just john Posted April 5, 2012 Share Posted April 5, 2012 ''those who make remarks contrary to the values of the Republic will be instantly put outside the territory of the French Republic, there will no exception, there will be no leniency'' .bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-Unlike Britain, where UK's safety is compromised by rights of appeal that can drag on for years . . . [Www] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frederick Posted April 5, 2012 Share Posted April 5, 2012 [quote user="just john "]''those who make remarks contrary to the values of the Republic will be instantly put outside the territory of the French Republic, there will no exception, there will be no leniency'' .bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-Unlike Britain, where UK's safety is compromised by rights of appeal that can drag on for years . . . [Www][/quote]So is he is doing away with the EU Civil Rights Legislation then ? ..... The Legislation the UK is continually being forced by the EU to stick with . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5-element Posted April 5, 2012 Share Posted April 5, 2012 [quote user="Frederick"][quote user="just john "]''those who make remarks contrary to the values of the Republic will be instantly put outside the territory of the French Republic, there will no exception, there will be no leniency'' .bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-Unlike Britain, where UK's safety is compromised by rights of appeal that can drag on for years . . . [Www][/quote]So is he is doing away with the EU Civil Rights Legislation then ? ..... The Legislation the UK is continually being forced by the EU to stick with . [/quote]It was suggested that the above is not just against EU Civil Rights Legislation, but also unconstitutional for France... no matter, words are cheap, but they can move the masses, something very useful during certain political times.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chancer Posted April 5, 2012 Share Posted April 5, 2012 Words may be cheap but the actions of expelling some (allegedly) very dangerous people from French soil has already happened.Not many people are bleating for their human rights. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patf Posted April 5, 2012 Share Posted April 5, 2012 Not doing away with Euro.human rights legislation, just ignoring it [:)]What could be the comeback on that? Whatever it is it would probably take years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
breizh Posted April 5, 2012 Share Posted April 5, 2012 Even Marine called it cynical political gesturing.I do find it bizarre that a politician, has the power to remove people from the country without either the legislative or the judiciary being involved. Lets hope he doesn't suddenly take a dislike people with red hair, or Rosbifs! All the deportations are to countries with relatively good human rights records. I wonder if that was deliberate! Kick a few people with beards out the country. Pick up a few FN votes. Just don't pick anyone serious, or from a dodgy HR country! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frederick Posted April 5, 2012 Share Posted April 5, 2012 [quote user="Patf"]Not doing away with Euro.human rights legislation, just ignoring it [:)]What could be the comeback on that? Whatever it is it would probably take years.[/quote]The comeback is a fine imposed on France by the court for ignoring their ruling .... Not a particularly huge one a few thousand Euros and I would imagine Sarkozy would consider it well worth paying every time ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NormanH Posted April 5, 2012 Share Posted April 5, 2012 Especially as that politician wasn't even elected! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
breizh Posted April 5, 2012 Share Posted April 5, 2012 [quote user="NormanH"]Especially as that politician wasn't even elected! [/quote]It's France, so I took that as a given fact!! Bet he's Sciences-Po+ENA, and that's without checking Google! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
breizh Posted April 5, 2012 Share Posted April 5, 2012 Just checked. I win my bet! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
just john Posted April 6, 2012 Author Share Posted April 6, 2012 There are today 5 million Muslims in France, the largest population in western Europe, largely as a result of the country's colonial past in north Africa. And their presence has increasingly since the 2005 riots been a central issue in French society. In 2009 the government instituted a national enquiry, with town-hall meetings and debates that resulted in much hand-wringing, over what it means today 'to be French', not least in the light of the country's ban on wearing the full Islamic veil in public.Now there is widespread belief that with the far-right National Front led by the charismatic Marine le Pen, there may be a re-run of the 2002 shock elimination by the party of one of the main contenders in the first round of voting. .bbc.Radio 4 'France & Race, question of identity' - Tues 8pm uk/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolybanana Posted April 6, 2012 Share Posted April 6, 2012 May I just ask what is wrong with expelling these or other people from a country if they are not seen as fit citizens for whatever reason? It is up to the country in question to decide whether it wishes to extend a welcome to these people or not. Had they been members of the national Socialst party, preaching anti-Jewish propaganda, then we would all immediately have wished them removed.As they are not being jailed, a trial is not necessary.They all have dual nationality so will not become stateless, having maintained a bolthole in their second country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pachapapa Posted April 6, 2012 Share Posted April 