Richard J. Posted August 10, 2007 Share Posted August 10, 2007 After a good lunch in a Paris restaurant this week, I was surprised to notice afterwards that the bill said "service non compris". I had understood for some years that service was included by law, in Paris if not in the whole of France. I certainly didn't see anything on the menu to indicate that prices were exclusive of service. Could a restaurant owner please clarify the legal position? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wendy Posted August 11, 2007 Share Posted August 11, 2007 Yes, but what were the prices you paid?. Was it through the nose? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny Posted August 14, 2007 Share Posted August 14, 2007 Hello Richard J, Unlike Wen I am not a restaurant owner but I did find these on line and it might be slightly more useful than her response-Tips, known as Service, are usually included in the listed prices or automatically added to your total. For example, Service 15% or Service Compris 15% means 15% has already been added into the listed prices. Service Non-Compris 15% means that 15% will be added to your total. It is customary to leave a small tip in addition to this added service charge, maybe a Euro per person or couple, but not nearly the amount one would leave in the States.orTIPPING IN FRANCE : Almost all restaurant include tax and a 15%service charge (service compris) in their prices. If a meal or service has been particularly good, leaving another 1.50€ (or 2-3%) is customary, as is leaving the waiter the small change from your bill if you pay in cash. If service is not included (service non compris) a 15% tip is appropriate Which seems to imply to me that yes, you pay the 15 percent on top of the written total, as expected, and a little bit extra if you want to. Legally, I don't know where you stand if you don't wish to pay the 15 percent, so maybe someone in the know can help you out with that one. Janeps I'm not implying you are from the USA, it's just an example I found on the web. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LEO Posted August 14, 2007 Share Posted August 14, 2007 [quote user="Jane and Danny"]Hello Richard J, Unlike Wen I am not a restaurant owner but I did find these on line and it might be slightly more useful than her response-Tips, known as Service, are usually included in the listed prices or automatically added to your total. For example, Service 15% or Service Compris 15% means 15% has already been added into the listed prices. Service Non-Compris 15% means that 15% will be added to your total. It is customary to leave a small tip in addition to this added service charge, maybe a Euro per person or couple, but not nearly the amount one would leave in the States.orTIPPING IN FRANCE : Almost all restaurant include tax and a 15%service charge (service compris) in their prices. If a meal or service has been particularly good, leaving another 1.50€ (or 2-3%) is customary, as is leaving the waiter the small change from your bill if you pay in cash. If service is not included (service non compris) a 15% tip is appropriate Which seems to imply to me that yes, you pay the 15 percent on top of the written total, as expected, and a little bit extra if you want to. Legally, I don't know where you stand if you don't wish to pay the 15 percent, so maybe someone in the know can help you out with that one. Janeps I'm not implying you are from the USA, it's just an example I found on the web. [/quote]Hi Jane,at least you have made an effort to answer the O.P.Kind regards,Leo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beryl Posted August 15, 2007 Share Posted August 15, 2007 According the brilliant moneysavingexpert site, in the UK if a service charge has been included and the service then turns out to be less than satisfactory, you are within your rights to withold 10 -15 percent. It does unfortunately add that the restaurant staff may threaten to call the police however[Www] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard J. Posted August 16, 2007 Author Share Posted August 16, 2007 [quote user="wen"]Yes, but what were the prices you paid?. Was it through the nose?[/quote]Not sure what that has to do with it. The bill came to 77€ for lunch for the two of us, good value for the quality of food, wine and service. I glanced at the total, saw that it was as expected, and paid by Carte Bleue in the usual way, leaving a small cash tip. It was only after we had walked back home that I saw that the bill said "service non compris" underneath the line that said "Total 77.00 €".I'm aware of what is "usual", but I wanted a definitive view on the legal situation. The Time Out guide Paris:Eating & Drinking says "Prices on restaurant menus must by law include a 12-15 per cent service charge". Is that right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clair Posted August 16, 2007 Share Posted August 16, 2007 The definitive answer?Le pourboire Le pourboire est une certaine somme d'argent remise par le client à titre de récompense à une travailleur salarié. Même s'il reste traditionnel dans certains corps de métiers (garçons de café, ouvreuse de cinéma, pompiste …), il est toujours facultatif et laissé à l'appréciation du client. Aucune profession ne peut l'exiger.Le service Le service