42 days

[Russethouse]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/7446141.stm

Any betting on the outcome of tonights vote ?

Or guesses as to the ramifications for Gordon Brown, if the bill fails ?

[Bugsy]

sorry..............................................who is Gordon Brown ?

 

 

 

 

[:)]

[Gluestick]

If it is anything like the last important debate on knife crime, Russet, when the house was nearly empty  ([:-))]) the WHips will do their work, a few backbenchers will abstain and the idiot MPs will vote as the whips tell 'em without having bothered to either listen to the debate or participate.

 

[Thibault]

Well, now we know.  A government with a 66 seat majority got the Bill through with the help of 9 Democratic Unionist MPs (who'd been bought off with promises of financial aid to Northern Ireland), one conservative and one UKIP MP.  A sort of Pyrrhic victory methinks.

It was interesting to hear the parents of one of the victims of the Underground bombing say how much they supported the Bill when it would not have prevented the July attacks as no-one appeared to suspect any of the bombers and only realised with hindsight that they had filmed some of them as part of general surveillance.

I'm afraid I share the opinion of the Director of Liberty (have't a hope of spelling her name, but you know who I mean) who puts forward a compelling argument for the consequences of this proposal.

 

 

[Gluestick]

Ms Shami Chakrabarti CBE, the Director of Liberty, the Campaign for Civil Rights is a barrister and was a lawyer at the Home Office.  Always confuses me too! Reeta Chakrabarti is the BBC News Correspondent: I become confused between the two.

My take on this is it's simply because the security service and the relevant police agencies have proven pretty hopeless at gathering early evidence of intention: and pretty hopeless afterwards at gathering evidence.

It's a knee jerk, pure and simple.

Why should our system of jurisprudence need far more detention without trial time than even some of the most repressive regimes around the World?

The conclusion is far too obvious to state....................

 

 

 

[Russethouse]

With votes such as this hasn't the current situation where so many MPs are 'career politicians' undermined democracy ?

There are many faults with the system where being an MP also often involved having another job, or an income, but how realistic is it for the electorate to expect MPs to vote against a bill when the result may be that they are put out of work, and have nothing else to fall back on ?

[Gluestick]

Aha, Russet!

The old problem of preferment. I quite agree.

If an MP goes against the Whips, then they are destined forever to occupy the back benches and not have their turn to bury their greedy nose in the trough.

If an MP is a Minister or Sec.of State, then I maintain  - and have done so for years -  that they are no longer capable of fairly representing their electors, since to keep their job, then they must at all times toe the party line.

For a number of years, my MP was the late Paul Channon, who became a  Minister (President of the Board of Trade; Sec. of State for Trade and Industry; and Sec. of State for Transport): he was thereafter incapable of adequate representation.

What perhaps annoys me more than any other facet of current UK politics was typified by the young upstart and whippersnapper, David Milliband (or as an ex politician acquaintance has named him, Comical Milly!), on Sunday whittering about "Democracy"!

Comical Milly and his chums wouldn't recognise democracy if it jumped up and bit them in the butt!