Sharon Osborne...Good role model???

[jon]

Russet House Sharon Osborne is a survivor...she is surviving...aagainst all odds she still seems to love Ossie....got over her cancer...made herself more attractive and taken a bigger potion in confidence.Not mad keen on swaring...especialling for the sake of it...but that aside you have think  five  times before condemn  her.

[Will]

I think La Osbourne is fine on the X Factor, as she was on the fly-on-the-wall thing about the family. She's one of those people who suits the so-called 'reality' TV. But she was a bad choice for the Brits, and I think the real problem was that she tried far too hard to make herself look like the right choice by a totally OTT attempt to behave in what she obviously thought was a way that would appeal to the audience. So she decided to put on her version of the petulant, moody, foul-mouthed teenager act. Had she acted like her X Factor judge character she would have come across much better.

It's rather sad; the Brits thing is generally so poorly organised and presented that it devalues the winners and nominees. There are some really good young people around at the moment (and I don't mean the incompetents, club singers, dross and the occasional real talent from the reality shows). Many can sing and play their instruments, write really good songs, and they deserve much better. Certainly most of those who performed at the Brits made McCartney sound like a dinosaur - though of course there are plenty of oldies around who can still do the stuff.

 

[artsole]

[quote user="Gluestick"]

 

 

Unfortunately, the ever impressionable young, tend to copy their transitory heroes and heroines and now seem to believe that unnacceptable behaviour and language is normal.

 

 

[/quote]

Gluestick, have you forgotten Peter Moon, the sex pistols, etc etc............are you looking at music history through 'rose tinted glasses' and sorry, there a loads of talented musicians and singers at the moment, who don't need the 'mixing room' to improve their performance[blink]

[jon]

I agree that she was not a good choice for the Brit awards and  it was a strange family gathering where she...Sharon made a run for the black frocks and her husband managed a few slured words.The brightest spark in the family was the Osborne daughter.The whole show did not seem filled with excitement or sense of appreciation.

I do enjkoy the ex factor and American idol.....as I love to see people win and achieve their dreams...and although there is a clear number one

the programme is a forum to show talent......and there is still talent out there.

Dreams are an impperative part of life...as is music.

 

 

 

[jon]

Maybe Artsole it is a matter of taste...certainly The Who never filled me with excitement......never got me rushing to the RSG studios....and Sex Pistols...no.....Pink Floyd...no.

My taste....surely m ost of you the same.   Cat Stevens.....Donovan...Tim Harding.

Spooky Tooth......Writing on the Wall...

[artsole]

[quote user="jon"]

Maybe Artsole it is a matter of taste...certainly The Who never filled me with excitement......never got me rushing to the RSG studios....and Sex Pistols...no.....Pink Floyd...no.

My taste....surely m ost of you the same.   Cat Stevens.....Donovan...Tim Harding.

Spooky Tooth......Writing on the Wall...

[/quote]

jon, I was'nt talking about my personal tastes in music, though I am a 'who' fan......................'My Generation' is a classic. [8-|] I was commenting on Gluesticks premise that it is recent musical history and 'foul mouthed celebrities ' that is 'spoiling the youth of this world', perhaps he (gluestick)belongs to the 1950's parents of USA kids who condemed Elvis for the 'sexual' content of his songs..................phewww[Www] things have'nt changed much

[Gluestick]

[quote user="artsole"][quote user="Gluestick"]

 

 

Unfortunately, the ever impressionable young, tend to copy their transitory heroes and heroines and now seem to believe that unnacceptable behaviour and language is normal.

 

 

[/quote]

Gluestick, have you forgotten Peter Moon, the sex pistols, etc etc............are you looking at music history through 'rose tinted glasses' and sorry, there a loads of talented musicians and singers at the moment, who don't need the 'mixing room' to improve their performance[blink]

[/quote]

The Who.................interesting.

Four years ago (time flies!) I was working closely with a film director who actually made the film "The Kids Are Alright". There's another story there.

