CSCosford Posted June 28 Share Posted June 28 We lived in LBF very happily, previously for 12 years but decided to return to be closer to family 4.5 years ago. We have rapidly learned that they lead "busy" lives and have little or no time for Grandmere and Grandpere. Now, my OH has been diagnosed with either Parkinson's Disease, or Hydrocephalus, or the onset of early Alzheimer's. In view of the incredibly long wait under the NHS to see any kind of specialist, we are seriously thinking about relocating back to France, where it is much easier to see someone a great deal quicker. We realise that this will cost us, but anything is better than sitting about waiting for months on end for something to happen, which it rarely does. If anyone resident in LBF has any thoughts about our situation, we should welcome your input, as uprooting ourselves yet again at our age is not for the faint-hearted! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveLister Posted June 28 Share Posted June 28 First things first. Under what conditions are you intending to move back to France. Did you apply for residency status post Brexit or had you already moved. If you have a Carte de Sejour issued under the withdrawal agreement, my understanding is that you can be absent from the country for five years without losing it so you better get a move on if you want to return. If you didn't claim your rights ( or had already left ) than you will be treated as a new immigrant along with various requirements including, most importantly in your case, full health insurance. To begin with, you will have to apply for a long stay visitor visa followed by a carte de sejour. You will need to show proof of sufficient income and the above mentioned health insurance. I am advised that, if you are able to prove that you will be in no way a burden on the state, there is a good chance that your Carte de Sejour application will be approved. But there are no guarantees. I should also mention that France is currently going through political turmoil and there is a strong possibility that a Nationalist party will win the majority in the next election. That will make things more difficult for all non French residents. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CSCosford Posted June 28 Author Share Posted June 28 One of us has an Irish passport Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveLister Posted June 28 Share Posted June 28 OK, then I'm sorry but you are moving past my level of expertise😀. My instinct would be that the Irish passport holder would be able to return to the EU ( France ) without any additional hindrance. The question arises as to whether or not they would be allowed to bring their partner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveLister Posted June 28 Share Posted June 28 This might be of some use ( From the French Embassy in Ireland ) https://ie.ambafrance.org/Guidance-for-EU-FAMILY-MEMBERS-other-than-France-applying-for-Schengen-Visas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alittlebitfrench Posted June 29 Share Posted June 29 18 hours ago, CSCosford said: We lived in LBF very happily, previously for 12 years but decided to return to be closer to family 4.5 years ago. We have rapidly learned that they lead "busy" lives and have little or no time for Grandmere and Grandpere. Now, my OH has been diagnosed with either Parkinson's Disease, or Hydrocephalus, or the onset of early Alzheimer's. In view of the incredibly long wait under the NHS to see any kind of specialist, we are seriously thinking about relocating back to France, where it is much easier to see someone a great deal quicker. We realise that this will cost us, but anything is better than sitting about waiting for months on end for something to happen, which it rarely does. If anyone resident in LBF has any thoughts about our situation, we should welcome your input, as uprooting ourselves yet again at our age is not for the faint-hearted! Dealing with two elderly French relatives…..I can tell you in France the situation is much the same as the UK in terms of healthcare. They are both very ill. One terminally. The cost is horrendous (care and everything else) and they have the finances to support themselves. Do you ? No, don’t do it. France is in a terrible place at the moment. Try and make best of the situation you have is my advice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CSCosford Posted June 29 Author Share Posted June 29 Thank you for the two responses. It might be your impression that France is a terrible place at the moment, but believe me, it is equally bad if not worse here at the moment with a looming change of Government. Just learned from our son this morning that his wife's father is paying £80,000.00+ per annum for residential health care for his wife. The quality of life is far better in LBF. We have just had the most horrendous winter - almost 8 months, with cold, damp, rain, leaden skies day after day, et al, making an awful impact upon our psyches. Although we have to view the prospect of living again in France not through rose-tinted spectacles, it cannot be as bad as here at the moment. We have waited +8 months for an essential visit to any NHS neurologist : 3 weeks ago, filled in an on-line form from West Herts Hospital trust asking did we still need to see a specialist? Dutifully filled in the form and guess what? Nothing, zilch, nada, rien. Not even an acknowledgement that they had received the form, let alone processed it. Back to you............ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NormanH Posted June 29 Share Posted June 29 "I can tell you in France the situation is much the same as the UK in terms of healthcare. " A generalisation with nothing to support it except your assertion that " I can tell you" Can you give some specific examples? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveLister Posted June 29 Share Posted June 29 I don't believe France is a terrible place to live but it isn't paradise. The weather has been unusual this year all across Europe with some terrible flooding in France. As healthcare is important to you, you should be aware of a few facts. Firstly, you will need to purchase an international health policy for at least the first year whilst you are under a long term visa. Secondly, access to an S1 form from the UK is not a given. Currently the UK government are still issuing them to pensioners wishing to retire abroad but that could easily change. They have already been withdrawn in other circumstances. Talking of pensions, there is no commitment from the UK government that the triple lock enjoyed by UK resident pensioners will continue to be extended to those living overseas. For those retirees who were resident in Europe before Brexit this is covered by the withdrawal agreement but that's not the case for new arrivals. You could find yourself with a frozen pension. Something to consider. Thirdly, you should know that, if you receive an S1 from the UK govt. it no longer gives you the right to treatment from the NHS. You would have to apply for an EHIC to cover emergency treatment should you wish to visit your family in the UK. Finally, medical services are stretched in France just as they are in the UK. Les déserts médicaux are real and getting worse. If I were to be frank I would recommend that, rather than making such a radical move, you spend some of the money it's going to cost you buying some good private health treatment in the UK and the rest is spent on winter holidays in the sun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lori Posted June 29 Share Posted June 29 (edited) While I have no idea about the circumstances in the UK, the healthcare situation in France can vary wildly depending upon where you intend to live. The bigger the city, the more likely it is that you will find doctors taking new patients. As an example, in many parts of Provence, it is next to impossible to find doctors taking new patients. I had to drive 1.5 hours to see a GYN - only one that would accept me (I called dozens). Dentists were equally difficult. All specialists had months long waits. Opthalmologistes, Dermatologists, GYN's were known to have six month (or more) wait lists for the patients they already had. Those we called (dozens) were not accepting new patients. I had to go to an optometry clinic to have my eye exam (not an Opthalmologiste) meaning not the thorough exam a Opthalmo would complete. Then, we moved to the Dordogne. Worse. I called more than 40 MT's before finally finding one who took pity on us and accepted us. I've never found a GYN accepting new patients (I called more than 45). I wrote to CPAM asking for assistance, they called me and told me to see a Sage Femme. Heaven forbid if I have anything outside of an ordinary need. Same with Dentists. I called dozens and dozens delving out to nearly 2 hours drive from our home before finally finding one. So, you may want to do a bit of research on the location in which you wish to reside. And be warned, just because there are dozens and dozens and dozens of doctors in any given region (100's even), that does not mean they are taking new patients. You need to call them to inquire. I wish we had before we made our move. Oh and yes, it rained here from October 2023 through mid May, nearly non-stop. Rock slides, multiple rivers flooding, hundreds of homes evacuated - multiple times. The previous year was serious drought, with water restrictions and impact on land movement and home foundations cracking. You might want to check that out too for the region(s) you are considering. We love France, but it certainly has some really serious issues taking place these days. Edited June 29 by Lori 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Judith Posted June 29 Share Posted June 29 "Thirdly, you should know that, if you receive an S1 from the UK govt. it no longer gives you the right to treatment from the NHS. You would have to apply for an EHIC to cover emergency treatment should you wish to visit your family in the UK. " NormanH - are you sure about this? I am pretty positive that at least for pensioners living here and whose healthcare is ultimately paid for by an S1, making the UK their competent state, NHS care is free. At least it was the last time I looked into it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Judith