Recent ruling for Chambres D'Hôtes

[Miki]

According to the Senat, the case has been ruled in favour that CdH's

are not hotels and now must stay strictly within the guidelines and not

act in a hotel like manner. That's a pretty long bit of string to go by

eh, generally it is talking among other things, as meaning services,

such as serving drinks and food at all times of the day,which are not really allowed

in a CdH. Plus in a C de H offering a choice of menu and different

wines is interdit, talking of which, wine MUST be offered in the one

price, also coffee as well, and again, all in the prix du repas du soir

They also state that one must now always register at the Impôts as a CdH and also one is obliged to inform the Mairie.

The good thing for some, will be that for the moment, there is no

obligatory  reason to register at the Ch de Comm. The old rule

of  thumb still exists and that is, it will depend on how some

dept see your "commerce". If it does make up a high percentage of your

income, it can be seen as your actual travail, thus the nice people who

collect cotisations will want you to be registered at the Ch de Comm so

they can get an even bigger share of your earnings !!

There have been a few cases where this has happened, sometimes the C de

Com themselves have demanded inscripition, sometimes the Impôts people,

in many cases, it can be sensible not to offer too much info and to

just tell the Impots what you are doing and..............leave.

Now you might think that is my advice, well to a point yes, I

have advised a few (some on here even) along similar lines but in this

instant, this has come from a French B&B forum !!

[Quillan]

Do you think this has anything to do with recent court cases which in a way deregulated Chambres D'hôtes by making the two government/Tourist Office organisations release their hold over their members? I am wondering if as far as regulating CDH's one door closes but another opens with regards to the govenment ensuring they get some income from owners.

[Gastines]

Having been down this road a few times with many differing answers, we made a point ,this year , of trying to find out what was 'Obligatory' and what wasn't, we made a visit to the C.d.C. in St.Malo and pointed out that, according to 95 % of the members of G.d.F. and various other bodies, it was not obligatory to register with them. Having made several phone calls and once again producing the papers from Paris saying if you provide ANY cleaning/linen/breakfast services, it was Obligatory to register. When we pointed out that it was not our main income, we were told that did not make any difference!!

So we registered.

The main grouse of many members on here and AI seems to be the extra cotisations.Surely if you are resident here, in the health and tax system, the extra's you have to pay are negligible for registering? Apart from the extra cover you get, we have found the C.d.C. quite helpfull and when we de-registered at the end of last season, they advise all the necessary persons who automatically and very promptly correct payments and pay any refunds if  entitled.

It would appear to me ,that while you have money tied up in a property ,it might be wiser to try and toe the line rather than keep trying to dodge the issues. If you fall foul of the powers that be,I don't think they pussyfoot around like they do in UK.

It does appear that different area's interpretation of the rules is done to suit  and I can only conclude it depends on the amount of  Hotels and registered C.d'Hs around you and if you are in a busy tourist area.Similarly we have to note all visitors addresses and pay a daily visitors tax in a ledger sent by the Mairie,apparently this doesn't apply in many other regions.

On that long note I'll get back to perfecting my hospital corners.

Regards.B&B.St.Malo.

[Miki]

The C d H Vs Hotel Vs Camping is a long standing debate that

swings one way and another.

 The Hotel body, in time of any decrease in clients, demand that government

look at the way B&B’s are run, in turn the camping (hire of vans etc) also demand

that B&B’s are more regulated and will often try and insist that all

B&B’s must be registered, giving an even playing field.

 Thanks go to G de Fr whose very existence and how it was

arrived at has been noted many times, so I won’t go over old ground, suffice to

say, their main membership was once Agricole etc and still many are with them

as well as new members from within that type of field. Now, many of them earn a

nice few bob in their main field, thus their main income is not B&B, so NO

need to register. Some of the people do it as a nice little top up for their retirement

pension and believe me, not all farmers can retire to a nest egg, many even

today, struggle in retirement, so they too are seen as having no requirement to

register. If you then make a case, ranging from top to bottom, you cannot make

a ruling for each separate establishment. So as it all stands now, it is as I

said before, how departments will recognise any regs they have in hand. What happens

in the Senat rulings, often will not filter down and many fonctionaires will

just go on what Granny told them anyway !!

If you want to register of course, no

problems but there can

be the rub, I have had a couple of new owners in the past ring me up to

say, that their C de Com wouldn’t subscribe them….c’est la France eh !!

They did register

in the end but what possesses someone to say one cannot do so………………….???

 I’ll say it again, the more you say, can sometimes work against

you. Watch the French and how they often approach a fonctionaire, not too much

info but sufficient enough to query their point and then if not happy, a row will

ensue but, etiquette may well reign, with smiles, ironic shrugs and raspberries

in abundance !

 As far as recent rulings and whether the influence of that

has made any difference, I would say no, it has been this way between the

varied associations for as long as I can remember. Not sure of two

organisations though ? G de Fr held out for a number of years against their

members and the disagreement of the grading systems between them and B&B

France. That really was stupid and something we never bothered to adhere to

anyway. The government would be fighting against the very ruling they created,

so it will be a tough one for them to challenge…Can you imagine the outcry from

the Agricole and other fraternities, if they changed any rulings that they themselves,

entered the association with !!

 Not sure of the

percentage of G de Fr members that do not register but it would be quite high

and as far as I am aware, I don’t have any exact figure of those that register

and those that don’t. As far as cleaning etc, it would eb a pretty strange place

that didn’t offer breakfast (but do remember, with G de Fr, it is obligatory to

offer breakfast but  the cost is never mentioned as it is in the price of

the room (something else that had to make it different to an hotel) A guest in

the real sense, would always be given a breakfast to help them on their way and

that, at the end of the day is what a French B&B is actually meant to be about.

Taxe de Séjour is very much alive and well all over France. It

simply depends on whether the independent commune feel it is worth the time and

trouble to collect it. It will be very common in all regions, especially the

tourist areas.

I do believe that interesting times are ahead as

more and more folks may well take up a B&B to supplement their

pensions and of course others, including foreigners open B&B's an

income as well, the other associations will again appeal as to the

competition they face.