aileenanddave Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 We have lived here in France for 13 years and are extremely happy, With the increasing chatter in UK about withdrawing from the EU, we fear for our UK pensions and their translation into euros; What are the considered advantages/disadvantages of taking French Nationality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idun Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 You'd be able to vote and IF they ever start conscription again, maybe you'd have to do that! You'd have to have your finger prints taken to get your french id card too.I don't know how it would protect your UK pension though. I must admit that the thought that the french pension would stop, would need careful consideration about moving back to France for us, or another EU country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NormanH Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 You can take double nationality, and in that case I can't see any disadvantages since you can keep both.On the other hand I don't think that has any bearing on UK pensions and exchange rates... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulT Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 People who have relocated to the US, Australia etc, which are not part of the EU still get their UK pensions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idun Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 I do believe that those living in the US or Australia's UK pensions are frozen though and they do not get the rises. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnOther Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 I think entitlement to health care would be a far greater concern than pension continuity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NormanH Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 I still can't see any link between taking French Nationality, and either pensions or healthcare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolybanana Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 To put my large feet in it, why would anyone want to take French nationality? What possible advantages are there? If the UK does leave the EU your rights will be protected. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YCCMB Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 "We fear for our UK pensions and their translation into Euros"Having lived in France for the last 13 years, you will have seen the £|€ exchange rate fluctuate from around 1.48 to almost parity.How/what would you expect to change by taking French nationality? It's not as if the UK will refuse to pay your pension, or that France will refuse to let you import it. I'm baffled as to how or why you have concluded that taking French nationality will solve any perceived problems. It's not as if, by becoming French, you're going to gain access to an alternative pension. On the contrary, would perhaps worry that, if you only have a pension to rely on, you may even find your application rejected on the grounds that you have insufficient means not to be a burden on the French state.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabbie Posted January 8, 2015 Share Posted January 8, 2015 [quote user="woolybanana"]To put my large feet in it, why would anyone want to take French nationality? What possible advantages are there? If the UK does leave the EU your rights will be protected.[/quote]Since the terms of any possible UK exit from the EU are not yet defined how can you or anyone else know what protection will be in place. I somehow doubt that the position of ex-pats will rank high with either the politicians or the electorate as a whole Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quillan Posted January 8, 2015 Share Posted January 8, 2015 [quote user="Rabbie"][quote user="woolybanana"]To put my large feet in it, why would anyone want to take French nationality? What possible advantages are there? If the UK does leave the EU your rights will be protected.[/quote]Since the terms of any possible UK exit from the EU are not yet defined how can you or anyone else know what protection will be in place. I somehow doubt that the position of ex-pats will rank high with either the politicians or the electorate as a whole[/quote]I know of at least three people who are in the process of taking French citizenship (you only need one of the family/couple to apply) and the reason why is exactly what you said, nobody knows. They see it as covering all bases for the future. I cannot see that it would affect anything financial in reference to pensions or moving money. The only thing that might change is if you are drawing a UK state pension and are in the French healthcare system under the old E121 or S1 as it is now called. Both these forms are/were EU forms and used in all EU countries so are not unique to just the UK. The UK leaving the EU would mean this arrangement might end (I would guess defiantly if Ukip ever won the election). Please note I have deliberately used the word 'might' because as you say nobody knows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NormanH Posted January 8, 2015 Share Posted January 8, 2015 The UK leaving the EU would mean this arrangement might end (I would guess defiantly if Ukip ever won the election). Please note I have deliberately used the word 'might' because as you say nobody knows.But, yet again, why mix up taking French nationality and the UK leaving the EU?Having French nationality doesn't guarantee health care which depends on paying into the system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quillan Posted January 8, 2015 Share Posted January 8, 2015 [quote user="NormanH"]The UK leaving the EU would mean this arrangement might end (I would guess defiantly if Ukip ever won the election). Please note I have deliberately used the word 'might' because as you say nobody knows.But, yet again, why mix up taking French nationality and the UK leaving the EU?Having French nationality doesn't guarantee health care which depends on paying into the system.