est un pourcentage perçu sur l'addition ou le prix. Il doit être inclus obligatoirement dans le montant de la note ou de la facture. Les prix affichés doivent être ceux à payer effectivement par le client (donc service inclus). Dans les restaurants ou débits de boissons où il est perçu un service, tous les documents (tarifs, menus...) doivent comporter la mention : " prix service compris ", suivie du pourcentage appliqué. Direction départementale de la concurrence,De la consommation et de la répression des fraudes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard J. Posted August 17, 2007 Author Share Posted August 17, 2007 [quote user="Clair"]Le service ... doit être inclus obligatoirement dans le montant de la note ou de la facture. ... Dans les restaurants ou débits de boissons où il est perçu un service, tous les documents (tarifs, menus...) doivent comporter la mention : " prix service compris ", suivie du pourcentage appliqué. [/quote]Thanks, Clair. That seems clear enough. I can only assume that there was some finger trouble at the till which produced the offending "service non compris" on the bill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maureen Posted August 20, 2007 Share Posted August 20, 2007 As a general rule of thumb, if you take a "menu", the service is always included. ( TTC ). If you eat à la carte, service is not included, and left to your discretion. Nobody 'tells' me what I must leave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oscar Posted April 27, 2008 Share Posted April 27, 2008 [quote user="maureen"]As a general rule of thumb, if you take a "menu", the service is always included. ( TTC ). If you eat à la carte, service is not included, and left to your discretion. Nobody 'tells' me what I must leave.[/quote]I agree with you Maureen, it really p***es me off when I'm told that I WILL pay 12-15% service charge.. nevertheless I inevitably leave a tip in addition (in cash) because I have never been convinced when the service is included and therefore paid, often by credit card, that the waiter or waitress gets the money destined for them.I've never known a restaurant where they have been offended by being left a tip as well as the service charge though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cassis Posted April 28, 2008 Share Posted April 28, 2008 If there is a service charge then since 1987 all displayed prices for drinks and food to be consumed on the premises (regardless of whether menu or à la carte) are required by law to include that charge and to state the rate at which it is charged. http://www.legifrance.gouv.fr/ It is not optional whether you pay service charge - it is a charge for use of the premises, chairs, tables, couverts, etc.). Not the same as a tip, of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mayday Posted April 29, 2008 Share Posted April 29, 2008 Hi cassisare you, perhaps,confusing 'service charge' and 'cover charge' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cassis Posted April 29, 2008 Share Posted April 29, 2008 There's never a separate "cover charge" as far as I'm aware - it's all wrapped in the term "service". I know that in Swiss French "service" in a restaurant also equates to"couverts" in France, i.e. the cutlery and plates. Some time ago I asked a number of French guests and neighbours about "service compris" and tips. What I've said above just summarises what they told me and what is written in the legal reference I mentioned. A few quotes from the people I interviewed:"Pour notre part mon mari et moi, nous laissonsun pourboire quand nous mangeons dans un restaurant amélioré. Quand nous voyons qu'il ya des élèves, desjeunes employés - nous savons qu'ils travaillent beaucoup et sont malpayés!. Nous laissons 1 ou 2 euros(j'aimerai laisser plus, mais.....!). Quand je suis dans un bar je ne laisse pas depourboire pour une simple tasse de café.""Oui, il faut payer le service, c'est obligatoire, c'est dans les prix, mais on peut laisser un pourboire aussi.""En effet le service est toujours compris, mais c'est une habitudede laisser quelques pièces au serveur. Ce n'est pas une obligation, moi mème sile serveur n'est pas sympa ou si j'ai trop attendu je ne laisse rien, sinon jelaisse une pièce. Combien? C'est personnel, par exemple, 0.20€ pour deux cafés ou 1€ pour un repas." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrCanary Posted April 30, 2008 Share Posted April 30, 2008 I've often wondered how the figure of 15% was arrived at? My wife and I ate two meals in Paris last weekend that each came to over 100 euros, so, for me, I consider 15% to be far too much. In fact, I never tip more than 10% anywhere, however good the food. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian Posted May 10, 2008 Share Posted May 10, 2008 I find it a little uncomfortable watching people get flustered with tipping. How much, when, to whom etc etcMy tip?I always try to tip, discreetly and in advance of a meal with a kindly word along the lines that we are confident that we shall be receiving great service. It rarely backfires - and if it does I just complain and usually get something knocked off the bill.It often works brilliantly! Try it next time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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