Posted June 29 Share Posted June 29 I must say, that if you are not already over here and with a withdrawal card, I'd give serious re-consideration to your plans. For one thing, what is your French like, many regions have similar problems to the UK, and the healthcare, though usually excellent, can be very patchy as Lori has said. Very few medical people speak much if any English still one in teh country and outside very large towns and cities. For your situation though, whilst there is improving assistance for Alzheimer's and Parkinson's, that again is patchy, and the number of residential homes with special facilites limited. As the disease progresses language could well become more problematic too. Since Brexit, there are many more considerations to take into account, some of which have been outlined above, and though on the whole we all hope for better weather than in the UK, it cannot be guranteed, as you must know as you have lived here before. As others have said, the grass is not always greener .. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CSCosford Posted June 29 Author Share Posted June 29 Without going into too many personal details, we would not need an S1 from UK, because our pension is paid by Belgium, there would be our port of call. NHS care is obviously free : but what is the good of this when the junior doctors are on strike for the 11th time, the system is overloaded and understaffed? However, we do have to bear in mind your comments regarding the shortage of doctors and dentists. When we lived in Neuvecelle HS, our local doctor was obliged to take on any new patients who lived within the parish. Maybe the same does not apply to the Dordogne. Oh, and don't get me started on the litter hereabouts! Open the window and chuck it out seems to be the norm..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveLister Posted June 29 Share Posted June 29 Judith, that was me. The UK has tightened up on the 'residency' rules for access to the NHS. An S1 issued to someone who moves post brexit will only cover their medical costs overseas. They will lose the right to NHS treatment when they leave the country. People who are covered by the W/A continue to enjoy the same rights they had previously. This also applies to those people who have yet to reach retirement age. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveLister Posted June 29 Share Posted June 29 24 minutes ago, CSCosford said: our local doctor was obliged to take on any new patients who lived within the parish I've never heard of any doctor being forced to take on an unlimited number of patients. So, one of you has an Irish passport and your pension comes from Belgium. Anything else relevant to your situation that you'd like to volunteer before asking us to express an opinion? You said that you 'returned' to the UK in order to be closer to the family. Are either of you UK nationals? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CSCosford Posted June 29 Author Share Posted June 29 OK, point taken. We are both born in UK. My OH has an Irish passport via his late mother {Galway}. We have lived and worked in South Africa, Australia, Switzerland, Belgium and retired to Neuvecelle HS. We have moved house 24 tines. We lived extremely happily in Neuvecelle but having moved back we were not prepared for what has hit us, metaphorically speaking and long for the quality of life in LBF. It was a huge shock, despite our having visited on many occasions - it's simply not the same. Although our GP in Neuvecelle had a huge number of patients, as we lived in the parish, she accepted us immediately. We were informed she virtually had to. Not absolutely certain that this is correct though. We went privately to a neurologist £1200.00 paid out in one day for his fees, MRI, and BP measuring instrument fitted. Now waiting {im}patiently for someone, somewhere to contact us under the strained NHS. More than that, don't think I can or am willing to add, but we see your point in the above questions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveLister Posted June 29 Share Posted June 29 OK, so I'm guessing ( and it is just a guess ) that your Belgian pension originally provided you with the means to enter the health system in France and therefore should be able to do it again. That just leaves your residency. As you're obviously well travelled you'll be well used to the number of hoops one needs to go through when moving country. I'm assuming from what you've said that you've a good grasp of the French language and, having lived here before, are aware of the country's 'little quirks'. I would look at the Irish angle and see whether or not that can smooth out some of the wrinkles for you. From what you've said, access to medical services will become increasingly important so I suggest you use that as your main focus of research. I think you may be surprised at how much has changed in 4 and a half years. I'd also keep a close eye on political developments in France. Some of the mutterings from certain wannabie operators are a little scary. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CSCosford Posted June 29 Author Share Posted June 29 Many thanks for your erudite and comprehensive [and positive] response Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alittlebitfrench Posted June 29 Share Posted June 29 (edited) 3 hours ago, NormanH said: "I can tell you in France the situation is much the same as the UK in terms of healthcare. " A generalisation with nothing to support it except your assertion that " I can tell you" Can you give some specific examples? Ummm.. yes. But I can’t be bothered to write a life story. I live 10 minutes from two top general hospitals and 10 minutes from a very famous children’s hospital. I have been to all….and have had operations in two. Go back 15 years the healthcare was second to none. Today….you probably get mugged getting to the hospital. If you moved to our posh suburb of a popular city you will struggle to sign up to a doctor, forget dentist….dermatologist…..good luck with that. No chance. A new cardiologist centre is opening up and they are not taking on new patients. It has not even opened yet lol. Edited June 29 by alittlebitfrench Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lori Posted June 29 Share Posted June 29 1 hour ago, CSCosford said: When we lived in Neuvecelle HS, our local doctor was obliged to take on any new patients who lived within the parish. Maybe the same does not apply to the Dordogne. I think you will find that is not a given. When I contacted the clinic nearest us to advise we had just moved here and needed an MT, I was asked if we had any serious, chronic health conditions that needed immediate and then ongoing treatment - if not, they could not accept to see us as they were too overloaded with existing patients. Fortunately, for now, we do not have any serious, chronic health conditions and we did manage to find an MT in the end. However, what might have been the rule years ago, almost certainly won't be now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lori Posted June 29 Share Posted June 29 If you will be needing the care of a Neurologist, I would recommend you contact those in the region in which you hope to live PRIOR to making any move. Make sure they will take you on as a patient and make an appointment for a consultation so you can totally confirm this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveLister Posted June 29 Share Posted June 29 1 hour ago, Lori said: If you will be needing the care of a Neurologist, I would recommend you contact those in the region in which you hope to live PRIOR to making any move. Make sure they will take you on as a patient and make an appointment for a consultation so you can totally confirm this. +1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Judith Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 17 hours ago, DaveLister said: Judith, that was me. The UK has tightened up on the 'residency' rules for access to the NHS. An S1 issued to someone who moves post brexit will only cover their medical costs overseas. They will lose the right to NHS treatment when they leave the country. People who are covered by the W/A continue to enjoy the same rights they had previously. This also applies to those people who have yet to reach retirement age. Thanks Dave, that explains it. I'n pre-Brexit, so as I thought, I'm still covered! I've only had to us it once, when I rang out of tablets, but it's nice to kow! Phew! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CSCosford Posted June 30 Author Share Posted June 30 It appears you are absolutely right. Now we are utterly dejected and more miserable than we were before reading the article. It seems medical problems in LBF might exacerbate the precarious situation, bringing into line with the disastrous situation in the NHS - comments would be appreciated, but please..... not too negative! https://www.euronews.com/health/2023/06/29/frances-medical-deserts-hospitals-facing-daily-struggle-to-overcome-chronic-doctor-shortage Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lori Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 Yes, the article is accurate and a year old. The hospital in Sarlat has had to close portions of its treatment facilities multiple times (including its ER and maternity units). Often for long periods of time. This, of course, puts pressure on the other hospitals in the region. It is a vicious circle and a very serious one. And, I don't see any improvement having been made since your linked article was written. I think it will take a long time to begin to see any improvements. I know the government has said they are working on the situation, but it was allowed to get so bad, it will now take a LONG time to make things better. That is why I tried to implore you to check out ALL your medical needs thoroughly before even thinking about moving anywhere in France. If you have a specific area in mind, go there and try to make medical consultation appointments (actually try to make the appts. long before your visit as there will likely be a LONG delay - IF - you are able to find doctors who will see you). 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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