cooperlola Posted April 13, 2011 Share Posted April 13, 2011 [quote user="Alpinemist"] I've been paying private health cover for 11 years [/quote]I assume, then, that you are either not an EU citizen, or have moved from outside France in the last 5 years? (I'm not being nosey, just wondering why you're not with CMU or another scheme.) Don't feel that you have to answer if you don't want to![:)] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnOther Posted April 13, 2011 Share Posted April 13, 2011 Could be a private health scheme in UK of course, BUPA, PPP, etc.[;-)] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cooperlola Posted April 13, 2011 Share Posted April 13, 2011 Well, in that case, why is Alpinemist asking about the doctor's visits etc? Anyway, as I say, none of my business, really. I was just concerned that anybody might be paying for consultations here when they don't have to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alpinemist Posted April 13, 2011 Share Posted April 13, 2011 Hi Coop - I'm UK citizen living outside europe for the past 11 years. Making permanent move to France in 2 months time. Needless to say i'm looking forward to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cooperlola Posted April 14, 2011 Share Posted April 14, 2011 Now I get it. As I say, sorry to sound so nosey but I like to keep up with all the healthcare variations (if you see what I mean) and I was intrigued. Thanks for the explanation.[:)] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alpinemist Posted April 14, 2011 Share Posted April 14, 2011 No problem. I've tried to plan as best I can and read tons on this forum but know that in 2 months I will have loads of questions and will be picking your brains. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keni Posted April 15, 2011 Share Posted April 15, 2011 Alpinemist, as Cooperlola knows, we are sort of in same position - trying to figure out where we go when E106/S1 runs out at the end of the year. Apart from taking up as AE, or funding health ourselves, have yet not looked to what happens next. As Coops says, until 2012 when the first group of 5 years are up, then we will find out how the system willl work.Mind you I have always felt the French have stabbed themselves in the foot with this one. If every ex-pat was paying their dues in the French system, there would be more money going in - not everyone paying in will be taking out, so the system would be making, not losing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idun Posted April 15, 2011 Share Posted April 15, 2011 The french were saying a few years ago that with regards to the UK they were sending their young and the brits were 'sending' their old. That is the problem really, 'old' folks cost a lot to keep medically speaking. So for all, not all old people cost the health care system much, an awful lot do. When the S forms are handed in for retirees, then at least the french get a lump sum every year whether the health system is used or not. And I count myself in this 'old' group in my late 50's.This problem is going to get 'worse' though as the retirement age goes up, anyone who was not 60 by the end of March this year will have even longer to wait for their S form. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cooperlola Posted April 15, 2011 Share Posted April 15, 2011 [quote user="idun"]The french were saying a few years ago that with regards to the UK they were sending their young and the brits were 'sending' their old.[/quote]That is the point about reciprocity, surely? British people retire early to France and free up job opportunities for young French people, thus keeping the French social security budget lower. Europe cannot have it both ways - either it's a community for mutual support or it isn't. It's the age-old problem of not seeing the big picture - the health budget is not the only thing affected here. But this is old ground and I've been boring for both Britain and France on this subject for about four years now! As far as health costs for the early-retired go - how much proof has everybody got as to what a "burden" they are on the health system? They pay their dues and without stressful jobs, I'll bet quite a percentage of them (us) are pretty healthy. Before my accident (all the costs for which are being borne by the guilty party's insurers, before anybody says I'm a drain on the health service here), I had never met my doctor except to translate for a friend when he got his blood pressure medicine (he was on an E form, before you ask - over 65.)As far as the retirement age goes, Idun, that age change for S forms applies only to women and is a sliding scale - it will be 61 next year. Men have had to be 65 since E forms were invented afaik. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mint Posted April 15, 2011 Share Posted April 15, 2011 Dear Coops, trust you to be the one to speak up!Well, I don't feel any guilt either. OH worked in the UK till he was 76 and we pay our mutuelle. He hasn't seen a doctor for 4 years since we have been in France and I only see mine for my asthma drugs which she'd only give me for 3 months at a time. If she'd let me have a year round prescription, I wouldn't be wanting to queue up at her horrible waiting room, catching other people's germs, waiting for my turn!As you say, it's swings and roundabouts....some you win and others....well, others need medical care and there it is. We are supposed to be advanced, civilised, compassionate and everything else. So, let's just look after the ones who can't look after themselves, eh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idun Posted April 15, 2011 Share Posted April 15, 2011 I hadn't checked the pension calculator for