[/quote]Well the people I know are great believers in the EU, don't want the UK to leave and also believe that eventually it will become a federal country in its own right. In short they would rather be a part of the EU and as they live in France why not become French then they are an EU citizen by default even if the UK leaves. For them it is nothing to do with money or health care etc. it is about being part of the EU. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YCCMB Posted January 8, 2015 Share Posted January 8, 2015 "If UKIP win the election" .??????No, really, they may win a few seats, I concede, but what constitutes winning the election? I was always under the impression that this meant winning a working majority of seats in Parliament, and however we look at it, what are the chances of that? Why, I do t think they will even be able to rustle up enough actual candidates for that to happen! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idun Posted January 8, 2015 Share Posted January 8, 2015 I really do ponder what we would do if there were great changes afoot. We are so esconced in the french system that a move back really could end up being on the cards. The other alternative being Ireland, I would imagine it would remain in the EU, so that link would be there and there is still a sort of special relationship with the UK. You see, I do consider it all, but in ALL our years in France, we never ever considered taking french nationality. Frankly, I could never justify doing that. IF an awful lot of France has rubbed off on me, an unbelievable amount has, then I still will never be french, deep down, my nature is not french..............and that would have great importance to me. IF I took that step to take another nationality, then I would have to embrace it completely. I know that I could have dual nationality, but it would have to be far more than 'just' doing it, I would take it very seriously out of respect for the country that was adopting me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lindal1000 Posted January 8, 2015 Share Posted January 8, 2015 We've talked about my partner taking French nationality if Britain leaves the EU. He lived in France for 16 years before this time and says he feels as much French as he does English. He worked in France and is fluent in the language. I probably feel more British than French, but that said I've never really felt 'typically' British. For me I could happily take dual nationality. I nearly applied for Canadian citizenship when I was younger and lived there, but then decided I couldn't wait out the 5 years of residency. Healthcare is guaranteed to all French citizens via the CMU. If your income is under 10000 euros PA it costs you nothing..so becoming French would ensure you had the same access to healthcare as every other French person. I also think I would feel very differently if I had children who were born here and would be considering taking French nationality sooner and much more seriously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NormanH Posted January 8, 2015 Share Posted January 8, 2015 Healthcare is guaranteed to all French citizens via the CMU.No it isn't. 1) The majority have health care as a result of paying côtisations to one of the many régimes.2) You don't have to be a French citizen to get the CMU. You have to fulfill these conditions: Les conditions d’accès Pour bénéficier de la CMU de base il faut remplir trois conditions : 1- Résider en France de manière régulière Il faut avoir la nationalité française ou être titulaire d’un titre de séjour ou avoir entamé des démarches pour obtenir un titre de séjour. Pour en savoir en savoir plus sur la condition de résidence régulière, cliquez ici 2- Résider en France de manière stable Il faut vivre en France métropolitaine ou dans un département d'outre-mer de manière ininterrompue depuis au moins trois mois. Il existe des cas particuliers, pour en savoir plus sur la condition de résidence stable, cliquez ici 3- Ne pas avoir droit à l’assurance maladie Vous êtes concerné par la CMU de base uniquement s’il n’existe pas d’autres possibilités pour vous et les membres de votre foyer de bénéficier d’une couverture maladie de base. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quillan Posted January 8, 2015 Share Posted January 8, 2015 So Norman as an expert you are stating that if the UK were to leave the EU it would make absolutely no difference to any Brit living in France and in particular to their current healthcare provisions? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idun Posted January 8, 2015 Share Posted January 8, 2015 There are specific rules about children born in France to foreign parents getting (or not taking) french nationality. They have to be resident for five full years between the ages of 11 and 18. And even if they have been, the authorities want lots of proof about their current nationality and proof of residence.Which reminds me, to the OP, our Tribunal d'Instance wanted proof of being a british citizen with the right of abode in the UK and that little paper cost about £60 from the consulate, no idea how much it costs now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lindal1000 Posted January 8, 2015 Share Posted January 8, 2015 Well the first point being that to access CMU you have to either be French or have the right to stay. An exit from the EU may well mean that Non French citizens loose their right to residence and hence their right to CMU. I know plenty of people who access healthcare in France via CMU and earn well under 10000 euros pa and hence pay nothing. Some have paid very little into the system.The other conditions would surely be easy for any citizen to fulfil.. just a permanent address for three months. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lindal1000 Posted January 8, 2015 Share Posted January 8, 2015 [quote user="idun"]There are specific rules about children born in France to foreign parents getting (or not taking) french nationality. They have to be resident for five full years between the ages of 11 and 18. And even if they have been, the authorities want lots of proof about their current nationality and proof of residence.Which reminds me, to the OP, our Tribunal d'Instance wanted proof of being a british citizen with the right of abode in the UK and that little paper cost about £60 from the consulate, no idea how much it costs now.[/quote]Why if I had kids I might be more keen to apply for citizenship sooner rather than later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NormanH Posted January 8, 2015 Share Posted January 8, 2015 [quote user="Quillan"]So Norman as an expert you are stating that if the UK were to leave the EU it would make absolutely no difference to any Brit living in France and in particular to their current healthcare provisions?[/quote]I did not say thatThis thread is about taking French nationality, however much people try to hijack it to be about leaving the EU.Of course people on S1s may be affected if the UK leaves , but taking French nationality in itself wouldn't change anything.Those who are here legally could go on to the CMU without taking nationality...The most that is likely to happen would be a demand that they get a carte de séjour ( as used to be the case and still is for non-EU nationals) La régularité de la résidence Cette condition est exigée des personnes de nationalité étrangère non ressortissante de l’Union européenne ou de l’Espace économique européen. Le demandeur et les personnes majeures à charge doivent posséder un titre de séjour ou attester qu’ils ont déposé un dossier de demande d’un titre de séjour (récépissé de dépôt de demande, convocation ou rendez-vous en préfecture…).In other words if the S1 system were no longer valid those who are here legally already could go onto the CMU de base if under the thresh-hold or the paying version if over it whether or not they have French Nationality Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YCCMB Posted January 8, 2015 Share Posted January 8, 2015 [quote user="idun"]There are specific rules about children born in France to foreign parents getting (or not taking) french nationality. They have to be resident for five full years between the ages of 11 and 18. And even if they have been, the authorities want lots of proof about their current nationality and proof of residence.Which reminds me, to the OP, our Tribunal d'Instance wanted proof of being a british citizen with the right of abode in the UK and that little paper cost about £60 from the consulate, no idea how much it costs now.[/quote]I have a secondhand experience of this through good friends (Dutch) in France, whose youngest son was born in France and had lived there all his life (they've been in France themselves for nearly 40 years). He was labouring under the misconception that he was Dutch, as are his siblings (born in Holland) until the Gendarmes turned up one day to find out why he hadn't turned up to do his "trois jours" prior to national service. He protested that he wasn't French, but the authorities had a different view, and yes, he did end up doing his French military service. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idun Posted January 9, 2015 Share Posted January 9, 2015 Yes Betty, anyone non french who has children in France should look into nationality, as you said, they could get into trouble and get arrested. There was a case a few years ago of a young man working at the Eurostar terminal in Folkestone and the gendarmes arrested him for not doing his national service. IF memory serves, (but may not) he was facing real jail time, in spite of not knowing.In this case, the young man you mentioned Betty, was french d'office and should have done gone to his tribunal d'instance and sorted it all out by the age of 19 if not earlier. He then could have said, oui, I want to be french, or non, I don't. Now he does not have a choice. So he has dual nationality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YCCMB Posted January 9, 2015 Share Posted January 9, 2015 He's about 38 now, Idun, and French as French can be, with a French wife and kids. But, unusually for a Frenchman, he speaks fluent Dutch? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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