?) trail so they can find their way back. If the line breaks for any reason the new front runner just carries on and leads. They don't try to find the others. They will cross from tree to tree to look for food and it's while they are on the ground that they are most dangerous.If you do find any in your garden and want to get rid of them, then please remember to wear gloves to handle the pine that you cut and the best way to get rid of them is to burn them. Not my favorite insect!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dog Posted November 4, 2006 Share Posted November 4, 2006 On behalf of caterpillars everywhere I would like to make it clear that humans are far more dangerous than even processionary caterpillars. Caterpillars will not bother you if you don't bother them.Every creature has a place in the world and killing insects that are not your favourite could have unforseen circumstances.Leave insects alone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonzjob Posted November 4, 2006 Author Share Posted November 4, 2006 I agree totally, if they leave us alone and do not put my dog in peril. But these things were on our terrace, just outside the kitchen door last year. If our dog had gone out before I had seen them there would have been a good chance that she would, at least investigated them and been badly effected. They kill dogs!!! And from your avitar and name you like dogs! Of course they don't mean to hurt anything else and what they do is a defense mechanism. But the bottom line is that they are a menace to us in the wrong place. I also like my pine trees and have no intention to let anything that WILL destroy them do so if I can stop it.If you have certain, not uncommon, heart defects then contact with these can kill you too.From what I have learned they have very few natural preditors. One of them is the hoopoe and they will eat anything in the insect world they can find. They abound on the gaurigue. As such making sure that they will not be in my garden is a priority for me.I also agree that if you look in a mirror you are looking at by for the most dangerous animal on this earth, but I dont kill anything unless I think that it's absolutly necessary.Ticks! If you find them on your dog what do you do? Do you kill them or leave them to kill your dog??? They too are insects. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dog Posted November 10, 2006 Share Posted November 10, 2006 Removing an insect that has already attacked rather than killing them before they have done anything is very different.Why not transport the caterpillars well out of harms way. They are eaten by wood ants and cuckoos enjoy them as a tasty snack.You cannot have an ecosystem without it all being there.I won't bother you by informing you of the other moths and caterpillars that can do similar potential damage to thier predators.Ticks do not kill dogs directly they pass on diseases such as Lymes Disease which is easily treated.Last year Harry got Lymes Disease in the morning he couldn't get up or walk - after a trip to the vets and treatment within 5 hours he was out rolling in the snow and he was a 16 year old dog. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonzjob Posted November 14, 2006 Author Share Posted November 14, 2006 They would not thank you in Cyprus for taking them out into the country side. The only place they can live is on the pines they destroy, so your idea of putting them 'out of harms way' is a slow starve to death sentence. We don't get an awful lot of cucoos here and come to think of it not many wood ants either. Also you won't have to bother informing me of other creatures that cause damage. I have lived IN the country long enough to know just a tiny bit of what lives there thank you.http://www.forestryimages.org/images/768x512/1241019.jpg . This shows you the type of damage they do and they do the same in France over thousands of achres of forest.http://www.exosect.com/solutions/pests/pine_processionary_moth.asp is a site a bit closer to home... It gives a way, expensive, to destroy them.Yes they are part of the ecosystem, but so are tetsi flies and mosquitos that carry maleria. These catapillars don't have the bright markings usually associated with danger either....I will continue to drestroy any that I find in our garden and I have done just that this morning with the latest cocoon I found.Ticks don't attack as such, they are just looking for a meal. It's unfortunate that they do it the way they do. I am very pleased that your dog is OK. It's a devistating thing to loose a pet... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patf Posted November 16, 2006 Share Posted November 16, 2006 I've cut down a cocoon today and burnt the contents - lots of wriggling caterpillars. But I was told off by a young man helping us here who said they were an endangered species. I don't think so. However there are several other nests in the same tree too high to reach so unfortunately there's still a risk for our animals. I wonder if hens would go for them? We have only recently moved into this house and the fir tree is slowly dying, possibly as a result of theses ?parasites? Pat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonzjob Posted November 16, 2006 Author Share Posted November 16, 2006 If they are an endangered species then the Spaniards are helping to make it that way. They have been inoculating all of the pine trees in some of their towns to make sure they aren't there. It seems to be a bit expensive, but it works.I may be wrong, but I don't think they are in any danger. There are hundreds of cocoons starting to appear all around Carcassonne, some in trees within site of the 'Grande Bateux' the Consiell General for Aude (the building looks like a huge ships bridge, pigin awful looking place). The trees have taken a real bashing over the past few years and although they tend to recover you can still see the damage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lori Posted November 17, 2006 Share Posted November 17, 2006 Same here around Mt. Ventoux. Last year, I saw so many trees in a two to four km area with the cocoons. The Forestry Service removed them. They really take their toll and spread like wildfire.I am always keeping my eye out for our 37 year old HUGE pin parasol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lori Posted November 27, 2006 Share Posted November 27, 2006 Went out for a walk today and counted 18 trees in a four kilometer area that have cocoons in them. They are way too close for