a month or so or three and it has all changed since I looked. I was keeping my eye on it for men and for me too. For women it is on a sliding scale which actually started from last April, so 2010 when it starts to go up . I hadn't realised. Just days at first, but up to 61 and above for those who are 60 this year.Last time Iooked I would be 63 and three months and now that is down to 63 and 18 days when I am entitled to a UK pension.I take it that the S forms are issued once the offiical state pension starts.Re health care, well as I in my late 50's and have friends of all ages, I have to say that it is us 'old' ones who seem to require the most health care. In our forties and younger none of us seemed to need any at all, now, most, if not all of us seem to need something or other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alpinemist Posted April 15, 2011 Share Posted April 15, 2011 I'm just a little disappointed in the whole thing. I'm the sort of person that looks on the bright side but feel this is just plain wrong. As it's a legal requirement to have health insurance the insurance companies can inflate pricing as they know you have no choice.My example - I am 41 years old and my wife 45. Both in good health. We purchased in France prior to this law coming into effect in 2007. The quote I just got back from Amariz $592.00 euros pm. How on earth can people pay that amount for 5 years.As I've worked outside the UK for so long I assume I don't qualify for an E121 ? so would have to pay 35,520 euros over 5 years if i chose that policy. That's a lot of money. That's as much as most peoples mortgages but at least you get equity back for paying a mortgage. I can't remember the last time I went to the doctor.It's sad, but must admit if I didn't already have a house in France I would probably choose somewhere else to live.Coop - Do you know any way of reducing / avoiding some of this health insurance cost. It's just insanely high. We just don't know what to do at this stage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cooperlola Posted April 15, 2011 Share Posted April 15, 2011 As far as I know, Alpinemist, work is the only way to get around this. I think the most common way is to set up as an Autoentrepreneur - you could do anything and for as few or as many hours as you wished, afaik, to get you into the system.The European Commission has been looking at the "new" health regs in France but I've heard nothing about what's going on on that front. However, there's still a chance that what M. Sarkozy's goverment has done will be deemed contrary to the spirit of the EU but I wouldn't hold my breath. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alpinemist Posted April 15, 2011 Share Posted April 15, 2011 Thanks, I'll look into being an Autopreneur. No doubt I'll be back with questions on this :-)I'll head back over to your health site. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cooperlola Posted April 15, 2011 Share Posted April 15, 2011 [quote user="Alpinemist"]I'll head back over to your health site. [/quote]I can only appologise for the fact that it's just a reference resource these days - the group has pretty much fizzled out (or gone back to the UK!)Have a look at this:http://www.theautoentrepreneur.com/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alpinemist Posted April 15, 2011 Share Posted April 15, 2011 Thanks CoopThat looks like a possibility. I'll have a better read over the weekend. I've fancied doing a small business but with no pressure of having to go through all the beaurocracy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
britgirl Posted April 15, 2011 Share Posted April 15, 2011 [quote user="idun"] I hadn't checked the pension calculator for a month or so or three and it has all changed since I looked. I was keeping my eye on it for men and for me too. For women it is on a sliding scale which actually started from last April, so 2010 when it starts to go up . I hadn't realised. Just days at first, but up to 61 and above for those who are 60 this year.Last time Iooked I would be 63 and three months and now that is down to 63 and 18 days when I am entitled to a UK pension.I take it that the S forms are issued once the offiical state pension starts.Re health care, well as I in my late 50's and have friends of all ages, I have to say that it is us 'old' ones who seem to require the most health care. In our forties and younger none of us seemed to need any at all, now, most, if not all of us seem to need something or other. [/quote]I hope that you are not of the 'lucky ones' who will be affected by the latest UK government policies. I never thought I would wish to be a year or two older than I am. [:(]C'est la vie. *************************************************************************************Proposed changes affecting people born between 6 April 1953 and 5 April 1960More details You can read the full details of the government’s decision on the DWP websiteState Pension age review Opens new window The proposed changes to the State Pension age timetable, announced in November 2010, affect those born between 6 April 1953 and 5 April 1960.Under the new proposals, from December 2018 the State Pension age for both men and women will start to increase to reach 66 by April 2020. This would mean that women’s State Pension age will increase more quickly to 65 between April 2016 and November 2018.These proposed changes to the timetable are not yet law and still require the approval of Parliament.Proposed changes for womenDate of birthDate State Pension age reached6 April 1953 to 5 May 19536 July 20166 May 1953 to 5 June 19536 November 20166 June 1953 to 5 July 19536 March 20176 July 1953 to 5 August 19536 July 20176 August 