Clarification of need for architect

[Janandnigel]

We have a cu for house, 4 gites & pool. We have kept the size of the house under 170m2 as we thought this would mean that we don't need an architect. The gets are also much smaller. Is the requirement for an architect for each building or the whole site? Can anyone help please?

[idun]

Sounds like you need an architect to me. This complex is as big as some hameaux  where I used to live.

[pachapapa]

Do you mean under the regulations up to and including the 31st Dec 2011

Or do you mean under the regulations enacted in July 2011 and applicable from the 1st Jan 2012

or do you mean something else?

[Janandnigel]

I mean whatever regs will cover us. We understood that under 170 m2 did not require an architect. We want to know if this applies to each building or collectively. We will only build the house at first and then the gites as and when.

[Val_2]

This could depend on your demand and whether you disclose future plans at this stage because eventually you will need permission for this and which will make a big impact on your requirement for the need of an architect to oversee the project. 170m² is thelimit before you require a professional to intervene. You may also be refused permission to build further buildings depending on your location and the local council's views as well!

[Steve Davies]

Hi Jan/Nigel.

If you are doing the work building by building then you can do them individually.It may be well worth your while to see if "linked" buildings can be done together. In other words are two smaller barns below the 170 threshold so can be done as one application. You may fall foul of the COS (Coefficient d'Occupation du Sols) rule. This dictates how much build/habitation is allowed on a particular plot, and is expressed as a factor of total area. So a plot of 1000m2 with a COS of 0,1 can have a build of 100m2, COS 0,2= 200m2 build. Just find out what the COS for the plot is from the Mairie what is stated on their PLU (Plan Local d'Urbanisme) if they have one!

Also consider if you are going to use them solely as Gites/Holiday rental you may like to get permission for them as seasonal letting units so tax liabilities etc can be worked to your advantage, check with local planners and tax officer.

Last, but not least, the method of calculating the 170m2 changed on !st March 2012 and is now called the "Surfaces Plancher". Has advantages of not including the thickness of external walls. saves a lot if your barn walls are as thick as mine (50cms! which on a 52metre run of wall is 26m2 saved.) Can make the difference betwen needing an Architect and not.

Lot to take in, hope it helps, further help required feel free to get in touch

All the best

Steve Davies

[pachapapa]

Last, but not least, the method of calculating the 170m2 changed on !st March 2012

I was under the impression that the "plancher" rule began on the 1st january 2012 and that the 1st march was the date on which the new planning pro-formas became available.

[Steve Davies]

Hi "pachapapa,"

http://www.net-iris.fr/veille-juridique/actualite/28666/nouvelle-definition-de-la-surface-plancher-un-bien-immobilier.php

I try hard to make sure I get things right before posting.

If a mistake is made I will be the first to apologise.

All the best

Steve Davies

[pachapapa]

[quote user="Steve Davies"]

Hi "pachapapa,"

http://www.net-iris.fr/veille-juridique/actualite/28666/nouvelle-definition-de-la-surface-plancher-un-bien-immobilier.php

I try hard to make sure I get things right before posting.

If a mistake is made I will be the first to apologise.

All the best

Steve Davies

[/quote]

A well composed reply, abject apologies for being a bit provocative,a good link with a clear explanation.

Cheers PPP.

Re: When is a loft a room?

However just for the record I would like to record that my post above and in particular regarding SHOB & SHON is almost purely pedantic as NEXT WEEK on the 1st march 2012 they will be replaced by " surface de plancher". The application of the Ordonnance should allow one to squeeze a few square metres more than the SHON, as well as simplifying the calculation. http://www.legifrance.gouv.fr/affichTexte.do?cidTexte=JORFTEXT000024804731&dateTexte= http://www.legifrance.gouv.fr/affichTexte.do?cidTexte=JORFTEXT000024804723&dateTexte=

Re: When is a loft a room?

However just for the record I would like to record that my post above and in particular regarding SHOB & SHON is almost purely pedantic as NEXT WEEK on the 1st march 2012 they will be replaced by " surface de plancher". The application of the Ordonnance should allow one to squeeze a few square metres more than the SHON, as well as simplifying the calculation. http://www.legifrance.gouv.fr/affichTexte.do?cidTexte=JORFTEXT000024804731&dateTexte= http://www.legifrance.gouv.fr/affichTexte.do?cidTexte=JORFTEXT000024804723&dateTexte=

However just for the record I would like to record that my post above and in particular regarding SHOB & SHON is almost purely pedantic as NEXT WEEK on the 1st march 2012 they will be replaced by " surface de plancher".

The application of the Ordonnance should allow one to squeeze a few square metres more than the SHON, as well as simplifying the calculation.

http://www.legifrance.gouv.fr/affichTexte.do?cidTexte=JORFTEXT000024804731&dateTexte=

http://www.legifrance.gouv.fr/affichTexte.do?cidTexte=JORFTEXT000024804723&dateTexte=

[Janandnigel]

Thanks Steve, I think you have clarified our question. We do want to only build one thing at a time....and finances permitting do the gite(s) at a later stage when we are settled in our house.

I believe the CU we have alreday takes in for these being for holiday purpose as the Maire has confirmed our land is rested for 'loisirs' . This is what we applied for in the beginning. I think we are ok as far as size as we have altogether 15,800 M2

Having deliberated on this for a while now, we may still use a reasonably priced architect to re- draw our house and submit our plans.

If anyone knows one near 24700 Le Pizou, please contact us.

Nigel is a builder and will manage the project himself using local artisans.

Thanks for all the very useful replies.

Jan and Nigel

[Steve Davies]

Hi Jan and Nigel,

I try me best!

Did you apply for the CU? If so check its' validity, timewise. They do not last for ever and expire after 18 months of granting although extension can be applied for. Bit of serendipity at work here and I have sent an e-mail that explains why!

Best to both

Steve Davies

[Steve Davies]

Hi all,

Further to the discussion re Surfaces Plancher

https://www.formulaires.modernisation.gouv.fr/gf/getNotice.do?cerfaNotice=13409-2&cerfaFormulaire=88065*02

Takes you to the government form to help with the working out and

http://www.frenchentree.com/fe-renovation/DisplayArticle.asp?ID=45684

an article that explains it all (if I'm allowed to post this link here?)

Hope this helps with the sums etc

All the best

Steve Davies

[Steve Davies]

Hi all

Latets info re "clarification" of Emprise de Sol and architect requirement.

http://www.urbinfos.com/reglementation/recours-architecte-obligatoire-emprise-au-sol-decret.html

Still be aware that local planning officers may need telling about this and intepret it appropriately, so still wise to check and see how it applies to the individual circumstances of your applications for planning permission and declarations of works.

All the best

Steve Davies