hstraf Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 Hello,I have a single sentence text that I need to be translated from English into French. The lowest quote I received from a professional translator was $75.That seems a bit high for one sentence... so I'm wondering if there's anyone here who could do it for less?Basically.... it just needs to be in "proper" French. Otherwise, I would use google translate to do it.Here is what I need:----------------------To whom it may concern,This letter is to authorize my wife, [her name will be here], to travel without me with any of our children listed:[children will listed here]Sincerely,[my name will be here]----------------------Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idun Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 The sortie de terratoire from France is only necessary if the children are travelling alone. Why would you wife need your permission to travel with her children?From http://vosdroits.service-public.fr/F1922.xhtml Si l'enfant voyage avec l'un de ses parents If a child is travelling with just one parentL'enfant qui voyage avec l'un de ses parents (ou une personne titulaire de l'autorité parentale or someone with parental authority) doit posséder l'un des documents suivants : the child must have the following documentssoit un passeport individuel (qui peut être obtenu pour tout mineur, même un bébé) either an individual passportsoit une carte nationale d'identité pour les pays de l'Union européenne et la Suisse. or a national ID cardDans ce cas, les autorités douanières peuvent exiger un document prouvant que l'accompagnant est bien le parent (livret de famille ou acte de naissance par exemple). Customs and passport control can demand proof of the parent's relationship to the child, ie livret de famille OR birth certificate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pachapapa Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 There exists no need in france for such a document to be drawn up in france as either parent in exercise of the parental authority can travel outside france with a child or children.The Civil Code in Article 372 succinctly details the conjoint rights of the parents.http://www.legifrance.gouv.fr/affichCodeArticle.do;jsessionid=F73455CB11EE5C431F776B44383438B7.tpdjo16v_1?idArticle=LEGIARTI000006426490&cidTexte=LEGITEXT000006070721&dateTexte=20110510However it is worth noting that if the child or children travel without being accompanied by at least one of the parents then a specific document will be drawn up promptly at the local mairie, only one of the parents need sign the pro forma authorisation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pachapapa Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 Observation until the late 80s I enjoyed sole "patria potestas" over the foreign travel of children. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idun Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 Custody? or just lived in some country where medieval rules about women being lower in the order of things, than donkeys? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabbie Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 [quote user="pachapapa"]Observation until the late 80s I enjoyed sole "patria potestas" over the foreign travel of children.[/quote]At least there has been progress since then Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pachapapa Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 [quote user="idun"]Custody? or just lived in some country where medieval rules about women being lower in the order of things, than donkeys?[/quote]Yes that's right.In Argentina, joint custody was established in 1949 by constitutional amendment this year. The repeal of these reforms by military proclamation in 1956, and ratification of its repeal by the Constitutional Convention of 1957, restored the inequality of women compared with men for several decades. In 1974 Congress re-established joint custody, but the President Maria Estela Martinez de Peron vetoed the bill. Basically, the influential conservative sectors in Argentina argued that the family unit requires that a spouse has the "last word", and that cultural and traditional reasons, it was reasonable that this power was attributed by law to men.In 1985, during Alfonsin's government was restored joint custody by Law 23,234, a right long-demanded by women;Note the veto exercised by a lady donkey called maria;[6] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idun Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 Ah, that explains it. How 'nice' that a woman insisted that men should have the last word.May she rot! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allanb Posted July 12, 2011 Share Posted July 12, 2011 I don't think anyone has actually responded to your request yet. I hope I'm not inventing difficulties, but...It seems that you must be dealing with a country which uses French as its administrative language, but which has archaic laws about freedom of travel for women. There are many people on the forum who could write a simple translation in standard French, but I suspect that you need not just standard French, but French which will satisfy the rules written in that country for people like policemen and immigration officers. You don't want your wife to be detained at a border control because somebody chose the wrong word.Is there any official you could ask to give you a sample? If you need to make such a request in French, here is a suggestion:Pourriez-vous me fournir le texte d'une déclaration de ma part qui permettrait à mon épouse de voyager, seule ou avec nos enfants, sans que je l'accompagne? If you want to take a chance on a plain French statement, the following might work. (I don't think you need to bother with "to whom it may concern" or "sincerely", which are purely conventional.)Par la présente j'autorise mon épouse Madame [...] à voyager, ou bien