Arrêt de travail - how does the system work ?

[Laura]

Hi everyone, I thought I'd better ask this before it happens to me one day...

I am a little confused about what one is supposed to do when you wake up one morning and discover that you're too ill to go in to work. I've worked for various different companies here in France and luckily I haven't been ill yet, but whenever I've had colleagues who've been absent due to illness, everyone talks about them being on "arrêt de travail". I understand that this is a piece of paper you get from the doctor who decides how long you're allowed to stay off work for, and that you have to give one page to your employer, send one page to the Sécu and keep the other page for yourself etc... but....

Surely if you wake up in the morning and are too ill to get out of bed and drag yourself to work, then you're too ill to get out of bed and drag yourself to the doctor's surgery to obtain this wretched piece of paper...? I just don't get it.

When I came into work this morning and discovered that one of my colleagues was ill and wouldn't be coming in to work, my other colleague said "il est malade jusqu'à quand?"... I thought, "what a bizarre question, one never knows how long they're going to be ill for! It's not exactly predictable..." It turns out that what she meant was "il est en arrêt jusqu'à quand?" (nobody knew the answer to this, but that's not my point)

So what it the procedure actually? Surely in order for the doctor to let you have days off work, he has to see that you're actually ill (and not just faking it) before he gives you the piece of paper. So it's no use dragging yourself down the doctor's surgery afterwards, once you're starting to feel a bit better. What if you're at home feeling really sick or you just can't move? Leaving the house would be the last thing on my mind.

In one of my previous jobs, one of my colleagues who'd just come back to work after a couple of days off ill was getting a right telling-off from the boss as he didn't have the right bit of paper. I overheard the boss yelling at him, "Ca, c'est pas un arrêt de travail! Je ne veux pas de ça! Si t'es malade, tu vas chez le médecin!" Oh dear... so it seems it's incredibly important to have the form in your hands when you come back... so what exactly does one do?

I spent a few years working in England before coming to live in France (I am 25) and whenever I was ill I just phoned work and told them I wasn't coming in. Simple. No forms involved and certainly no doctors, because normally one is expected to feel a bit better the next day and it's just not worth the hassle of going to see the doctor for something that'll probably go away on its own.

So anybody who has had experience of this, your answers would be very welcome!

Laura

[Clair]

If you are unable to go to the doctor's, you can ask for a home visit.

Details on arrêt de maladie here: http://vosdroits.service-public.fr/particuliers/... assurance maladie

Details on sickness pay: http://vosdroits.service-public.fr/particuliers/.... Principales formalités avec l'assurance maladie

[Clair]

I forgot:

Details on authorised outing hours: http://www.service-public.fr/actualites/00624.html

[Chancer]

[quote user="SkiingSista73"]

Hi everyone, I thought I'd better ask this before it happens to me one day...

I spent a few years working in England before coming to live in France (I am 25) and whenever I was ill I just phoned work and told them I wasn't coming in. Simple. No forms involved and certainly no doctors, because normally one is expected to feel a bit better the next day and it's just not worth the hassle of going to see the doctor for something that'll probably go away on its own.

So anybody who has had experience of this, your answers would be very welcome!

Laura

[/quote]

Hi Laura

Throwing a sicky (short term hangover type) is thankfully not yet part of the French culture, as to your question - what to do?, follow the advice shouted at your colleague by your ex boss.

[Lou]

I agree with JR about the abuse of the system if you just fancy a day off...... but surely this system in France must cost the state an absolute fortune if everyone has to go to the doctor for a note just for a bad cold/stomach bug which will go away by itself in 24 hours? (mind you I know everyone goes to the doctors anyway for the slightest sniffle)

I wonder if there are stats somewhere which show that the French take less time off work than the British (for example) and could you say it was because of this system?

Lou

[Danny]

Hi,

It might state what is required in your contract (my current one does, but my old one doesn't mention it). I think as a general rule, if you go into work and get 'sent' home or go home because you feel ill, this will be written off (depending on the leniency of your boss that is). If you don't make it into work at all, normally something written is required. My contract says, roughly translated: "You must contact your employer immediately concerning any absence following illness or accident. A medical certificate must be provided within 48 hours. In the case where prolonged sick leave is envisaged, a medical certificate justifying this must be produced within the same time frame".

My guess is that the bosses have to produce the paper themselves, otherwise they themselves aren't covered.

I have found that getting a certificate from a UK doctor was like getting blood from a stone. Here, my local doctor offers them even if I haven't asked - I get the impression it's pretty much the norm here (as is prescribing half the chemist's stock for a bad head cold!!).

Jane

[Georgina]

Next time you want a day off, call a strike - that seems to be what most do, safety in numbers.[:)]