Inheritance

[Rose]

Does anyone know about French inheritance rules?  We understand the rules regarding children's rights to inheritance on our property in France and we are happy with the way this works... can you tell me if these same inheritance laws will include/encompass our assets overseas or does it only apply to property in France and funds held in France.  [8-)]

Many thanks! [:)]

[Will]

That depends mainly on where you are regarded as domiciled for tax purposes (not necessarily the same as resident). You should take expert advice if this is important to you.

[woolybanana (ex tag)]

Will is right. Be careful with this one. Basically, if you are regarded as domiciled in France, then all is under French law, but if domiciled in UK, then the fatherless sons of female dogs will be after you for more of your hard won assets, after the French have finished.

You must take advice though. Domicile is sometimes difficult to work out.

[Rose]

Hi Will and Wooly... just to say we contacted our solicitor and the notaire and both have replied (very quickly!) saying our english assets will remain under UK law... great news as our existing wills can remain as they are and French inheritance laws are fine for French assets!  that's another thing crossed off the list! [:)]

less than 2 weeks to go now! [blink]

[Loiseau]

Just a thought, PPS, re English Wills:

Check the wording at the beginning of them to see that they don't refer to "all my property" or whatever.  Our UK solcicitor amended that, by adding "except in France", or words to that effect, to each.

Angela

[Rose]

Thanks Loiseau... good tip!  Will make sure we make the amendments [:)]  We're going to get our solicitor here to check over everything before we go so I'll pass on the advice!

[gladys]

Am I right in thinking therefore that all our assets in the UK can be dealt with according to our English wills, even though we are domiciled in France and French taxpayers?  Also if our wills say 'all my property' or something similar can we just put a note with the wills, witnessed of course, to say 'except in France'?

[allanb]

Of course I don't know what your UK assets consist of, but - with great respect for your solicitor and notary - I agree with the advice "be careful" with this.  I believe that if you die when resident in France, all your assets, anywhere in the world, are subject to French inheritance law except real estate outside France.

I was told this quite emphatically by my French notary when talking about making a will.  You can find the same statement on www.frenchentree.com, which is a Blevins Franks information site.  I have searched some official French websites, but haven't found anything definitive either way.

My notary added the interesting comment that the existence of a British will may create a difficult situation for a British executor, who may find himself having to argue against French law in trying to execute the will.  He won't succeed (said my notary) but it will be a waste of his time, so it's better not to have a UK will except perhaps for UK real estate.

I took his advice and revoked my British will.  But it would be interesting to hear from anyone who has personal experience of this situation following a death.

[freddy]

You can do two wills under these circumstances but you will need someone whoe knows what they are talking about in both juristictions, for example, a a standard will template in the UK will revoke all previous wills, this needs to be changed to acknowledge the existance and scope of the french will - and probably the other way round. It is tricky but quite possible.

[Gluestick]

If you enjoy significant assets, and you have more than one child and wish to leave your assets in a specific manner, then you need very keen professional advice!

Then there is the matter of IHT (Inheritance Tax).

If you remember, the Inland Revenue had recently granted an amnesty to all those who had not bothered to declare certain forms of past income: this included rents from foreign properties!

The UK Revenue will most certainly hold out their hand for IHT on overseas real property!

Unless, as Will has already said, your Domicile is elsewhere. Changing residency is quite simple: changing Domicile is far harder and to convince the UK Revenue is not an easy task!

We are dealing with an estate, currently, where the testator took "professional" advice and created what he and his children believed to be a secure mechanism to execute his wishes after his demise.

I had the onerous task of informing the executor and joint beneficiaries that what had been done whilst partially successful, had created a circumstance where the property was clawed back into the estate for IHT!

Personally, for UK property, I would create a trust: and then ensure that you conform to trust law and the asset/s cannot be deemed what is called "Gifts with Reservation", which takes them straight back into the estate!

 

[Llwyncelyn]

Glustick I am with you on this one.  For our UK property we carried out a discretionary trust and the law of equity and trusts are not as one would think a dusty subject.  We limited our wills to UK property and excluded our French home.  I am a lawyer and I took advice but as you say where you live where you pay your taxes et al have troubled brilliant legal brains for years.

Here in France it is entirely a differing matter and as I do not have children but my wife children from a previous marriage then its complicated and as in everything correct professional advice is called for.

Interesting point Solicitors and advisers in the UK owe a duty of care to their clients so if they are giving advice to those who are already resident in France are they still bound.  For duty of care is a UK standard in the civil law.  Therefore if the advisers get it wrong do you sue in France or UK.  Depends.............as in everything.  What say Blevin gives advice here and they are negligent where do you sue if Blevin say are registered in the UK.  See the problem?

regards

[Gluestick]

As you say, Llw. and I quite agree, UK Trust law is very complex and interesting!

The taxation of trusts also changed circa two years ago: various previous loopholes have been closed off.

This is why it is critical to obtain properly qualified advice from lawyers up to speed on trust law and its taxation, who also can introduce significant cross-border knowledge as well.

Agree about the matter of liability too! Interesting one!