He asked me to critique his manuscript of a book. We jointly decided the Who had more money for lawyers!

Of course certain people have always behaved badly. Moon was a self-destructive fool: probably why he's dead.

Same with Janice Joplin; and so many others.

When I was 16, I was besotted with various "stars".

Luckily, I grew up!

Many don't.

Do these "Loads of singers" enjoy the same media exposure, as, for example, Ms Winehouse? What a highly appropiate name!

Sadly.

 

[Gluestick]

[quote user="artsole"][quote user="jon"]

Maybe Artsole it is a matter of taste...certainly The Who never filled me with excitement......never got me rushing to the RSG studios....and Sex Pistols...no.....Pink Floyd...no.

My taste....surely m ost of you the same.   Cat Stevens.....Donovan...Tim Harding.

Spooky Tooth......Writing on the Wall...

[/quote]

jon, I was'nt talking about my personal tastes in music, though I am a 'who' fan......................'My Generation' is a classic. [8-|] I was commenting on Gluesticks premise that it is recent musical history and 'foul mouthed celebrities ' that is 'spoiling the youth of this world', perhaps he (gluestick)belongs to the 1950's parents of USA kids who condemed Elvis for the 'sexual' content of his songs..................phewww[Www] things have'nt changed much

[/quote]

Artsole:

You are now suggesting I had stated specifics I have not written: your interpretation. Freudian, probably! [:D]

Of course older generations criticise new ways: that's the way of the World.

However, there has been a specific escalation in bad language and bad behaviour alongside the self-promotion of the whole media inspired glitz of "Celebdom", during the past ten years.

You might be comfortable in introducing a youngster who speaks in a series of monosyllabic Anglo-Saxon epithets to your maiden aunt.

I wouldn't however.

Each to their own.

[Www]

[artsole]

[quote user="Gluestick"][quote user="artsole"][quote user="Gluestick"]

is that 'name dropping' gluestick? [blink]

You may be an accomplished and decent musician..........I can't judge that unless I heard you.......but you've never  reached the heady hights of 'star status'.........but some of these young talented musicians and singers are 'catapulted into 'stardom' by music moguls and producers.................we've seen it throughout musical history since the late 50's and early 60's.........unfortunately, some don't or can't cope with 'celebrity', they become 'obsessed', self-destructive, introspective, addicted etc etc..........it doesn't mean they are 'fools',

you could have said that about 'ollie' Reed, but you didn't...................genious is hard to define but often just misunderstood[:(] ofcourse there are other singers at the moment who enjoy the same media exposure as amy winehouse.................just because she has an 'addiction' problem doesn't mean she is'nt talented!

 

 

 

 

 

[/quote]

Gluestick, have you forgotten Peter Moon, the sex pistols, etc etc............are you looking at music history through 'rose tinted glasses' and sorry, there a loads of talented musicians and singers at the moment, who don't need the 'mixing room' to improve their performance[blink]

[/quote]

The Who.................interesting.

Four years ago (time flies!) I was working closely with a film director who actually made the film "The Kids Are Alright". There's another story there.

He asked me to critique his manuscript of a book. We jointly decided the Who had more money for lawyers!

Of course certain people have always behaved badly. Moon was a self-destructive fool: probably why he's dead.

Same with Janice Joplin; and so many others.

When I was 16, I was besotted with various "stars".

Luckily, I grew up!

Many don't.

Do these "Loads of singers" enjoy the same media exposure, as, for example, Ms Winehouse? What a highly appropiate name!

Sadly.

 

[/quote]

[artsole]

well, did that post go wrong...............sorry[8-)]

[raindog]

[quote user="Gluestick"]

You might be comfortable in introducing a youngster who speaks in a series of monosyllabic Anglo-Saxon epithets to your maiden aunt.

[/quote]

I don't think artsole (I have to concentrate when I type that [:D]) was refering to youth in general, I think he was saying that there are young musicians who can play just as well as our heroes in the sixties. Have a listen to Jack White of the White Stripes for instance. Raw guitar blues - Jimmy Page has been spotted near the stage watching him play on more than one accasion. Still great music being made now if you care to sniff it out.