comfort to my big pine tree. I am thinking of going by the Mairie to ask what, if any, procedure is followed to rid the trees of the worms. Anyone know? Oh and what are they called in French?Is it up to the owner of the property to get rid of the worms? Considering how they spread, I would think the commune would take an interest.The trees I saw last year were clearly on Forestry Land, so I guess that is why I saw Forestry personnel cutting them. The trees I saw on my walk are right at the foothill of the Ventoux Forest Land, so I would think the same people would take interest.I'm keeping a very close eye on my pine tree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonzjob Posted November 27, 2006 Author Share Posted November 27, 2006 They are called chenille processionaire (not sure of the spelling of pro etc.?) They aren't worms though, just caperpillars and not nice ones either!!!We will be going into our local forestry place soon to see what is the best way to treat them or is what we are doing the best thing. For us, that is, not them!!!They are starting to get high in the trees now. I saw one in one of our trees and my long lopper wouldn't reach even though it extends to 4.5 meters. So I got another extending pole, fixed the loppers to it and got it easily. It must heve been 7 meters or so high. By the end of the winter they will be at the very tops of the trees and very difficult to get at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TWINKLE Posted November 28, 2006 Share Posted November 28, 2006 [quote user="Jonzjob"]and my long lopper wouldn't reach even though it extends to 4.5 meters. [/quote]I am sorry Jon - but it's late and after the weekend I've had there is absolutely no way on this earth that I am letting a remark like that go by without posting a smutty ridiculous comment[:)]I am however lost for words[:-))] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lori Posted November 28, 2006 Share Posted November 28, 2006 Twinkle - you are too funny !Well, I stopped by the local Dept. du Forestier this morning at 8:15 am. A car was in the parking lot, but no one answered the door. I came home and sent off an email to the Dept. of the Vaucluse and the Dept. of Forestier. The latter promises a reply in 48 hours. We'll see. I really want to know who is responsible for treating these trees (removing the cocoons, etc.). If it is the proprietor, I give little hope of not seeing an entire invasion. Bedoin is filled with pine trees, as is the forestry land of the Mt. Ventoux. If the commune doesn't intervene, you may soon see Bedoin as a white cocoon (straight out of sci-fi). When I took daughter to the bus this morning, I counted another 15 trees - in the opposite direction of my walk yesterday. So, the problem is all over this area.I'll let you know if anyone gets back to me. So far, my huge pin parasol is not cocooned. It is a huge tree, quite a bit larger than the house (a two level home). If the cocoons formed at the top of the tree, I don't know how anyone would get them out, except to climb and cut (sounds dangerous).Jon - we don't have one of those loppers you mentioned (no Twinks, I'm not going there - although I did consider it). I have seen them, but none of them would extend to the heights of this tree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonzjob Posted November 28, 2006 Author Share Posted November 28, 2006 Twinks, I am disapointed and I have noted the date too. It has to be recorded that you were LOST FOR WORDS!! Lori, the make of ours is Friscars. I believe it's Wilkinson Sword in the U.K. Black and orange colour. Not cheep, but worth every penny!!!I think that you will find that they don't normally go in parasol pines (I may well be wrong). They are very fussy about what they destroy... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lori Posted November 28, 2006 Share Posted November 28, 2006 Well, I got an email back from the Department of the Vaucluse. They referred me to the Maire of Bedoin. He was on my list anyway or at least a stop at the Mairie is. I will wait to see if the Forestier dept. replies as promised. Plan to stop by the Mairie this afternoon as long as time permits.I wish you could be right Jon about not attacking Parasol Pines. My immediate neighbors have two nice ones too ( not nearly as big as mine ) and their's are not infested yet either.I find it hard to believe I am the only one who has noticed this problem. Since it seems to be all over this village (and within clear view of most major roads here), surely others have taken note and are concerned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonzjob Posted November 28, 2006 Author Share Posted November 28, 2006 We, like you, have been amaized that nowt seems to be done. I suppose that it will be like the tragidy of the government minister's grandson that drowned in a swimming pool, nothing will be done generally until someone in power gets hurt!!! Then all the wrath of hell will be let loose and people will be fined for not getting rid of them. Well something like that anyway?We had 3 parasol pines by our pool and although the other type all round the garden had cocoons in them they didn't. They are gone now because they cast too much shade on the house and solar panels through the winter and dumped boat loads of rubbish into the pool all year round. Shame, but necessary...Good luck with yours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonzjob Posted November 30, 2006 Author Share Posted November 30, 2006 Well we were driving past the Conseil General of Aude today and I stopped and took a couple of photos of the damage to some of the trees within site of the offices. The building in the backgroung is the government offices, 'Le Grande Bateux' about 100 yards away. The quality of the photos is not as good as I would have wished, but the sun was not in a good place to get good photos...[IMG]http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f180/Jonzjob/Caterpillartrees1.jpg[/IMG][IMG]http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f180/Jonzjob/Caterpillartrees2.jpg[/IMG]These trees recovered last year, but I would put money that they should be a lot bigger and if not checked will not last very long! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meg Posted November 30, 2006 Share Posted November 30, 2006 John, i am sure this is the only topic youv'e been posting on the last week or so!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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