1953 to 5 September 19536 November 20176 September 1953 to 5 October 19536 March 20186 October 1953 to 5 November 19536 July 20186 November 1953 to 5 December 19536 November 2018Proposed changes for women and menDate of birthDate State Pension age reached6 December 1953 to 5 January 19546 March 20196 January 1954 to 5 February 19546 July 20196 February 1954 to 5 March 19546 Nov 20196 March 1954 to 5 April 19546 March 20206 April 1954 to 5 April 1960Your 66th birthdayPension age calculatorFor men and women born on or after 6 April 1960 the State Pension age is already set to increase to 66 from 2026 and then to 67 from 2036 and 68 from 2046.If you were born after 6 April 1960 you should use the State Pension age calculator to work our your State Pension age.Calculating your State Pension age Calculating your State Pension age However, you should be aware that the government is considering the current timetable for future increases to the State Pension age from 66 to 68. Any change to the timetable would require the approval of Parliament. ******************************************************************************* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idun Posted April 15, 2011 Share Posted April 15, 2011 Britgirl, that is what I saw a few weeks / months ago, but today I could only see what I had quoted.Who knows, I'll not hold my breath. I think that in 10-20 years time we'll be lucky to have any pensions at all, and when they say they put people out to grass, I imagine that that may literally be true. Too many old wanting high incomes, too few young to pander to them. So I'll see what the future holds and not whinge about what happens, no point. I have had a great life. We always had employment and a high standard of living, unimagineable to even my grandmother. The future will take care of itself. Alpinist, unless early retirees are careful they don't necessarily get a couple of years with the E form. And I suppose that the authorities believe that people who retire at such a young age, should figure their health costs into their budget until they have to cover them. Insurance companies will charge as they will charge, and I believe that much shopping round is called for. And we moved back to the UK and we are going to have to pay for our health care in the UK, complicated, but we will have to. So out of 60 odd million we have to pay, there you go. Not as much as you, but as UK health care is residence based, and we are residents, we still don't 'qualify'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cooperlola Posted April 16, 2011 Share Posted April 16, 2011 As Alpinemist has been out of the UK for so long he gets no S form cover at this stage anyway. However, they do need to look into their NI contributions record and see if it's worth paying a voluntary stamp to bring enough years for a UK old-aged pension and a thus a retirement S1 (or even if they can.) I'm with you, Idun, I'm afraid that future generations need to make their own provisions - I was lucky to be in an industry with good pension rights at a time when such things were more common. We have always lived well and still do, compared to so many on this planet. However, if you had told me at the age of 18 when I started work, that I needed to make my own plans for the ripe old age of 67/8/9 or even older, I'd have laughed. It didn't seem like an issue then and I suspect that the current generation just beginning work is the same as I was. How we get this important point over to them is anybody's guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnOther Posted April 16, 2011 Share Posted April 16, 2011 [quote user="cooperlola"]However, they do need to look into their NI contributions record and see if it's worth paying a voluntary stamp to bring enough years for a UK old-aged pension and a thus a retirement S1 (or even if they can.)[/quote]Under the old system a man needed 44 years for a full pension and a woman 39, with a minimum of 9 years for both to qualify for one at all.Under the new rules both men and women only need 30 years for the full pension but as long as you have at least 1 year or more in you will get x/30th's so there is no need to top up simply to qualify, only to get more when you do reach pensionable age. You have to do the sums to see if that is a worthwhile investment but in any case I think you can only buy back a maximum of 6 years.http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/personalfinance/pensions/8309174/Last-chance-to-claim-3000-of-lost-pension-years.htmlHMRC guidance here:http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/pdfs/nico/ni38.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alpinemist Posted April 18, 2011 Share Posted April 18, 2011 I've thought for many years that the state pension would probably be abolished / reduced. Although it would be very nice to have it I've always planned as though the state would give me nothing, (It's looking more like that will be the case when we get there). We're just trying to break away from the grind of being tied to work to pay for things and enjoy life whilst we can, but it's surprising how it tries to drag you back in. We'll persevere and I'm sure it will be worth it in the end. We just decided if we don't try we'll never know. It will certainly help if we can get on the state health asap though ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnOther Posted April 18, 2011 Share Posted April 18, 2011 Freedom of movement within the EU's is all too often confused with freedom to come and go and do as you like but in reality seems to apply to goods and workers and not much else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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