mint Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 This one is English!I have recently noticed that on weather forecasts, both written and spoken, they seem to use "be aware" as in be aware of snowstorms, of icy roads, etc.Now, that sounds a little strange to me and maybe it's because I am mixing up French and English rules and it's not that usual I suppose to juxtapose a word that ends with a vowel with another one that begins with a vowel, at least in French! For example, you would say mon adresse, mon ami, etc.Yes, I do know that these things occur but I seem to be convincing myself that "be aware" should be "beware".I have been musing about this and I asked OH who thinks that "be aware" is just fine and is not exactly the same as "beware".Any experts out there? Any thoughts? What would YOU say for "be careful of impending snowstorms" and so on? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabbie Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 I agree with your OH and think that "be aware" is just fine. The context you quote either "be aware" or "beware" would make sense. I guess it depends on just how bad the conditions are as to which is most appropriate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gluestick Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 Quite agree, mint.A sad fact of life today is the deterioration of English. Should be expressed as "Be aware", followed by (e.g.s) of bumps in the road; there are pickpockets working in this area: politicians invariably lie!" etc.Rather as with the hugely annoying current use (In leading so-called newspapers who really ought to know better!) of writing or saying "I am bored of......" instead of using e.g. "by".My current bête noire, is abuse of the word "Trend" into "Trending".Still when kids up to 40 say "I have texted him!" Pronounced Tex (as in Texan Cowboy) and Ted (as in the diminutive for Edward), I despair......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolybanana Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 bored WITH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gluestick Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 [quote user="woolybanana"]bored WITH[/quote]Ten out of ten, Wooly! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mint Posted January 28, 2015 Author Share Posted January 28, 2015 But I am not bored with or by anything![:)]As for trending, is it any worse than chanelling? In a way, I am not grumbling about all the new-speak because I think the fact that I don't understand it just means that I am desperately out of fashion.No, what I really can't understand is what's happened to the Past Continuous? For example, I was stood there, he was sat at the lights etc instead of I was standing there, he was sitting at the lights..........I find this use very common and very jarring. What I would like to point out is that, if the verb were changed, for example, to "cook", would you say I was cooked instead of I was cooking? Or he was ate instead of he was eating?Also, why do people say "I am good" when you ask them "how are you"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gluestick Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 [quote user="mint"]Also, why do people say "I am good" when you ask them "how are you"?[/quote]Because years ago monosyllabic footballers et al would respond to the idiot with the microphone when asked how they/the team played by saying:"I/We played good!"Our son picked up this habit years back (aping other kids) and when I asked him how his golf went (he was a serious player) and he replied "I played good!"I would respond by saying: "I thought you had been to the gold club and played golf: what is "Good" a new game I am not aware of?"He rapidly comprehended his error........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chancer Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 I believe that "be aware", "beware" and "be wary" all have subtly different meanings although mainly interchangeable depending on the context. "Beware" is almost saying, be frightened of.Similarly in French we have "soyez vigilant" "soyez prudent" "mefiez-vous de....", "soyez conscient", "veillez à" and probably many more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YCCMB Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 [quote user="mint"]But I am not bored with or by anything![:)]As for trending, is it any worse than chanelling? In a way, I am not grumbling about all the new-speak because I think the fact that I don't understand it just means that I am desperately out of fashion.No, what I really can't understand is what's happened to the Past Continuous? For example, I was stood there, he was sat at the lights etc instead of I was standing there, he was sitting at the lights..........I find this use very common and very jarring. What I would like to point out is that, if the verb were changed, for example, to "cook", would you say I was cooked instead of I was cooking? Or he was ate instead of he was eating?Also, why do people say "I am good" when you ask them "how are you"?[/quote]. I am obviously dead common, but also a Boltonian. In my part of the world, we had dispensed with the past continuous long before I even knew what it was, along with other aspects of standard Englush such as subject/verb agreement. Thus, in the vernacular of my birthplace, "I was sitting" is expressed as " I were sat" and indeed he, she and it were also sat. But, of course, " I were going" . We may be common, but we aren't stupid, ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Judith Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 Now, now BettyLet's not confuse nothern English as is spoke on both sides the Pennines (I know it well) with proper English which is what Mint was speaking about. You were nobbut a lad, no doubt, when you learnt to talk proper, but as far as this thread goes, well done, WB, bored WITH definitely.As for Be aware, beware and all the other possibilities so far promulgated ... .. different they are and different FROM, I hope, they remain ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolybanana Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 Welcome ABOARD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idun Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 'Proper' english.............