6, 2012 [quote user="just john "]There are today 5 million Muslims in France, the largest population in western Europe, largely as a result of the country's colonial past in north Africa. And their presence has increasingly since the 2005 riots been a central issue in French society. In 2009 the government instituted a national enquiry, with town-hall meetings and debates that resulted in much hand-wringing, over what it means today 'to be French', not least in the light of the country's ban on wearing the full Islamic veil in public.Now there is widespread belief that with the far-right National Front led by the charismatic Marine le Pen, there may be a re-run of the 2002 shock elimination by the party of one of the main contenders in the first round of voting. .bbc.Radio 4 'France & Race, question of identity' - Tues 8pm uk/[/quote]I presume your quote ex tempore julian jackson is couched in ironic terms oris julian the samantha brick of the historical community. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard51 Posted April 6, 2012 Share Posted April 6, 2012 [quote user="woolybanana"]Had they been members of the national Socialst party, preaching anti-Jewish propaganda, then we would all immediately have wished them removed.[/quote]Exactly - if anyone says anything that even hints at criticism of Jews / Israel, then there is righteous outrage and indignation - even though we have Israel committing serial war crimes with blatant disregard for human rights. It seems that Muslims are the 21st century's 1930s Jewry. Islamophobia and hatred in Europe has become 'de rigueur'.Mrs R51 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frederick Posted April 6, 2012 Share Posted April 6, 2012 It would appear that when it comes to the removal of muslim undesireables from the UK . When they state their removal will put their safety at risk within the country to which they are being removed ...Or they have family ties and long time association with the UK the EU Civil Rights Courts regulaly find in their favour and prevent their removal .How is it that when removals state they will be persecuted in the country to which they are being sent by France ... France can state no such danger exists ..... and the EU Civil Rights Courts accept it and out they go ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
just john Posted April 6, 2012 Author Share Posted April 6, 2012 [quote user="Richard51"][quote user="woolybanana"] Had they been members of the national Socialst party, preaching anti-Jewish propaganda, then we would all immediately have wished them removed.[/quote]Exactly - if anyone says anything that even hints at criticism of Jews / Israel, then there is righteous outrage and indignation - even though we have Israel committing serial war crimes with blatant disregard for human rights. It seems that Muslims are the 21st century's 1930s Jewry. Islamophobia and hatred in Europe has become 'de rigueur'.Mrs R51[/quote]Doesn't Israel have reason for its stance? While I would say that the hatred you suggest is limited for the fundamentalist extremists, there is bound to be distrust as to exactly who these are; I don't feel comfortable with someone in a hijab stood behind me at a cashpoint for no other reason than they are not identified, nor do I see justification for the UK having to appease the ECHR, while France presents a case worthy of discussion provoked by Sarkozy and the subsequent BBC prog does it not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard51 Posted April 6, 2012 Share Posted April 6, 2012 [quote user="just john "]Doesn't Israel have reason for its stance? [/quote]Greed for more and more land??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frederick Posted April 6, 2012 Share Posted April 6, 2012 [quote user="Richard51"][quote user="just john "]Doesn't Israel have reason for its stance? [/quote]Greed for more and more land???[/quote]" A land without a people for a people without a land " The slogan of the Zionist Movement . A European organisation seeking escape for Jews from persecution in Europe in the nineteenth century . Palestine was chosen because there were a few Jewish people living there peacefully with the majority Palestinians ..Land was also availabe . It could be bought from Turkish absentee landlords as it was once part of the Ottaman Empire ...The Palestinians were living quite peacfully with the Jews and had been for a long time ...... Then the Jews from Europe arrived ..... The rest as they say is history ! Does the slogan still mean anything today ? ... I think it does A land without a people for a people without a land goes on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard51 Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 Exactly, Frederick - it wasn't 'A land without a people for a people without a land'. The land was occupied, quite peacefully, then the ethnic cleansing, forced evacuation and land grab started...with the explicit support of the West Returning to the topic of the thread, the current wave of organised Islamophobia across the US and the EU is very reminiscent of 1930s anti-Semitism. Personally, I find the parallels very disturbing.Mrs R51 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5-element Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 I share Mrs R51's unease. Interestingly, the latest wave of arrests came to nothing:http://www.francetv.fr/info/coup-de-filet-anti-islamiste-toutes-les-gardes-a-vue-levees_81175.html?google_editors_picks=truewhich might give more credence to the posturing: "France will not tolerate any hint of terrorism on its soil". It is all a big show, and conceivably, very few of us know what is really going on, beyond the obvious muscle-flexing demo designed to impress the electorate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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