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M25


Russethouse

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I know - its not France, but I guess some of you use this stretch of road :

As from the 15th February 08 all the Speed Cameras in theVariable Speed Limit section of the M25 near Heathrow Airport (JCT 10-15)
are going Digital and the activation limit is being lowered.

They are currently the older film type cameras and Set at 90mph when the Variable Limit Signs are not in operation.

The new digital cameras are going to be set at the normal 10% 0f the speedlimit + 2mph (80mph + and you are taking a risk basically) when the signs are not in use i.e. national speed limit. I can't confirm the activation limit when the signs are set (variable limits showing) but believe it would be the same 10% + 2mph of the speed shown by the sign at that time.

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I remember travelling to Heathrow the day that they must have been commissioning the existing system, the cameras were set to flash at exactly the variable limit showing (I think it was 50 or 60) and most motorists had never before encountered them so were speeding.

It looked like the paparazzi flashbulbs on oscars night[:)] I was impressed with how quick the capacitors could recharge to flash the car following.

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Matt - absolutely right. Most mornings and evenings 70 on almost any part of the M25 is purely aspirational!

Now they want to build another bridge near the Dartford bridge, possibly nearer Gravesend, to cut congestion. It does not seem to have occurred to them that the tolls are the cause of much of that congestion! Of course it is nothing to do with the enormous revenue which they generate!!!

Andy

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[quote user="J.R."]

It looked like the paparazzi flashbulbs on oscars night[:)] I was impressed with how quick the capacitors could recharge to flash the car following.

[/quote]

That is sad and rather worrying!!

 

After never been caught speeding in my life I have had two fines through the post since the six months we have been living here in Germany!  Although famously there is no normal upper speedlimit on the motorways there are parts where speed limits are imposed and they are strictly enforced.

Just like in France the Polizei are very sneaky and hide behind bridges, however I have seen them hiding in bushes!  In urban areas they also dress up in mufti and camoflage whilst craftily pointing their radar gun!

What is quite funny is that as we still use our car from the UK here, the pictures on the speeding fines are always of the passenger side of the car.  It was therefore quite a surprise to have a picture of my dad come through the post!

Again not sure about France but thankfully you only get points here if you go above a certain speed above the limit.  They send you a paying in slip which you just take to the bank - very efficient as most things here in Germany!

Thanks for info about M25 will remember that when we return back in a few weeks visiting family.

Dale

 

 

 

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[quote user="St_Jacques"]Although famously there is no normal upper speedlimit on the motorways there are parts where speed limits are imposed and they are strictly enforced.[/quote]and usually equally strictly observed - by the Germans [;-)]

Anton: Whilst there has been much talk and rumour about "zero tolerance" cameras I do not believe they are in serious use anywhere and are unlikely to be until the methods of drivers safely and consistently monitoring their speed to the degree of accuracy required exist and are a standard fit to all vehicles.

From Hansard;

Speedometer Accuracy

Lord Allen of Abbeydale asked Her Majesty's Government:

    Whether, in the light of the increasing importance of speed limits, they have any plans to make it easier for the private motorist to have his speedometer tested for accuracy.[HL839]

Lord Whitty: The Road Vehicles (Construction and Use) Regulations 1986, as amended, allows the use of speedometers that meet the requirements of EC Community Directive 75/443(97/39) or ECE Regulation 39. Both the EC Directive and the ECE Regulation lay down accuracy requirements to be applied at the time of vehicle approval for speedometers. These requirements are that the indicated speed must not be more than 10 per cent of the true speed plus 4 km/h. In production, however, a slightly different tolerance of 5 per cent plus 10 km/h is applied. The requirements are also that the indicated speed must never be less than the true speed.

A vehicle meeting these requirements would not be able to travel at a greater speed than that shown on the speedometer and a driver could not, therefore, inadvertently exceed speed restrictions. Her Majesty's Government have no plans to introduce instrument tests.

ACPO Guidelines;

Vehicle construction and use regulations require a vehicle speedometer accuracy to be in the range of -0->+10%. The implications are that it must never under-read - for obvious reasons - but may over-read. As the cost of manufacturing a speedometer with -0% error would be very costly they all over-read by a few percent without exception. Even if speed is measured correctly the display may not be accurate, so a speedometer error is allowed. Because of this, the Association of Chief Police Officers (ACPO) have an official formula for calculating a speeding offence. It allows a leeway of 10% plus 2mph. In reality, most speed traps are triggered at higher speeds than this because if they were set bang-on those guidelines, the sheer amount of paperwork generated would overrun the police speeding departments.

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I'm not convinced that drivers are capable of consistently monitoring their speed to any degree of accuracy.  That's why the regs insist on speedometers that overread so that a driver could not inadvertantly exceed speed restrictions.  I suspect the employment of zero tolerance cameras in the UK is unlikely to occur because the actual speed limit there is no longer an absolute.

Take the ACPO guidelines - their 'leeway' means that a vehicle may travel at up to 79mph (true speed) on a UK motorway before it will trigger a speed trap.  At this point, a speedo with a 5% tolerance would be reading an indicated 83mph.  The fact that they have had to set the trigger even higher to avoid being swamped with paperwork suggests that they acknowledge that knowingly driving with the speedo reading 10-20mph over the posted legal limit is now the acceptable norm.....

 

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