Clair, are you paying attention? Useful expressions!

[YCCMB]

The worst thing is that it seems so obscure that explanations (thank goodness I'm just translating and not having to define the word) appear to have been written in English via the gift that is Google translate..e.g.:

"The etiopathy was rested by Christian Trédaniel in 1968. The word “etiopathy” comes from the Greek “aitia” (causes) and from “pathos” (suffering).

This discipline consists in finding the causes of the suffering and to address them rather than the effects they cause. It has a systemic approach, i.e. which it studies and takes into account the various interactions between the organs and apparatuses of the body. The base of the etiopathy is rigorous and scientist, the total approach is rational.

The therapeutist initially carries out a clinical analysis by using methods used in any scientific research.

Then, the processing is done through gestures inherited from the ancestral healer and enriched over time, and by joint manipulation, vertebral and visceral.

Which is the difference with osteopathy? For some, there is no difference, if it is not name. For others, the etiopathy does not seek to relieve the symptoms of an evil, but rather to restore driving balance with health. Osteopathy would need more "energy" techniques."

Oh, right you are.

[ericd]

[quote user="mint"]

My first expression is:  j'en ai pour (time).  So, I said to the notaire yesterday afternoon, "J'en ai pour dix minutes" and he reassured me that that was no problem.

I understand this phrase to mean, it will only take 10 minutes or I only need 10 minutes of your time.

..... have I got its sense correct? [/quote]

mint you are correct. You use this phrase for both situations. Only a change of facial expression depending on the sense.

[Pickles]

[quote user="You can call me Betty"]The worst thing is that it seems so obscure that explanations (thank goodness I'm just translating and not having to define the word) appear to have been written in English via the gift that is Google translate..e.g.:

"The etiopathy was rested by Christian Trédaniel in 1968. The word “etiopathy” comes from the Greek “aitia” (causes) and from “pathos” (suffering).

This discipline consists in finding the causes of the suffering and to address them rather than the effects they cause. It has a systemic approach, i.e. which it studies and takes into account the various interactions between the organs and apparatuses of the body. The base of the etiopathy is rigorous and scientist, the total approach is rational.

The therapeutist initially carries out a clinical analysis by using methods used in any scientific research.

Then, the processing is done through gestures inherited from the ancestral healer and enriched over time, and by joint manipulation, vertebral and visceral.

Which is the difference with osteopathy? For some, there is no difference, if it is not name. For others, the etiopathy does not seek to relieve the symptoms of an evil, but rather to restore driving balance with health. Osteopathy would need more "energy" techniques."

Oh, right you are.[/quote]

Oh, you've had the same conversation then. Didn't know that you knew him ...

Our chap teaches etiopathy in Paris ...

[mint]

Learnt a new word today and a very good day in which to learn it too:  les poilus[:)]

[NormanH]

Not quite the same thing as les poids lourds [:D]

[mint]

No, that phrase, alas, belongs squarely (or I should say roundly) to the lardy people I used to encounter daily in south Wales[:(]

[idun]

Nice word play NH[:D]

mint, I must say that I find poids lourds far more attractive than very lardy people, no matter where they are from.

Here's some argot, may liven up your classes[Www]

http://nivelintermedio2.wikispaces.com/file/view/QUELQUES+EXPRESSIONS+D%27ARGOT.pdf

[mint]

Id, I can't get your link to work; keep getting the b u m message that says the page is unavailable.

I do know some expressions argotiques, having been well taught in the past by Frenchie, 5-element and Clair.  Also, many from the polars that I have a fondness for reading[:-))]

Sometimes, I wonder if real-life policemen talk like the ones in the books?[:D]

[Cendrillon]

I had to cut and paste Idun's link then it worked.

This week I bought a great little book in a charity shop "Dictionary of French Slang and Colloquial Expressions, which is both very explicit[:$] and educational![:)]

[NormanH]

At the moment I confess I am struggling with a series called Braquo which is very violent and black, but the amount of contractions etc and very idiomatic expressions is challenging my ears...

[mint]

[quote user="NormanH"]At the moment I confess I am struggling with a series called Braquo which is very violent and black, but the amount of contractions etc and very idiomatic expressions is challenging my ears...

[/quote]

Sounds like a series where I'd be better off turning the sound off![I]

Watching things where everybody talks very fast and in very slangy language is just about my worst nightmare.

I tend to watch documentaires where there is only ONE person doing a voiceover or where they are interviewing people in "an orderly manner"[:D]

I enjoy some films but they need to have a good story line that I can follow and where the dialogue is such that I can fill in the blanks where I can't understand everything that is being said.

Reading, however, is a different matter altogether.  I can take time to go over the tricky bits and generally it's possible to understand the sense of what is being written even if the language is a bit difficult.

But then I LOVE reading and not so much film, even in English.  I think it's to do with preference.

[idun]

http://nivelintermedio2.wikispaces.com/file/view/QUELQUES+EXPRESSIONS+D%27ARGOT.pdf

Hope that this works, it is the best I can do.

[NormanH]

It works for me, and I can confirm that not only is the vocabulary extremely widely used but also that it is not at all suitable for a sweet old lady [:D]

[idun]

[Www] and yet NH, some of it is in current usage by sweet old ladies,  probably because they were sweet young things when they started to so speak.

