Jump to content

Scooby

Members
 View Profile  See their activity

  • Posts

    1,200

  • Joined

  • Last visited

    Never

 Content Type 

Posts posted by Scooby

    Remembrance day wreaths

    in The Complete France Post Bag

    Posted

    We have been invited by our French neighbours to participate in the various remembrance ceremonies. (As an aside they also have a ceremony to remember those that were deported and taken to concentration camps).  We were delighted to participate and didn't experience any animosity but were welcome by all the villagers who were present.

    I don't understand why there would be any resentment to the English participating?  We have many friends and family who were injured or lost their lives trying to free France.  One of our close friends (the father of Mr Scooby's best friend (and best man)) participated the first wave of the Normandy landings, likewise Mr Scooby's father who lost his leg (and ultimately died from complications).  Similarly, a number of my family were killed or injured.  We have never talked to our neighbours about our losses - we never felt the need to. 

    Halal meat . Are you happy to buy it ?

    in Other Topics

    Posted

    From the research and reading I have been doing as a result of this thread (and questions to jewish / muslim friends) - I think I may switch to eating halal / kosher meat on a regular basis.  It is healthier (the blood is drained) and the methods of slaughter seem less cruel.  Thanks Frederick for raising the topic!

    Halal meat . Are you happy to buy it ?

    in Other Topics

    Posted

    Certainly for the slaughter of chickens, halal is a kinder method of killing.  The non halal slaughterhouse stuns the birds to immobilise them but then relies on an automated cutter to sever the arteries.  Because the cutter is automated it sometimes misses and so the bird has a longer, slower death.

    I thought these research findings were interesting and put a different complexion on the debate:

    The scientific facts

    A team at the university of Hannover in Germany examined these claims

    through the use of EEG and ECG records during slaughter. Several

    electrodes were surgically implanted at various points of the skull of all

    the animals used in the experiment and they were then allowed to recover

    for several weeks. Some of the animals were subsequently slaughtered the

    halal way by making a swift, deep incision with a sharp knife on the neck,

    cutting the jugular veins and carotid arteries of both sides together with

    the trachea and esophagus but leaving the spinal cord intact. The

    remainder were stunned before slaughter using a captive bolt pistol method

    as is customary in Western slaughterhouses. The EEG and ECG recordings

    allowed to monitor the condition     of the brain and heart

    throughout.

    The Halal method

    With the halal method of slaughter, there was not change in the EEG

    graph for the first three seconds after the incision was made, indicating

    that the animal did not feel any pain from the cut itself. This is not

    surprising. Often, if we cut ourselves with a sharp implement, we do not

    notice until some time later. The following three seconds were

    characterised by a condition of deep sleep-like unconciousness brought

    about by the draining of large quantities of blood from the body.  Thereafter the EEG recorded a zero

    reading, indicating no pain at all, yet at that time the heart was still

    beating and the body convulsing vigorously as a reflex reaction of the

    spinal cord. It is this phase which is most unpleasant to onlookers who

    are falsely convinced that the animal suffers whilst its brain does

    actually no longer record any sensual messages.

    The Western method

    Using the Western method, the animals were apparently unconscious

    after stunning, and this method of dispatch would appear to be much more

    peaceful for the onlooker. However, the EEG readings indicated severe pain

    immediately after stunning. Whereas in the first example, the animal

    ceases to feel pain due to the brain starvation of blood and oxygen – a

    brain death, to put it in laymen’s terms – the second example first causes

    a stoppage of the heart whilst the animal still feels pain. However, there

    are no unsightly convulsions, which not only means that there is more

    blood retention in the meat, but also that this method lends itself much

    more conveniently to the efficiency demands of modern mass slaughter

    procedures. It is so much easier to dispatch an animal on the conveyor

    belt, if it does not move.

    Appearances can deceive

    Not all is what it seems, then. Those arguing for a humane method of killing animals for food, are

    actually more concerned about the feelings of people than those of the

    animals on whose behalf they appear to speak. The stunning method makes

    mass butchery easier and looks more palatable for the consumer who can

    deceive himself that the animal did not feel any pain when he goes to buy

    his cleanly wrapped parcel of meat from the supermarket. Islamic

    slaughter, on the other hand, does not try to deny that meat consumption

    means that animals have to die, but is designed to ensure that their loss

    of life is achieved with a minimum amount of pain.