seule, ou bien accompagnée d'un ou plusieurs des enfants nommés ci-dessous:[names of children] Of course this is written without any knowledge of the relevant regulations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suein56 Posted July 12, 2011 Share Posted July 12, 2011 [quote user="allanb"]I don't think you need to bother with "to whom it may concern" or "sincerely", which are purely conventional. [/quote]In case you do need to add ' to whom it may concern' our notaire put: ' à qui de droit ' at the top of a document he did for us.Sue Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hstraf Posted July 14, 2011 Author Share Posted July 14, 2011 [quote user="allanb"]If you want to take a chance on a plain French statement, the following might work. (I don't think you need to bother with "to whom it may concern" or "sincerely", which are purely conventional.)Par la présente j'autorise mon épouse Madame [...] à voyager, ou bien seule, ou bien accompagnée d'un ou plusieurs des enfants nommés ci-dessous: names of children][/quote]Thanks very much! This is for travel to and from various French-speaking countries... (mostly France).I fully understand that French law says my wife can travel alone with our children. However, from experience, we have found not every "functionnaire" is fully informed about the law. :)Thus, from experience, we have decided it would be better for her to travel with a simple letter giving her my "permission" to travel with the kids.Yes, I do realize she could contact the appropriate authorities and have them look up the relevant law, etc... but hey.. why bother when a simple letter will "fix" the problem in 10 seconds if she is ever asked for one again?We all know the French love their beauracracy, regardless of whether they are right or wrong. If the person asking for the letter wants a letter with my permission... presto.. now she can provide it. Problem solved with no need to complicate things by calling the police and/or an advocate.. causing her and the kids to miss their flight (again). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idun Posted July 15, 2011 Share Posted July 15, 2011 No, I'm sorry but that is WRONG. In France that is not the case. My sons were born in France in 1982 and 1984 and once they were toddlers I frequently travelled alone with my sons.Never ever was any suggestion made that I needed permission to travel with MY children and I would never have given a thought to possible discrimination. Woe betide anyone who had even inferred that I needed permission, permission from my husband, you are joking! In fact if he had ever given me such a paper, I am just trying to think what I would have done with it, but something terrible to it and to him. I am enraged that you are implying that your wife is singled out as being unfit /unable to be allowed to travel with her own children. This is disgusting and disgraceful.I'll tell you something, if ever I saw a woman being treat in such a fashion by any official in France then I would intervene, I really would.And don't sound so cheery as if this is a good thing. it isn't, it is repugnant and insulting to women. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EuroTrash Posted July 15, 2011 Share Posted July 15, 2011 I don't see how a 'letter' will achieve anything apart from possibly arouse suspicions - she could have written it herself. Anyone can write a letter (with a little help from a forum) and sign with someone else's name. Unless it is rubberstamped by somebody like your maire or a notaire, who would probably find it a strange request. I would be very surprised if any 21st century fonctionnaire would question a woman travelling with her own children. What if the mother was a widow, or divorced, or not married, she could never go anywhere! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allanb Posted July 15, 2011 Share Posted July 15, 2011 [quote user="hstraf"]This is for travel to and from various French-speaking countries... (mostly France).[/quote]If my suggestion helps, I'm happy. But I'm perplexed by what you say about France. I thought that your wife must be preparing for travel in one of the Asian or African countries where French is an administrative language. I know that in some countries such a letter is an absolute necessity; but I'd be amazed if it was needed anywhere in Europe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russethouse Posted July 15, 2011 Share Posted July 15, 2011 Perhaps it would help if the OP explains the incident that makes him thinks such a letter would be an advantage ?Frankly I can't think of one incidence of this being a problem coming up on the forum over 10 years - Unless there are custody issues that the OP hasn't mentioned and 'officialdom' would be aware of, it seems quite pointless.The OP refers to 'our' children. Are we correct in assuming the wife is the childrens natural mother ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pachapapa Posted July 15, 2011 Share Posted July 15, 2011 ...French love their beauracracy...I have trouble with beauracracy as well.It's a fiendishly difficult word to spell.[:-))] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoddy Posted July 15, 2011 Share Posted July 15, 2011 I can't see where the problem lies. My daughter travels here regularly with her two children who have different surnames from her. It has only ever been mentioned once and that was at the English end and she just explained that she was divorced.Hoddy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cat Posted July 15, 2011 Share Posted July 15, 2011 I've noticed in another post by hstraf that he is French, but his wife is American, I don't know if the problem lies there? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cjlaws Posted July 15, 2011 Share Posted July 15, 2011 [quote user="Cat"]I've noticed in another post by hstraf that he is French, but his wife is American, I don't know if the problem lies there?