CAN WE LAGALY BACK OUT!!!!!!

[stewart]

Hello all,

We found our dream barn in november of last year, agreed the asking price the same weekend with the english guy who ownes it (wasn't through an agent) and happily returned to the uk to plan the conversion of the place.

By January we had an appointment at the notaires to sign the compromis, we forwarded the 10% deposit to the notaire, went over and signed a month later.

Completion was originaly set for March, then April, May, June, July, August, and each time we had excuses from the seller, emailed, wrote and phoned the notaire but either get no reply or fobbed off. The seller is now not returning any calls or mail, but originaly kept in touch regularly and was helpful, (erm, until we paid deposit) and still no joy from the notaire.

Now I know I should put my French head on and just chill out, things take ages in France, but my English head is getting suspicious!!!

So, my question is, is it possable to pull out at this stage and get my deposit back? or are we legaly bound to hang around for the next 5 years in the hope it does?

Any advice would be gratefully received,

Micky

[Chezstevens]

Should have been sorted out 3 months after siganture. Suggest you employ a Notaire in England, if your french is weak, to sort it out. Depends what you signed.

[Nick Trollope]

Can't honestly recommend using a Notaire in the UK (if there are any). But you should engage another Notaire in France, won't cost anything (they share the fees). As a start, write a letter (recorded delivery) to both the Vendor and the Notaire, giving (say) 2 months for the sale to be completed and threatening to claim your deposit and the 10% penalty.

Best done in person (not by email), though - a visit will usually unstick these things.

 

[Jc]

There are some French notaires in the UK;usually French people who have moved here for marriage or other reasons and have kept up their qualifications etc..

[Deimos]

You say you sent the 10% deposit then signed the Compromis a month later ? (i.e. deposit before anything had been signed ?

Also, when you signed the Compromis, had the vendor also signed it as well (i.e. does your copy have both your own and the vendors signature ?

Ian

[Will]

I'm a bit suspicious too. Not only about paying the deposit before signing the compromis de vente, but also the fact that you were persuaded to sign in person - it is rather more usual to get the seller's signatures, then send it to the buyer, who then has the opportunity to get it checked out by their legal advisors before signing and returning it, and then there is a further period of seven days before it becomes legally binding on the buyer - sellers have the same legal obligations, apart from the seven day 'cooling off' period which doesn't apply to them. It seems as though the seller may have something to hide, aside from the long delays.

Remember that in a French property transaction, the notaire is an impartial lawyer who represents the government rather than buyer or seller, and whose duty is to register the sale and ensure all taxes are paid and legal objections are met. Although many are helpful to buyers who may not be familiar with the process, their function is not to give legal advice. However, they are supposed to answer any specific questions. So your next stage should be to approach the notaire and say you are not satisfied with the seller's delays and suggest that unless the sale can be completed in a certain time, you will pull out, and expect not only the return of your deposit but a 10% penalty from the seller (to which you should be entitled).

You would be well advised to find a bilingual lawyer who knows French property law - several advertise in the magazines, who can give advice, write the necessary letters etc. Not a second notaire - I don't think there is much to be gained from that, unless you mistrust the first, and you need somebody to specifically represent your interests.

It's often said on these forums that agents are not necessary, but this demonstrates a few of the pitfalls of private sales: a decent agent would not allow things to get to this stage, it is in their interests for the sale to complete otherwise they get no fee.

[Will]

Another thing - as it is a barn, did you ask for a clause suspensive in the compromis making the sale subject to a positive CU (i.e. permission for conversion)? It's not uncommon for people to sell barns for which pêrmission has already been refused on the private market, as they know an agent will not touch it, and an unsuspecting buyer might just bite...

Or if such a clause was included, maybe the delay is down to waiting for the CU to be granted.