[cooperlola]

[quote user="Gluestick"]BTW on Utube there is a wondrous clip of the 1950s BRM on full chat!

Cor! Now that's a sound!

[/quote]Just listening to this as I type.  Thanks Gluey.  Wonderful.

[Gluestick]

I agree: and I have a much younger friend as my mole, who is currently studying jazz and blues guitar, formally, to find 'em!

P.S. I am also deeply jealous 'cos his younger bro. who lives in the States recently brought him over a top range Gibson Les Paul Special: and mine isn't so grand!

[blink]

That said, a geat shame that these up and coming genui can't enjoy some of the exposure and eulogy reserved for the tonedeaf mob!

And some of the cash, too.

 

[Gluestick]

[quote user="cooperlola"][quote user="Gluestick"]BTW on Utube there is a wondrous clip of the 1950s BRM on full chat!

Cor! Now that's a sound!

[/quote]Just listening to this as I type.  Thanks Gluey.  Wonderful.[/quote]

Fair tingles the old spine, eh JE?

A GTO is wondrous on open pipes: but that V16....................

 

[raindog]

[quote user="Gluestick"]

P.S. I am also deeply jealous 'cos his younger bro. who lives in the States recently brought him over a top range Gibson Les Paul Special: and mine isn't so grand!

[/quote]

One of my sons plays a mean blues. He's got a Mexican Strat and an Ibanez.[:)]

[artsole]

[quote user="Gluestick"]

There are subtle but critical differneces in Ollie Reed and Ms Osborne, Artsole.

Reed's extraordinary and probable anti-social behaviour was a by-product of his illness. He didn't exploit this for his benefit: it was after all, very much to his professional and familial detriment. And he had talent; lots of it.

Ms Osborne, on the other hand is clearly, like her father, a manipulator, for her exclusive benefit. Who, in their right mind would really wish to expose the social, mental and behavioural inadequacies of their family to full public view for money?

Ms Osborne was also fortunate enough (or probably manipulative enough) to position herself next to the objectionable Mr Cowell and thus ensure that with no real talent other than a motormouth, she could add yet more millions to her bank account.

Anyone with a reasonable ear and love of music must find the stream of  mainly tonedeaf young hopefuls that Ms Osborne at al champion as putative megastars, grate. That said and of course, the manipulators know that since the current pop music scene is a totally contrived false industry, where the post-recording sound processing electronically perfects bum notes, they can still saturation sell their inferior products to an evermore idiot market!

Which has the byproduct of making it very hard if not impossible for those with real talent to succeed.

Perhaps the singular difference between the Olliver Reed days and now, is that TV will not refrain from stooping to the lowest human depths of behavioural psychosis to earn a few more bucks: Big Brother representing this core reality rather excellently.

Ollie's problems were incidental to and not a core part of his abilities and image.

Unfortunately, the ever impressionable young, tend to copy their transitory heroes and heroines and now seem to believe that unnacceptable behaviour and language is normal.

 

 

[/quote]

Gluestick, is'nt that 'in the present?[blink] Don't start me on Freud........and freudian slips......... I have degrees in Psychology and sociology[+o(]

raindog...............glad to see your concentrating.............for writing 'artsole'[geek]

[raindog]

[quote user="artsole"]

 raindog...............glad to see your concentrating.............for writing 'artsole'[geek][/quote]

[:D]Yes, it's a naughty one to get your head round that is.....

Blimey, we nearly got an interesting music thread going there.....

[Will]

We can start it again - I have to agree with Artsole about The Who, they were my 60s favourites and I had them in mind, along with Pink Floyd as oldies who can still hack it, thanks to their Live 8 performances, in my last post. There's the Stones of course.

Somebody who has been on the box a lot recently is Joe Brown, from the 50s, who is still looking good and playing better than ever. And plenty of new bands and solo singers. Needless to say, I regularly watch the Jools Holland programmes when in England (too late at night in France).