[/quote]If he is French, why should he be asking for an English to French translation? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hstraf Posted July 15, 2011 Author Share Posted July 15, 2011 [quote user="Russethouse"]Perhaps it would help if the OP explains the incident that makes him thinks such a letter would be an advantage [/quote]Certainly.First, yes.. I am French (Canadian by birth, but also French because my Father was French), and my wife is also French (American by birth, but also French because she is married to me and applied for citizenship).We have lived in France for the previous 5 years. We did not speak French before moving to France.So... my wife went to North America to visit family, with the kids. (Two were born in France, and the other in Canada.)When she returned to France, she was questioned by the French immigration authorities. She had French passports for everyone, including her Carte d'identie, etc...And she was told that, "It might be a good idea to travel with a letter of permission from your husband, to show you are allowed to travel with the children out of the country".I actually received a phone call from some guy at the airport asking if my wife had permission to travel with my children.So ya. This happens. It shouldn't. Of course not. The whole thing was rediculous and absolutely insane. I can only imagine the "reason" might have been the oddity of my wife's broken French and three kids with French passports... .. but whatever the reason, it happened. So... to avoid the situation again in the future, I figured I'd take 10 minutes and get a translation for a letter she can keep with her when she travels with the kids alone. It seems a lot easier to comply with this "suggestion", rather then her making a big deal and trying to point out the law and her rights and whatever to the immigration/customs officers.Believe me, nobody was as pissed off as I was when she got home and told me why I received this phone call. I went straight to our mairie and told him what happened. Unfortunately, there was no paperwork given to her to show the name of the officer who questioned her and called me. We even tried tracing the phone call I received, but it wen to some switchboard at the airport and could not be tied down to any particular officer who made the call.So.. somewhere in the immigration/customs office in Paris there works a functionaire who obviously has no idea that it's perfectly ok for a woman to travel with her kids.. without her husbands written consent.(And just to lighten the mood a bit... we've had many good laughs about this whole incident. I often have tried to tell my wife she must also have my permission to leave the house, drive the car, etc. So far she seems intent on doing her own thing without my permission, and I'm still trying to find out to whom I should report such direct flaunting of my absolute authority.):) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idun Posted July 15, 2011 Share Posted July 15, 2011 D.C.P.A.F (Direction Centrale Police Aux Frontières)Administrations de l'intérieur100 rue du Four - 94550 Rungis Complexetéléphone : Work+(0033) (0)15 670 1978These are the people who deal with passport control at the airports. I would get in touch with them and complain and ask for a letter from them to stop this happening in future. Rather than playing to the tune of some fonctionnaire who does not know their job.I personally would also get in touch with my deputé.I would also get in touch with the american embassy and complain bitterly too, but that is just me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob Roy Posted August 11, 2011 Share Posted August 11, 2011 Personally I don't think it was an entirely unreasonable suggestion. Surely it's better to be sure the children should be with the adult in charge of them (whether male or female), if there seems to be any anomaly, than just accept it's all right? I would not object to carrying a letter from my husband if I was travelling alone with our children (not that they are young any longer); I would also expect him to do the same. Don't forget children can be abducted or taken overseas illegally and passports can be forged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nomoss Posted August 11, 2011 Share Posted August 11, 2011 Good God! Someone asks for some simple help with a translation and you lot want his life history. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allanb Posted August 11, 2011 Share Posted August 11, 2011 [quote user="idun"]I would get in touch with them and complain and ask for a letter from them to stop this happening in future. Rather than playing to the tune of some fonctionnaire who does not know their job.I personally would also get in touch with my deputé.I would also get in touch with the american embassy and complain bitterly too...[/quote]Well, I might do all of those things also. But in the meantime, if I could avoid problems for my wife by providing her with a letter, I would try to provide her with the letter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyinfrance Posted August 12, 2011 Share Posted August 12, 2011 About nine years ago my wife and I took two of our godchildren from England to Disney in Paris via Eurotunnel - they would have been 6 or 7 at that time. Since we had not taken them out of the country before we asked the two sets of parents to give us a letter of authority just in case - to be honest I can't remember the details now but I know we got there and back with no problems at all even though all of us in the car had different names (my wife uses her maiden name).We are not parents ourselves so we were initiated with a lengthy "are we nearly there yet" chorus but it was worth it as the girls had no idea where they were going til we arrived at Disney's gates - absolutely priceless! And almost a decade later they still talk about it...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.