I was asked to help a friend of a friend with her english as she was going to be working with british tourists. Ever pragmatic, once we'd got her general vocabulary up to scratch, we started on the swearing, because I thought that she should know what was being said to her when things went wrong and people got annoyed and upset.

Imagine the scene, two women sat at a table, one in her mid fifties, the other late thirties, both look very respectable. One diligently writing down all the gros mots that the other was saying and their meaning. 

Was I right to do this, yes, I think I was, as her job was such, that sometimes things beyond her control would go wrong from time to time and I didn't think that she should have to put up with bad language.

I don't usually swear in french or english.

[ericd]

It also very much depends on what words you taught her ....... If it was of the "crackie" or "Oh my word"  type, or similar mild vocabulary, that is perfectly acceptable .....

As a french national, I still have problems judging the meaning of  "tweet" and "it's close cousin where you replace the 2 ee by another vowel", two perfectly innocent words in my mind and they both sound very nice.

[idun]

We discussed it in advance EricD, and she agreed such knowledge would be useful. So I told her every last bad

word I could think of, and if I tried to type them on here, would come up as asterisks. The problem was that she was going to be working

with holiday makers and sometimes things would go wrong. People can

swear when they get upset and angry, and we discussed what could be said

to her and how to deal with it, including several phrases asking them politely not

to swear. And if the swearing was really bad, to call her supervisor.

It wasn't as if she was 'just' going on holiday herself.

ps, I just love the faux pas that we can make in another language. That vowel sound that isn't quite right, or just the word that doesn't quite translate, when one imagines that it can.

[ericd]

[quote user="idun"]    ...... and we discussed what could be said to her and how to deal with it, including several phrases asking them politely not to swear. ....... [/quote]

In french .... Monsieur/Madame. Pourriez-vous "silver plate" faire attention a vos Q et a vos P. Merci "bucket".

[quote user="idun"] ....ps, I just love the faux pas that we can make in another language. That vowel sound that isn't quite right, or just the word that doesn't quite translate, when one imagines that it can.  [/quote]

Typical ....My Mother keeps translating the french (light) insult "Ta Gueule" ....to "Your Face" .... she never ever gets it that insult words don't translate well.

[idun]

Yes, well we did the polite things in english.

[:D]Never thought to mention that some english speakers could imagine that 'silver plate', 'merci bucket' were actually french words, but you are quite right, they do.

My mother in law was always saying 'san fairy ann', not always in context, but not as bad as Delboy either.

[mint]

OK, guys, "sweet old lady" as I am (Norman, who're you , calling a lady[:'(]) I think I know all the swear words I am likely to meet in either language.

So now for a bit of la grammaire (admittedly not my strong point) but here is the question:

afin que = pour que:  is that right?

After both, you use the subjunctive:  is that right?

So then, what about afin DE?  Why would you change the preposition?

Do they mean the same thing?

Which is plus elegant, afin que or afin de?

[ericd]

........ You like to make it complicated hm ? ....

Afin qu'il puisse boire l'eau du robinet, j'ai ete lui chercher un verre ....... Afin de lui donner a boire, j'ai ete lui chercher un verre .... That's all I can come up with ....

[mint]

Well, eric, apart from the verbs puisse and donner (different) tenses, they are to all intents and purposes, identiques?

What's prompted the question is an invitation we received from the mairie.

It invites us for (date) at the foyer afin de partager un petit moment de convivialité.

I use afin que and pour que quite readily but the afin de made me think that I might not have got the preposition right.

[ericd]

......Why is my language so difficult to explain ....???.........

[Jonzjob]

Because it's French [8-)] ?

I haven't even tried to read all of this thread. It would take too long and be too confusing for my tiny brain cell, but the little I have read helps me to realise that I am not alone in being confused. So very much of the time there doesn't seem sto be any logic?

I can listen to a song/piece of music and I remember it and can whistle it almost note perfect. Why oh why do I struggle so much with the French language?

[ventodue]

[quote user="mint"] It invites us for (date) at the foyer afin de partager un petit moment de convivialité.  I use afin que and pour que quite readily, but the afin de made me think that I might not have got the preposition right.[/quote]

You can always use 'afin que' + subjunctive.  But, because 'afin de' takes the infinitive, you can't use it if the subject changes.  So, for example:

1.  "Je vous invite à la mairie afin de faire votre connaissance". 

In this case, I'm doing the inviting and I will be meeting you.  And yes, you could also say, ""Je vous invite à la mairie afin que je puisse faire votre connaissance". 

However, if I'm doing the inviting, but it's Robert who will be meeting you, you have to say:

2.  "Je vous invite à la mairie afin que Robert puisse faire votre connaisasance".  What you CAN'T say is, "Je vous invite à la mairie afin de Robert faire votre connaisasance".

It's the same in English, btw:  "I invite you to the town hall in order to meet you" vs. "I invite you to the town hall so that Robert may meet you".

HTH

Craig

[mint]

Ventodue, thank you very much.

Yes, that does make sense.  However, I am not at all sure I'd remember about the change in subject but I do understand it.

I shall copy your example down into my little carnet and I will put in some notes of my own.

Alas, I was only moaning to OH this morning that I think my brain has taken leave of absence because I am not working and having to earn a living!

I'm not complaining, the life of Riley is great; it's just that I am convinced that doing only what is pleasurable and at my own pace isn't doing the little grey cells any favours![:-))