And David Gilmour of the Floyd used to live just over the river from where we were in England - Phil Collins and Mike Rutherford were just up the road. Oliver Reed was a near-permanent fixture in many of the local pubs. I have to say that's the sort of thing I miss about being in France...

[artsole]

[quote user="raindog"][quote user="artsole"]

 raindog...............glad to see your concentrating.............for writing 'artsole'[geek][/quote]

[:D]Yes, it's a naughty one to get your head round that is.....

Blimey, we nearly got an interesting music thread going there.....

[/quote]

No, raindog and Gluestick keep the music thread going.............it's all just a matter of semantics really, nothing serious[:D] it's coinciding with my 'retro' period................ getting lots of blasts from the past here. Will, I'd forgotten about Joe Brown...........and who remembers Georgie Fame[:)] and the mods can't really say it's 'off topic' because it started with the brit awards.[geek]

[cooperlola]

Will, Ollie Reed was often in the Plough at Coldharbour (Surrey) - but "permanent fixture" isn't quite as I'd have described it as he could rarely stand up.

Joe Brown has turned up at the annual Cropredy festival which I've been going to for the last 31 years and he is, as you say, rather good.  Ditto I remember seeing Lonnie Donnegan there.  I was expecting not to enjoy him but he was superb, not least because surrounded by a bunch of really talented young musicians.  However, Procal Harem and the Strawbs - amongst others - who have appeared there, have been truly terrible and encourage one to think that they should give up now, while the going is still good.

Btw, Jools Holland may be on late but that is what video/dvd recorders are for!

[jon]

And you do not have to have an addictive nature to be talented.

I like Amy Winehouses voice...it is not amazing...interests me...at the moment.....but I would be happy if she found the skill to live.Life is a balance of skills and self control.I managed a band and many of my friends were in the music industry but I did not become engaged in the art of taking drugs....                                                                                                                                                                                                                 Not sure what was going on at the Brit awards but it did seem a little unstylish.

If Peter Green had only been more "together" his life would have been a whole lot better.

So the answer to the fundemantal question.......an interesting life....Mrs Osborne..... stronge woman.....but not my role model.

[jon]

Cooperlola.....you seem to like all the artists....on my" do not like list"

Funny how we all like different music.

Any one involved /played with a band.....after the sixties?

[raindog]

Oh God, Joe Brown - I remember seeing him on the telly one Christmas at my aunt and uncle's when I was really small - I was impressed - in fact he was my first guitar hero now I come to think.

Does anyone else get a lump in the throat when they see him do this?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Mu8D69uxA0

Or am I the only big girl's blouse on here? [:D]

[cooperlola]

My point was that I liked Joe Brown and Lonnie Donnegan more than I expected to.  TYA on the other hand I saw several times in the seventies (I used to go out with a guitarist whose hero was Alvin Lee!) on purpose.  Nowadays, I guess I'd put Richard Thompson at or near the top of my "greats" list - a fantastic live performer and one of the best unsung guitarists, imo.  He can sing and write a bit too..

I do find standard 12 bar "pop" music a bit dull in general, but then I always did.

[artsole]

jon, not exactly involved with a band............but something that led to one of my 'magical musical moments'. At the beginning of the 80's, through a friend who worked for a small record label, I got the job to design a poster for a band called the Krayse, they were appearing at the venue in Victoria. Anyway, I got invited to the first gig. At the same time, Marvin Gaye was trying to get away from Tamla............somehow, this small London record label had persuaded him to come to the UK to possibly sign a contract.

On the night of the first gig, he was there, on our table...........a bit out of it on 'coke' but there! Afterwards, we all went to Ronnie Scotts.............on the same evening, Stevie Wonder had been performing at Wembley............and also turned up at Ronnie Scotts.............so there we all were, with the two of them when they decided:/were invited for a jam session on stage..............totally un rehearsed.....................sheer magic[:D] a few months later however, Marvin was dead, killed by his father[:(]