    Halal meat . Are you happy to buy it ?

    in Other Topics

    Posted

    [quote user="sweet 17"]I don't say that you might not be genetically pre-disposed to some seriously nasty conditions but there are LOADS that you can and must do to mitigate those disadvantages.

    [/quote]

    Exactly Sweet - if she hadn't been sensible with her diet / exercise etc she may well have had her first heart attack in her thirties.  By buying herself some time she was able to benefit from a triple bypass etc...

    Halal meat . Are you happy to buy it ?

    in Other Topics

    Posted

    [quote user="gardengirl "]

    Our family has had a very healthy balanced diet for over 30 years, and it wasn't so bad before that. My husband had a heart attack two years ago; the medics ended up deciding it was family history that was the problem - both parents had heart attacks. They couldn't improve our diet.

    [/quote]

    That's the same as our family GG - my mum has always been very careful about our diet (she was a hospital  nutritionalist then changed to nursing). She was also very big on walking - never passed her driving test and walked everywhere.  She had her first heart attack in her fifties - like your parents they have said it's genetic and nothing to do with her diet / exercise.  (All her children now have to have regular screening).

    Peter, the 'healthy' vegetarian I mentioned above, was also an avid marathon runner - again it was a genetic pre-disposition 'thing'.

    Halal meat . Are you happy to buy it ?

    in Other Topics

    Posted

    A vegetarian diet doesn't guarantee good health.  A friend of mine (who has been a vegetarian since his early teens) had a massive heart attack at just 40 years of age.

    Edit - My b-i-l is a vegetarian (has been for many years) but is grossly overweight and quite definitely unhealthy.  Exercise is as important as diet..and quantity of food, of course!

    Halal meat . Are you happy to buy it ?

    in Other Topics

    Posted

    [quote user="buelligan"]you may find this of interest:

    [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Environmental_effects_of_meat_production[/url][/quote]

    Is the problem over farming or is it population explosion??  An alternative method of reducing food (and hence meat consumption) would be to allow natural causes to take their effect in managing population. There is something to be said for natural selection and survival of the fittest.  (Before anyone jumps down my throat, this approach / philosophy was suggested by an Indian friend who thought the most significant negative impact on the future of the Indian sub continent was the 20th / 21st century view that all lives had to be saved and all illnesses treated...)

    Halal meat . Are you happy to buy it ?

    in Other Topics

    Posted

    [quote user="Dog"]

    Thank you Scooby for your contribution - I am sure you feel that you can live with your choice. Why do you feel you can kill chickens and yet your local slaughterhouse can do a better job for larger animals? Do you thinkjsize of an abbatoir makes it a better place?

    [/quote]

    We don't have a stun gun.

    Halal meat . Are you happy to buy it ?

    in Other Topics

    Posted

    Sorry Dog but we have killed animals and eaten them (for chickens it's either pull and twist until the neck snaps or a sharp knife, halal style).  For larger animals we usually use our (small) local abbatoir - because they kill them in a more humane way than we are able to.   The one thing I would say is that when you have raised and slaughtered an animal you don't waste food - to me that is sacrilege.  If we have killed an animal then I make sure none is wasted.

    Halal meat . Are you happy to buy it ?

    in Other Topics

    Posted

    [quote user="buelligan"]

    I hardly think that's fair!  This thread

    actually poses the question; Halal meat . Are you happy to buy it ?  I

    imagine, the answer to that for most vegetarians would be a resounding

    NO![:D]  

    [/quote]But that's because it's meat - not because it's Halal meat...RTQ [:)]

    Halal meat . Are you happy to buy it ?

    in Other Topics

    Posted

    We have kept livestock and my brother currently has a farm.  We have killed our animals and know what is involved.  I think anyone eating meat should be willing and able to kill their own food - or at least be prepared to watch their meat killed.  The problem now is that food is so removed from it's source - everything is sanitised such that children eating beef often don't realise that beef = cow.

×
×
  • Create New...