[:D]I wonder what our ancestors would make of 'proper' english, I do believe that many members of the upper echelons of society spoke french or latin then, and the english language was for us 'common' people. I suppose I could say............ 'aah wah sittin'', in a very casual way, because I doubt I would annunicate 'I were', or 'sitting' ...... however, I wouldn't say that. [Www]I don't mind 'be aware'. Not different to any other method of drawing one's attention to possible problems or danger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolybanana Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 Proper English - bad, silly phrase, IMHO, loaded. All Englishes are proper in context but some sort of common language is necessary to be understood by everyone, hence Standard Englishes. The rest is just political posing, local and often introverted interests as opposed to educated and outward ones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YCCMB Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 As I think Wooly is saying, English, as it's not a dead language, is evolving. We may not like that, but it is. Just as it has evolved since its beginnings.. I would imagine Chaucer and Shakespeare would take exception to much of the language and many of the forms and expressions used today, if they could understand them. And all living languages, including French, are the same. To some, it's a gradual erosion of the sacred, to others, it's just an evolution. And to others, it's part of what makes language exciting and fascinating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gardian Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 Black Country: "We'm going to the pub tonight".I'm a southerner BTW, but I loved my time when I worked there. They weren't keen on being thought of as 'Brummies' though! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabbie Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 [quote user="mint"]Also, why do people say "I am good" when you ask them "how are you"?[/quote]Possibly because they are bragging about their moral superiority[:D] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mint Posted January 28, 2015 Author Share Posted January 28, 2015 Actually, I don't much care if people get things "right" or not.What intrigues me is how, it seems to me, all of sudden, absolutely everyone is saying things in a particular way. Like I am good, I was sat and some of the other examples I have already given. I am talking about people in mainstream media and people who are middle-aged or even elderly who would have gone to school at the time of my own school days.What prompted the topic introduction was that I was genuinely flummoxed (there, good old English word) by the "be aware" and I really thought that "beware" was a contraction of the former.So now I know that "beware" and " be aware" have slightly different meanings and I will go and look at some dictionaries.The trendy words like trending, chanelling, totalling, etc I would have difficulty in using. Not because I don't understand them (I am able to work out their meanings OK) but I wouldn't feel confident in using them and I would feel "false" because they are not words that are in my own vocabulary.Just to put the record straight, I was not talking about posh vs common or regional vs received and all the rest of that "stuff" that so exercises language pundits[:)] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gluestick Posted January 29, 2015 Share Posted January 29, 2015 [quote user="mint"]Actually, I don't much care if people get things "right" or not.What intrigues me is how, it seems to me, all of sudden, absolutely everyone is saying things in a particular way. Like I am good, I was sat and some of the other examples I have already given. I am talking about people in mainstream media and people who are middle-aged or even elderly who would have gone to school at the time of my own school days.[/quote]This, mint, has been driven by the mass-media; and their promotion of overnight "Mega Stars" to pinnacles of representational role models. Think illiterate monosyllabic icons such as Wayne Rooney......Plus spotty kids in ad agencies seeking a new whizzy way to brainwash the muppet majority into buying bundles of their intrinsically worthless tat.I have also noticed how people of mature age, having allowed their brain to atrophy whilst absorbing endless moronic soaps, have absorbed, unconsciously, expressions and speech mannerisms without they themselves even realising it. perhaps the very best exemplar being the Ozzy Ocker habit of ending non-question sentences on a rising inflection. Plus, not content with saying "No problem" when asked to do something, now often say "No worries, Mate", instead.There was another component which added to this adulteration back in the 1960s: it was the sudden promotion of Londoners speaking "Mockney", to varying sorts of celebrity status. David Bailey; Lesley Hornby (Twiggie) and etc. Oik, rapidly became the new cool.One remembers the frantic attempts of Nigel Kennedy to become "cool" by turning his back on the style of his parents and instead, become, a right on dude. His mentor, the late great Yehudi Menuhin was not amused: and perhaps if Kennedy had focused more on his studies he would have achieved the reputation Menuhin knew was possible. The evolution of language; it's a living thing; it develops etc, etc.Sadly, indeed it does; badly!Written English changed little from the time of Dickens, say. Its rate of change, for the worse, has been since the 1960s, gradual. Until the mass media were allowed to dominate a majority's lives.In the South of England, now, kids speak a sort of patois (Estuarine English); which is an unhappy meld of Mockney; Afro-Caribbean street, jive, druggy speek, gangstah; Ocker; pop culture; keep on going.The primary purpose of any language is to communicate: increasingly I am unable to comprehend what kids are talking about: bit of a problem when they are serving (well, pretending to) in a pub, shop, whatever. In similar fashion, I cannot understand the patois spoken by the oldsters in our commune in Northern France: neither can the, well educated, French youngsters I know, locally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soupagirl Posted January 29, 2015 Share Posted January 29, 2015 OOOOOOh - 'all of a sudden' ! OH and I were having a discussion about this phrase just yesterday, we both remember being in trouble at school for using 'all of a sudden' instead of 'suddenly' . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mint Posted January 29, 2015 Author Share Posted January 29, 2015 [quote user="soupagirl"]OOOOOOh - 'all of a sudden' ! OH and I were having a discussion about this phrase just yesterday, we both remember being in trouble at school for using 'all of a sudden' instead of 'suddenly' .[/quote]I think, however, that all of a sudden is not quite so quick as suddenly?[:D]Gluey, I also have a bit of a problem keeping up with the latest expressions because I have now been in France for nigh on 8 years with only one single trip lasting about 10 days back to the UK. The only person I speak English to is OH and he is Welsh!I have infrequent and sporadic conversations with the other two English-speaking families in our village.I speak even less English to the only other English speaker in French class because, naturally, we are encouraged to parler en français! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idun Posted January 29, 2015 Share Posted January 29, 2015 I have been thinking about this and I reckon that the very first time I was confronted with this 'silly' way of speaking was when I was back in England on holiday and saw Drop the Dead Donkey for the very first time. I loved the whole program, but 'Gus', just made me howl with laughter......... and living in France and only french tv........... ofcourse then, no satellite tv or internet, naievely I sort of thought that it was an exaggeration of what the yuppies were saying, because I had heard of them. I don't think it was an exaggeration, sadly these words and expressions that make little sense to me were part of current english. And yet I like languages 'living', but this doesn't feel like that. You can add to this list, such nonsense as having 'years' for children at school, year 10, give me strength, and WHY, not as if redoubling is 'current' in the UK. I have to ask, which school ie secondary, primary etc and which year of your education in that school. AND Human Ressources, and yes, even France started saying that too........ what I have noticed is that the old Personnel staff seemed to be rather better at finding the right staff for the job, than these human ressources types.In fact many 'new' expressions and words have come in for every day things since I left the UK and most drive me mad as there was nothing wrong with what was being said in the first place and as I said, I like a living language, I just don't like some power mad idiot changing stuff for the sake of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YCCMB Posted January 29, 2015 Share Posted January 29, 2015 Etymologically speaking, words don't find their way into dictionaries until they have found their way into spoken vocabulary and are seen to be, or felt to be part of the way English is being used. To quote the Oxford dictionaries website:In previous centuries dictionaries tended to contain lists of words that their writers thought might be useful, even if there was no evidence that anyone had ever actually used these words. This is not the case today. New terms have to be recorded in a print or online source before they can be considered: it's not enough just to hear them in conversation or on television, although we do analyse material from Internet message boards and TV scripts.Thus, to pick up on an earlier example mentioned, the OED gives credence to the verb "to text", which may jar with some, but is a perfectly acceptable way of referring to an activity which, after all, has only come into existence in the last 20 years or so. Similarly, the noun and verb "tweet" are defined as both the sound made by a bird and the action of making it, and the posting of a message on Twitter.Much is often made of the way the word "gay" has changed its connotation over time. I commend the following Oxford dictionary entry to you, whilst wondering how many of you would even have known that it's use as a perjorative term (much as we may once have used "naff" ) has passed in and out of fashion over the last 10 years:http://www.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/english/gayBy the way..."gay", it is acknowledged,, began to be widely used as a term for homosexual in the early 20th century. I am surprised that poor Wayne Rooney has been slighted for his perceived influence on the decline in standards of English. Does this mean people have actually heard him speak?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gardengirl Posted January 29, 2015 Share Posted January 29, 2015 A lot of what has been written matches my feelings about the English language, with so-called mockery etc. The Australian way of lifting at the end of a sentence as if asking a question seems to be passing slowly.But something else has arrived over the last couple of years,; when being interviewed or being asked a question on a programme, so many people begin with 'So'......... I realise it gives thinking time, but I much prefer something like 'well' or of course' for thinking time if people can't launch straight in to speaking about the reason they are there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mint Posted January 29, 2015 Author Share Posted January 29, 2015 Funny you should say that about "so", GG.I taught some Italian teenagers in summer schools and I noticed that, when asked to say something to the class in English, they ALL, to a person, started with alora. I imagine now, as I speak a bit of French, that that must be the equivalent of alors?It seems to me that all young and youngish people, when asked questions on TV, always start with "yeah".............So............"yeah, I played very well", "yeah, I liked the visit", "yeah, it wasn't a problem" Must just be a cool (or whatever the current term is) way to answer! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YCCMB Posted January 29, 2015 Share Posted January 29, 2015 Thing is, we all have a verbal "tic" of some sort and mostly we are blissfully ignorant of it. If you've ever been subjected to the horror that is being filmed whilst on a training course, or being trained in presentation skills, I'm sure you will have been surprised to find that you repeat a certain word or phrase rather more often than is necessary.If you would like to see something quite amusing in this vein, watch this clip...start at about 13'30 and persevere..https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=2s7hkd_r9po Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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